PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t150 (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FCP)

saw flop|saw showdown

BB (t1799)
UTG (t3405)
UTG+1 (t2965)
MP1 (t3408)
MP2 (t2845)
Hero (t3735)
CO (t1690)
Button (t1150)
SB (t1090)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 8 , 7 .
UTG calls t150, 3 folds, Hero calls t150, CO raises to t300, Button calls t300, 1 fold, BB calls t150, UTG calls t150, Hero calls t150.

Flop: (t1575) 5 , 4 , 6 (5 players)
BB bets t150, UTG calls t150, Hero raises to t450, CO raises to t1390, Button calls t850 (All-In), BB raises to t1499 (All-In), UTG raises to t3105 (All-In), Hero (pukes) then .... ?????


I currently hold the nut straight, but can get outdrawn by any of the following types of hands, higher flush draws, sets filling up, gutshots, two pair filling up, runner runner flush even. I may even be tying for this pot....

What the hell?????

Swear to you, craziest hand I've ever been involved in that wasn't a freeroll on stars.

Pushes the all-in button & goes off to find a hand towel to wipe the vomit up so he doesn't have to see the turn & river.... and sits back down to either a "busto" message or a huge chip stack.

Is this a joke?

If this particular hand doesn't get you a little hard, poker is not for you.

if there are higher flush draws, you hold 2 of their outs. the only gutshots that hit you either beat or tie and have a flush redraw to beat them, and i really really doubt runner runner flush is hanging around.
the only hands im worried about are two pair and sets. and not even two pair as they only have 4 outs (and with all the action i could probably discount a lot of those)
so the only real thing im worried about here are sets. and as i said, with all the action i would guess they have a lot fewer outs than they think.

also, the fact that this is a turbo makes it an even easier call. you dont have much time and you have to get chips fast. you cant fold the nuts with a flush redraw because you might get outrdawn. you cant anyway, but the fact that its a turbo makes it an even easier call.

Just a hypothetical. If there's no FD out, then you're like 73%.

Like seriously though, this post has to be a joke.

You hold the nuts, your aim is to get all your money in while ahead, if you fold this hand then you shouldn't be playin hold'em.

In PLO this would be a fold.

In NLHE this is an instacall every day of the week and twice on thursdays.

Merry Christmas

You flopped the nuts.
You have redraws to the flush.
You have redraws to the straight flush.

These are what we call "good hands" in poker.
When we have good hands, we put OUR chips in, too.

Actually OP holds 3 of the flush draw outs. 5d completes the straight flush.

Push Push Push.

Someone hit a bad beat on you?

This would be a fold in PLO?

Meh. Probably not actually. Change it to 78o and it would be.

I'm guessing this was probably a combination of made straights (another 78 probably, 58), sets (66, 55, 44), flush draw(s), and the random idiot that thinks his slowplayed big pockets are actually good. Whatever the combination, you have an equity edge. Poker is gambling - you have to take edges like this to turn a profit.

I ask this because of the four all-ins ahead, because I do hold the current nuts, and because getting outdrawn on stars is standard.

And yes, somebody put a beat on me, actually twice. Once on the turn for about half the chips, and once on the river for the other half.... But I didn't actually post it because of the beat, I posted it because after the beat, I really had to wonder if this was the right move after the 4 all-ins. I still wonder, even after this discussion.

I know we're not supposed to post results, but I figure it's long enough after the discussion has been had.



Turn: (t11074) 2 (5 players, 4 all-in)

River: (t11074) 4 (5 players, 4 all-in)

Final Pot: t11074
Main Pot: t5825 (t5825), between BB, UTG, Hero, CO and Button. > Pot won by UTG (t5825).
Pot 2: t5249 (t5249), between BB, UTG, Hero and CO. > Pot won by UTG (t5249).


Results in white below:
BB has Jd Kd (flush, king high).
UTG has 6c 6h (full house, sixes full of fours).
Hero has 8d 7d (flush, eight high).
CO has 7h Js (one pair, fours).
Button has 6s As (two pair, sixes and fours).
Outcome: UTG wins t11074.

The thing is PokerStove says I'm still a dog to the other four hands as a whole: That is where I wonder if folding is right...

It's +EV.

Don't fold the nuts. Really. Don't.

EDIT: Did you just add the PokerStove results?

This is such a stupid thread.

You can't say you are a dog to the 4 as a whole. You can't be that naive, can you?

It's not like you're heads up and can only win 1x your money, you have a chance to win 4x your investment.

Stop being a weak tight vagina.

Seriously.

Ah, the mystical attachment to 50%.

50% is not special. The only time 50% could be important in poker is if there were no blinds. As soon as you have blinds, 50% becomes as important as 31.415926535897932384626%.

Simo, I think I see what you're saying about 50%, and it really comes down to this:
When I win, I make (approx) 3x my initial investment, so for it to be plus EV I need to be 33% to win, yes?
Which then makes this a fairly easy call, even though more times than not, I'm going to get outdrawn.


Zach, I wanted to have a serious discussion about this, because with 4 hands in ahead of me, the possibility of me getting outdrawn is very large. That's why I wanted to post this hand. I really don't think anybody is going to fold the nuts here. And yes, I made the post look weak/tight for a reason. I wanted to try to see this one from other angles, but apparently, that was a bad idea.

It's oddball situations like this that make you think about the math though. And that's really the big reason I posted it. We know it's correct to call 4 all-ins here, but I think it helps to illustrate WHY it is.

GODDAMMIT!

Na, was a fine idea.

I'm just trying out a new "tough love" thing to see if it works.

No.

You win 3x what you put in. Think of the following sequence:

-1
-1
-1
+3

You win 25% of the time and break even.

It's easy to think of it like this:

(it sorta assumes stacks are equal, or at least they all have you covered)

You get it in 4 handed, so you have the chance to win 3x your investment, since you're putting in 25% of the money, you'd need >25% equity to show a profit. This is where PokerStove comes in, and you can see if you have 25% equity or not. This type of thinking is why you make money raise/capping with flush draws in LHE, because you have 35% equity with 2 cards to come, so even vs two opponents, you're showing a profit.

youc can't be nice, then a jerk, or else people think you're picking on them, and/or are accusing them of being stupider than the dozens of others you were kind of nice too.

you've gotta be a jerk right from the beginning. sorry.