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FCP Poker Forum > Poker Strategy Forum > Short Handed Texas Hold'em
mikeysong
Villain is 25.2/17.24/1.99

Ok so my thought process here is to call down at first but then when the K hit on the turn, I figure I can raise and fold to a 3bet as my line is very strong. When he just calls, I figure I can value bet the river.

Perhaps I am getting too greedy w/this line. I really don't know, thoughts?

Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $10/$20
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is Button with
UTG raises, 2 folds, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (9.5SB, 3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, BB folds, UTG raises, Hero calls.

Turn: (6.75BB, 2 players)
UTG bets, Hero raises, UTG calls.

River: (10.75BB, 2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets, UTG raises, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: 1BB returned to UTG.

Results:
Final pot: 12.75BB
SCS
I play preflop and flop the same.

I call the turn and check behind on the river. I don't think a bet here has much value. If you had just called on the turn I think villian would bet the river, but since you raised the turn villian can check the river knowing that you may bet and he can get a checkraise in.
Moneyball16
Id play it the same. I think we have enough equity to raise the turn and when he just calls seems like an easy value bet on the river.
CoranMoran
I don't get it.

Why are we raising this turn?
What does it gain us?

Yes, the 2nd King on the turn decreases the chances that Villain has Top Pair.
So there is a very strong chance we are still ahead.
But I still don't think a raise is wise.

Because if Villain has a lesser hand (2nd pair, bluff), all we likely do is get him to fold.
Do we really believe he will call down 2 more big bets with less than Top Pair after we have shown such continued strength?

So if our turn raise is getting all worse hands to fold, where is the value?

Point: Be careful in situations in which a bet/raise will only fold worse hands and only be called by better ones.
I think this is one of those times.

--CM
Moneyball16
QUOTE (CoranMoran @ Monday, May 21st, 2007, 11:13 AM) *
I don't get it.

Why are we raising this turn?
What does it gain us?

Yes, the 2nd King on the turn decreases the chances that Villain has Top Pair.
So there is a very strong chance we are still ahead.
But I still don't think a raise is wise.

Because if Villain has a lesser hand (2nd pair, bluff), all we likely do is get him to fold.
Do we really believe he will call down 2 more big bets with less than Top Pair after we have shown such continued strength?

So if our turn raise is getting all worse hands to fold, where is the value?

Point: Be careful in situations in which a bet/raise will only fold worse hands and only be called by better ones.
I think this is one of those times.

--CM


People dont fold anything in LHE. Id expect to get paid off by a 9 almost everytime and alot of other worse hands.
mikeysong
QUOTE (Moneyball16 @ Monday, May 21st, 2007, 11:43 AM) *
People dont fold anything in LHE. Id expect to get paid off by a 9 almost everytime and alot of other worse hands.
CoranMoran
QUOTE (Moneyball16 @ Monday, May 21st, 2007, 11:43 AM) *
People dont fold anything in LHE.


That's a bold broad statement.
Surely it has its limits.

This is 10/20, not 1/2.

--cm
Zach6668
QUOTE (CoranMoran @ Monday, May 21st, 2007, 5:42 PM) *
That's a bold broad statement.
Surely it has its limits.

This is 10/20, not 1/2.

--cm

FYI, the higher the limits, the more showdown oriented it tends to be, since everyone always thinks everyone else is making a move, etc, even moreso as it gets more and more shorthanded. At least in my observations and what I hear from those who have played significantly higher than me.
mikeysong
i'm aggressive enough to pull this move off w/trip kings and get paid off by a pair
antistuff
thats a really weird move by villain. why wouldn't he go to three on the turn with a king?

i guess im asking if his play makes sense. what could he have and what might he be thinking?
Zach6668
QUOTE (antistuff @ Thursday, May 24th, 2007, 4:50 AM) *
thats a really weird move by villain. why wouldn't he go to three on the turn with a king?

i guess im asking if his play makes sense. what could he have and what might he be thinking?

I know, it's weird, I almost want to spew just to see.

Thing is, if he's a thinking opponent, he's got to assume Mikey is going to fire the river. From what I know about his posts in these forums, he never misses a v-bet, no matter how thin it may be. If the villain picked up on it, I like his line. If I were playing against Mike, and he didn't know anything about me, I'd probably play a king the same (if I was smart enough to think of it at the time, which I'm not).
mikeysong
i don't like his play w/a K at all unless he's going to assume I'll fire UI if I had an fd

otherwise he should've just charged me the max on the turn.

for really complicated reasons, he'd have to a have a sick reason to play his hand this way.
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