Agreed. That was a great show. Seems the guys who have something to fight for do, where as the guys with 6 figure contracts don't push as hard.

J-Roc's elbows from the bottom were incredibly scary. I cringed everytime he connected, but you have to wonder how much energy that took out of him.

I went and all I can say is wow! Had money on War Machine and Huerta, some exciting shit

I'm not sure how much money you had on Huerta, but how sick were you after the first two rounds?

What are everyone's thoughts on the WEC card Wednesday? Anyone think Curran can beat Faber?

Anyone see who the other coach for TUF7 is?

We had so much fun at this fight. I have been a huge fan of the UFC for a long time, but this was the first time that I wen live. Let me tell you, being there in person is so much different than seeing it on TV.

Kudos to JC, for getting us sick seats.

We had some good bets, and did well.

We won with Rude Boy, War Machine, and Huerta. Funny thing is, none of those were easy fights for us. We had to sweat each one. We kept using poker analogies. Like catching two outers, gutshots, etc. No fight was a lock.

Made a mistake with the Danzig fight. I honestly thought that Speer would train with Hughes before the fight............not on a farm. Such is life.

Great night at the Palms.

Dec 29th should be amazing!

This weekend was pretty awesome, K-1 GP and a great UFC show.

rampage. this could be the most hilarious tuf ever. those are two of the funniest guys in the whole sport. I'm giddy.

It's hard to imagine Rampage as a coach - will be interesting to see how he does. I picture him being more passive like Hughes - but I guess we'll find out. He is definitely a goofball with those faces he makes - gonna be an entertaining season.

Speer not going to train with a real camp showed an incredible lack of maturity on his part. He had a huge opportunity, and was effectively fighting a 155 pounder for a big UFC contract and a push against some top names. That would have paid off his family's farm debt I'm sure, but instead he chose to work on the farm and rely on his "farmboy strength" to try to beat an excellent technician with an insane amount of experience. Incredibly immature on Speer's part.

The UFC in December is probably the best one they've had in a lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng time. Bummed that Serra's off the card, but incredibly excited for Silva/Liddell and GSP/Hughes.

I figured it might be. I hope Rampage has at least one fight before TUF cuz he hasnt fought since early September. Glad to see Forrest get a shot though after stepping up and beating Rua quite handily.



If you dont mind me asking how much were tix for the TUF finnalle Steve or JC?

Dana gave Hughes a John Deere and Serra a pimped SUV

350+ 50 tax etc... Except that's what we paid for row Q tix we got upgraded to row E which might have been the best seats in the house, the dude that got us the seats made a mistake or something... those tix were probably 5 or 6...

BTW, was anyone pissed at watching the Barrera v Saunders fight? Steve and I bet on it getting big odds thinking he already almost knocked saunders out last time, and this time all he did was shoot like a pussy, I was soo pissed.

No - Barrera's a giant vag and doesn't have that fighter's spirit. The fact that he was punching Saunders in the foot last time while Saunders was half conscious on his back showed that he's not ever worth betting on.

Also - anyone not watching the WEC show tonight should try to find a replay somewhere. Or at least look for...whoever was in the second fight of the night on YouTube. The sickest suplex I've ever seen in an MMA fight - including Macias vs. Severn back in the day.

TY. My brother in law wants to go with me to Vegas with a UFC as are excuse. I would rather pay $500 for primo seats at a TUF finnalle or fight night then pay that for nosebleeds for a PPV event.

I found out today I could add VS and 8 other Sport Channels all for $5 more.

So, yeah, I watched the WEC event. Nice suplex.

Ryan Gracie is dead

...Im so excited...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coiK7tLEPiY


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuCe9EvxmiQ...feature=related

You going to be at the fight?

I haven't been this excited for a PPV in a LONNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNG time. Only thing that could make it better is if Serra was still in the Main.

Steve and I are planning on going, however I wont go unless I get sick seats otherwise I'd much rather be in my own place and watch the PPV in 60 inch high def ...bad seats in fighting events are not even worth it, it's not like bad seats in a soccer game or something, I once watched a Chavez fight from nosebleed and I had to watch the monitor because I couldn't even see the ring....

On another note, I already decided I'm joining this gym It looks soooo sick, and I'll probably be in pain for the whole year but it'll be worth it...

What, are you planning another trip to New Orleans?

Brag post



I didn't know Gray Maynard was coaching there - I wrestled him in high school. Definite badass...you'll be in serious pain the next day Add to that the hottest woman on the planet in Gina Carano and life is good.

I thought you were in LA so I was going to recommend http://www.legendsmma.com/ . The chance to train with Bas Rutten and Eddie Bravo is a hell of an opportunity.

Did I read this correctly? The cheapest membership is $100/month and gets you 2 days a week and you have to sign a year contract. Now that's an eye gouging topped off with a swift kick to the nuts. I guess with such limited facilities there is no way you could allow members to come more than twice a week.



I don't even know what to say about those rates.

Don't look at them as regular gyms - you're paying for some of the best trainers in the world to teach you. They're great for someone who wants to be competitive in MMA. I'm insanely jealous of JC right now.

(Disclaimer: I pay FAR less for my MMA gym membership, but I've taken a handful of lessons at Legends and it's just an incredible experience. If I had that kind of money or wanted to fight even semi-professionally it would absolutely be worth it.)

So, here's the deal. Me, JC and Adam (Vick12) got sick seats to the UFC on the 29th. Obviously the tickets were not cheap, but they should be well worth it.

Part of the fun in going to an event like this is having some action on the fights. Most of these are tough fights to wager on..........that's where you guys come in.

I consider myself fairly knowledgeble about MMA. I've been following for a long time now. But I am having difficulty with some of these fights.

The UFC home page has all fights on the card listed.

Please take a look at each fight and give your thoughts on winner and loser. NOT just the two main events. Plenty of money in the other fights as well.

JC, myself and Adam will figure out a way to see who helped us the most in the decision making process when it comes time to bet.

The person who proved to be most influential will get a one hour training session in poker from each of us. Obviously cash games from me, tourneys from JC and Adam.

I haven't spoken to JC and Adam about this, but I am confident they will go along.

If for any reason they don't, I will take the questions that you have regarding tourney play and have Ted Forrest answer them and relay it back to you. But for right now, it's me, JC and Adam.

Lets do this.

Card for UFC 79: Nemesis

Matt Hughes vs George St-Pierre
Chuck Lidell vs Wanderlei Silva
Lyoto Machida vs Rameau Sokoudjou
Rich Clementi vs Melvin Juillard
Sao Palelei vs Eddie Sanchez
Luis Cane vs James Irvin
Nate Mohr vs Manny Gamburyan
Jordan Radev vs Dean Lister
Roan Carneiro vs Tony Desouza
Mark Bocek vs Doug Evans

All I can find online is the lines for the 2 ME's and the lines are crucial for MMA betting. Anyone have a better site than sportsbook or pinnacle. Oh and you 3 have a blast. That is my one sports fan goal right now is to go and have decent seats to a big time UFC event in Vegas.

The lines change right up until the fight, so for right now, that's not as important.

I guess we could do something like joe smith = big favorite. That might help.

But because the lines change, we will have to factor all of that in at the last minute.

lol, so I provided jack shit last night


you guys still have my thoughts I hope. I still say try your best to arbitrage the hughes/GSP fight. that one is begging for an arbitrage if you can bet hughes now and be able to bet GSP up until an hour before the PPV

I just bet 500 on Hughes at +160 on bodog so 500 to win 800...I might get someone else to place another $500 bet before the line changes....I will then bet more/less if the when the line changes, I really think I could end up seing hughes at even money or -105 and GSP being at -105 or Even money, I think I'd bet big on him either way...and I probably won't bet GSP at anything -120 getting hughes at +160 is decent value imo.

I've already pretty much made up my mind on Betting Chuck, but I'm going to wait that out till the day of the fight and try to get Silva in the + or Chuck for that matter ( I doubt chuck will ever be +120 but I can see that happening for silva once all the fish start betting big)

as far as the other fights go I'm probably betting the big dogs, I'm pretty confident in my UFC betting strategy at this point, I usually don't lose but I don't always win big, so I'll agree to Steve's terms only if someone can give me well educated picks (with some sort of source or explanation for your opinion) for the more unkown matches, the undercards, I really think that's where the money is at after betting all the undercard fights in the Rampage Lidell fight, like putting up $200 on Houston at +400 ...

Spider's Late Night MMA Picks:

Matt Hughes vs George St-Pierre - This fight's too close to call, so I like the bet on Hughes as a heavy favorite. St. Pierre killed Hughes dead in their last fight, but he was having the fight of his life and Hughes was having the worst fight of his life.

Last Fights: St. Pierre looked great against Josh Koscheck, but I don't think he would win a rematch. Koscheck was absolutely shocked that someone would try to take him down, and probably hasn't spent more than ten minutes training on his takedown defense in a lonnnnnnnnnnnnnng time. Hughes beat a very much underrated Chris Lytle in his last fight in a three round decision.

Intangibles: These favor Hughes HEAVILY. He wants this fight BAD for a couple reasons. First, he talked about on The Ultimate Fighter how he only plans on a few more fights. He has to be hungry for a championship to boost his paycheck and finish off his legacy in a positive way. Second, he really wants to kill Matt Serra dead. St. Pierre was at the top of the world, unbeatable, and then lost a huge upset to Matt Serra. Mentally I think he has to be a bit shocked - think Chuck Liddell after his loss to Rampage, Wanderlei after his loss to Cro Cop.

Again, real tough fight to pick, I have Hughes as a slight favorite, so him being the betting line underdog is a real solid bet.


Chuck Liddell vs Wanderlei Silva - Right now BetUS has Liddell at even money, Silva at -130. I think the smart money is on Liddell for a couple big reasons.

Top of that list - PRIDE guys have looked like absolute shit in the UFC. The lack of drug testing in Japan certainly helped the PRIDE fighters look a lot stronger, and PRIDE was booked very much like a pro wrestling organization. PRIDE did a great job of protecting their stars, giving them favorable matchups, and generally getting the outcomes they wanted without having to work fights.

Also, Silva has looked like absolute shit since Cro Cop killed him dead. He also hasn't fought in almost a year, has some fairly severe ring rust, and wasn't that good in his last two fights. He's also lost three of his last five...with one of the wins by split decision.

Liddell on the other hand is hungry, and realizes that if he loses this fight his career is over. Liddell should be a huge favorite in this one - I'd bet on him.


Lyoto Machida vs Rameau Sokoudjou - Sokoudjou and it's not even close. Right now he's even money, and I would be the farm on him.

Machida is generally not a dangerous fighter at all, with 7 of his 11 wins being by decision. On the other hand, Sokoudjou is one of the scariest ****ers not named Anderson Silva on the planet right now. He brutally knocked out Ricardo Arona (something Wanderlei couldn't do in two tries), and lil Nog (something Rua couldn't do) in scary fashion. He trains with Team Quest, and is a nationally ranked judoka.

Also - Sokoudjou's being groomed as the new star of the 205 decision. He's a scary, scary man, and Dana White wants him to take over as the champion for Rampage in a year or two. On the other hand he's shown no real interest in Machida, putting him up against 205 nobodies like Sam Hoger, David Heath, and Kazuhiro Nakamura.

Check out his fight videos at http://www.sokoudjou.com/

I see no reason to think Machida would want to do anything but stand with Sokoudjou, and he will get killed dead if he tries. This should be your biggest money play of the night.


Rich Clementi vs Melvin Guillard - Melvin Guillard stinks, Rich Clementi's not much better. I'd bet on Clementi only because Guillard really stinks...Clementi won his last fight, Guillard got tapped in 27 seconds in his last one. If you have to bet, pick Clementi...I personally would use this as a chance to go to the restroom.

Sao Palelei vs Eddie Sanchez - I don't know anything about Sao Palelei, but he won his last fight in a five second knockout. On the other hand, Dana White probably had to offer his first born to Eddie Sanchez to get him to step in to the ring and get his head kicked off by Cro Cop (or GnPed to death...but still). Sherdog says Palelei has 35 pounds on Sanchez, but I remember him looking small next to Cro Cop (who's not a big guy himself). Again...not super confident in this one, I'd probably bet Palelei because the ignorant money will go on Sanchez because people saw him win his last UFC fight. Not sure who the favorite is, but the +EV move seems to be Palelei.

Luis Cane vs James Irvin - Irvin has the UFC experience, I've never heard of Luis Cane but he's been very successful in the smaller shows. Irvin probably wins, but not often enough to justify the betting lines that will undoubtedly heavily favor him. I probably put my money on Cane here.

Nate Mohr vs Manny Gamburyan - Manny Gamburyan is a badass submission fighter, Nate Mohr has four losses, all by submission. Manny trains with Gokor and his cousin Karo Pariysian, Nate Mohr trains with Jeff Curran (the dude who just got pwned by Urijah Faber on the WEC show). This is actually the undercard/dark match I'm most confident in. Bet on Manny.

Jordan Radev vs Dean Lister - two ground fighters, Radev's on the Bulgarian Olympic Team, Dean Lister's an ADCC champ. Radev seems to be getting a push, while Lister's a career journeyman. Radev has won five of his fights by decision and has never been submitted. Dean Lister couldn't submit Nate Marquardt, Ricardo Arona, or some guy named Yuki Sasaki.

This is a test fight for Radev, Lister's just an opponent. Bet on Radev, especially as an underdog.

Roan Carneiro vs Tony Desouza - neither one of these guys is very impressive, and this won't be shown on television for a reason. Bet on Carneiro just because the UFC seems to think he's a better fighter and DeSouza has a stupid beard.

Mark Bocek vs Doug Evans - Doug Evans appears to be the king of the Alaskan Fighting Championship, with his only UFC appearance being what I think is the SI Cover getting killed dead by Roger Huerta. UFC's giving him another chance to show he belongs.

On the other hand Mark Bocek has some good experience in the KOTC, and lost to a reasonably impressive Frank Edgar. I'd probably bet on Bocek here...he's got more big show experience, and his record lists him as a badass submission guy.

--------------------------------------------------------------


The key to betting UFC fights is asking yourself "What does Dana White want here?" He's fairly good at making matchups that get him the outcome he wants, but still produce competitive fights. Look at the Chuck Liddell/Randy Couture trilogy for a great example.

Liddell loses, needs a redemption fight, so who does Dana White book him against? Good ol' Vernon "Tiger" White - one of the few men in professional fighting dumb enough to try to stand up and trade punches with Chuck Liddell in 2004. Chuck not surprisingly knocks him out, the peasants rejoice, we get Couture/Liddell II.

Couture loses the rematch, and now needs a redemption fight so they need to find someone who will grapple with him and not be smart enough to try to outbox Randy. So they feed him journeyman grappler Mike van Arsdale. He wins in a great grappling war, Randy goes on to lose the third match in the trilogy. Dana White makes a shitload of money on all these shows, and life is good.

When in doubt, bet on the outcome that makes more money for Dana White in the future. He can't work the fights, but he can certainly try to set them up in a way that favors the outcome he wants.

Fish will bet for Chuck - internet smarks will bet for Silva.

The fish are right, but they don't know why.

I'm not a baller like JC, but I'm going to put my money on Liddell and Sokoudjou.

<3

You'll probably win whatever the contest was, I like your picks, like your reasoning.... It seems to me I'll bet big on Soko if he's even money or a dog, which seems possible from what I've seen and read from the fans. (even money right now on bodog, hopefully he'll be at + at Mandalay.)

For the rest of the fights I think I'll go with most of your picks/huge dogs...I like most debuts because they're usually posted as ridic underdogs when they're really even money or better. Hopefully there's some newcomers in the cards....

About the Dana thing, that's one of my reasons I want to bet chuck, I really think that dana knows that chuck sells tickets and PPV like no one else, I think he's talked to chuck and knows that chuck is refocused and capable. At the same time I've seen silva beat the piss out of rampage so that scares me a little. I think any even money or Dog is worth betting in this fight so I'll wait it out, like I said earlier.

yea it isn't like a regular gym, pretty much you're paying 100 a month for 2 MMA classes a week which I think is worth it, but I'm obv going for the unlimited access to try to make it out there every day or at least 4 times a week. I get the feeling I'm going to be too sore and regret not getting the 2 times a week deal though .

Great advice here. I disagree with the Hughes vs. St. Pierre fight.

I can't for the life of me envision Matt Hughes beating St Pierre. You have to remember that St. Pierre and BJ Penn are very evenly matched. And the only reason that BJ lost to Hughes was because he gassed. The only reason that St. Pierre lost to Hughes was because he was nervous.

I hope and pray that Matt convinces the general public to bet on him. If I can get anything from -190 and below for St. Pierre, I think it's a solid bet.

Your advice was great Keith, and much appreciated. I just decided to take this one pretty seriously and wanted to get some more opinions.

there's some real unknown quantities on this card and to be honest, I really wouldn't bet every fight. The liddell/silva fight just doesn't offer good enough odds to be either one IMO. Both fighters have looked bad in recent fights and are on the downside of their career, but, silva hasn't looked as useless as chuck has, still though, the lines that you guys were giving me I just wouldn't touch them, that's a fight where vegas and betting houses are gonna make bank because both sides will be bet huge and at the -105 lines, they won't have to pay out that big. I'll take a look at Pinny and Bodog's lines tonight and post something more substantial up and just write down the fights I'd want to bet

When in doubt always bet on the home team.

Dana also invested a lot of time and energy in making Chuck the face of the UFC. For a while Chuck was the one doing all the interviews and media appearances, and still is apparently (he was on Dennis Miller's horrible horrible show after the WEC show last week). Dana has to be kicking himself that he couldn't get this fight booked a year ago when he originally tried...probably cost him 100,000 buys or so. Reminds me of Belfort vs. Ortiz from a few years ago.



I disagree on the MMath - I think Hughes is a better fighter than BJ. I don't remember their first fight too well, but I seem to remember Hughes threw a high kick, slipped, and BJ took advantage of it. No way BJ out-grapples Hughes under normal circumstances.

It's going to be a great fight - I'm not super confident in Hughes, but I wouldn't bet on St. Pierre as the favorite. I think Hughes is at least even money here, especially considering that if he loses this fight he pretty much retires. My high school tennis coach used to divide people into two categories - tennis players and athletes. Tennis players were technically strong, good shots, strong serve, all that good stuff. Athletes wanted to win and figured out a way to do it.

George St. Pierre is a MMArtist, Matt Hughes is an athlete. I'd be afraid to bet against the athlete.

All that being said Steve's probably right and I'll have to retract this whole post in a couple weeks

If you all don't subscribe to the Wrestling Observer, you should. There's a bunch of pro wrestling analysis you won't care about, but no one understands MMA and the business better than Dave Meltzer.

couple things on the Machida-Sokoudjou bout: Machida isn't flashy, but he is undefeated and has beaten some impressive foes in the past:

Ryoto Machida
Name: Ryoto Machida
NickName: Lyoto
Pro Record: 11-0-0
Height: 6' 1"
Weight: 215
Affiliation: Inoki
Home Country: Japan
Send Additional Profile Information
* Record is calculated based upon the fights in our database. The format is Win/Lose/Draw. Fights resulting in No Contest (NC) are not included in this total.


Professional Fight Record

Result Opponent Method Time Round Event Date Comment Video Available Pictures
Win Kengo Watanabe Decision (Unanimous Decision) 5:00 3 New Japan Pro Wrestling: Ultimate Crush 5/2/2003
Win Stephan Bonnar TKO (Doctor Stoppage) 0:00 1 Jungle Fight 1 9/13/2003
Win Rich Franklin TKO (Punches) 1:03 2 Inoki Bom-Ba-Ye 2003 12/31/2003
Win Michael McDonald Submission (Guillotine Choke) 0:00 1 K-1: Beast 2004 3/14/2004
Win Sam Greco Decision (Split Decision) 0:00 K-1: MMA Championship Romanex 5/22/2004
Win BJ Penn Decision (Unanimous Decision) 5:00 3 K-1: Hero's 3/26/2005
Win Dimitri Wanderley TKO (Referee Stoppage from a Cut) 3:24 3 Jungle Fight 6 4/29/2006
Win Vernon White Decision (Unanimous Decision) 5:00 3 World Fighting Alliance 4: King of the Streets 7/22/2006
Win Sam Hoger Decision (Unanimous Decision) 5:00 3 Ultimate Fighting Championship 67: All or Nothing 2/3/2007
Win David Heath Decision (Unanimous Decision) 5:00 3 Ultimate Fighting Championship 70: Nations Collide 4/21/2007
Win Kazuhiro Nakamura Decision (Unanimous Decision) 5:00 3 Ultimate Fighting Championship 76: Knock-Out 9/22/2007 30-27, 30-27, 30-27,


Soko's recent 2 huge victories were very short and of knockout variety, he does look like a beast but this will not be an easy fight by any stretch.

Betting Hughes for value is a good deal imho, that fight should be right around pick'em.
I'm back and forth on Liddell-Silva, want to bet Silva, but not if I'm laying juice -- will wait til close to fight time
Good luck and yes I'm jealous, would love to attend one of these someday

I would take McDonald off that list - tapping out a kickboxer doesn't really impress me. I think the reason Sokoudjou is a huge favorite here is because of the recent fights.


Not being able to finish any of these guys doesn't impress me at all. Everyone else on the planet has been able to finish off Vernon White, why couldn't Machida?

Meanwhile, Sokoudjou is training with Henderson and Team Quest, and finished his last two fights against top level competition decisively. And I still fall back on "Dana doesn't put him in the ring against Machida if he thinks Machida has a chance."



QFT on both of these...insanely jealous of all of you who will be there.

So Spider...whatchawannaknowboutmtt's?

=)

For real....great read. I am still a newb in my knowledge compared to others, so reading what people have to say who know a TON more than me always is insightful.

I am super-amped for this card. The Silva-Liddell fight has me especially excited because no matter who wins...someone is getting knocked the phuck out!!!

Shirley you can't be serious. I won't argue your point of Hughes being a better fighter although I think it is close, but no way is Hughes a better grappler than BJ. BJ may not have the power of Hughes, but his skills outweigh that. See: Tommy Spears vs Mac Danzig.



FYP, but I am not arguing BJ has the endurance of John Holmes.

I do agree with you about the matchup though. The only doubt I have is that GSP is least somewhat cocky coming off his destruction of Hughes and that shows by taking this fight on short notice. I still do not see how Hughes wins this one. GSP seems to fight at his opponents level so he will def be up for this one.

I think the Machida/Sokomachine fight will be a lot closer than all of you think. Machida is not an exciting fighter, but he is definitely in the top 10 of intelligent fighters. His style could very well stall Soko. There was a reason Pride fights had more action and I really wish the UFC would adopt the yellow/red card philosophy.

Unfortunately I think Manny will open has a monstrous favorite, but he is the only lock I see on this card. Until I see Manny lose legitimately I would bet him every time. Anyone that is that active is going to be near impossible to manage. His nickname should be mini-Sherk.

I would bet Clementi heavy at anything -170 or better. Guillard struggles badly against mixed/submission fighters and Clementi has 13 submission victories. Guillard will have a bit of ring rust with only 2 fights in the last 18 months and only a little over 6 minutes of action in those two combined.

Chuck/Silva is pretty scary. They both have looked like crap in their last two fights. I take Chuck solely based on his UFC experience, especially if he is the dog. He has managed to stay out of the headlines lately so I will give him the benefit of the doubt and assume that means he is taking this one pretty seriously.


I <3 Dave Meltzer. Dood really knows his stuff.

Well, the only folks I see paying that at a gym are guys who are going to see if they could make it in the MMA game and supa ballas like yourself. I guess I could see paying $12.50/class, but I am used to getting my ass kicked for free.

I've been to a lot of gyms while traveling, but I think I have the best deal around at $50/month for this place: http://www.lifetimefitness.com/clubs/index...on=virtual_tour
Back row at the yoga and pilates classes are ungodly good. It's kind of like playing Royal Holdem while everyone else is playing regular holdem. No way you can lose. Soccer moms are so much easier on the eyes than the standard ladies you see at the gyms somewhere like Vegas or LA.

I think I probably underrated BJ, but I classify Hughes as a better grappler than BJ kind of like I'd classify Fedor as a better grappler than Big Nog. Nog has far better technical grappling, but he can't submit Fedor. I'd put Hughes and BJ in the same world - Hughes takes him down, gets top position, and is too tough to be submitted. (Again, ignoring the first fight where Hughes slipped).

While BJ's better than Danzig, Matt Hughes is FAR more skilled than Tommy Spears. I think Hughes outpoints BJ 9/10 times.



Definitely - regular access to Dana White doesn't hurt either I forget if it was during the SEG days or early Zuffa, but they used to bring Dave in to the shows and have him explain UFC to celebrities in the audience. Nice work if you can get it.

Edit: I love talking about this stuff with good people - too many MMA boards (see: Sherdog) are filled with kids who want to scream, yell, and flame each other and debate how much the Graciez Rool~!!!!!!111one

i've subscribed to WON since 01

Is this not the worst PPV yet as far as names go?

The full fight card for UFC 80 (Jan 14th PPV at 3PM EST) includes:

* B.J. Penn vs. Joe Stevenson (for interim lightweight title) (should be a good one, but I don't see BJ losing this one)
* Gabriel Gonzaga vs. Fabricio Werdum (will be interesting to see how Gonzaga rebounds)
* Marcus Davis vs. Jess Liaudin (I will be betting Davis super heavy if he is -170 or better)
* Kendall Grove vs. Jorge Rivera (tailor made opponent for Kendall)
* Jason Lambert vs. Wilson Gouveia (this could be a war and I like Gouveia)
* Antoni Hardonk vs. Colin Robinson (don't know anything about Robinson other than he fought 4 times in 6 weeks earlier this year)
* Paul Kelly vs. Paul Taylor (I like Paul Taylor...has fought way better comp and done well)
* James Lee vs. Alessio Sakara (Sakara is overrated and fighting a 205'er who has 10 subs in 13 wins)
* Per Eklund vs. Sam Stout (pray noobs bet Stout because they have heard of him and bet the house on Eklund)

Why are they doing another PPV so soon after?

I totally agree on there being a TON of money in the Grove vs. Rivera fight, especially if Jorge is the betting favorite like I think he will be.

Who are the people that gamble on PPVs - "smart" internet fans, or Vegas action junkies?