Is Brock generally left out of this... or will it burn him vs. Randy?

Agree that Vinny's bjj is amazing and will take him places. He's also tall for his weight class - his longer reach will prevent him from getting hit against a lot of guys. That poor dude last night didn't know what to do in the cage.

Mir seems alright, I'm no more or less of a fan of him than I was, but Nog seems like a genuinely good guy who cares about those kids and wants to bring them along.

Well, I was talking more in regards to the show than the rest of his career. I agree with your thoughts about being well rounded though, I just don't think that that many guys on this season are well rounded. I kinda feel that as each season go by the UFC starts scraping closer and closer to the bottom of the barrell for talented fighters.

Good point. Would we rather see half as many fighters and some kind of point system or round robin type tournament?

Well, I don't want them to change the format of the show, it's just a shame that there isn't and endless talent pool of fighters.

I would like to see them do something like season 4 again with established fighters. Maybe have 2 weightclass with fighters who are known but havent gone over the hump. Give the 2 winners guaranteed title shots. LHW and LW seem like the most likely candidates to to the depth of those divisions.

Anyone happen to catch the Gomi shocker? I thought he did enough to win rounds 1 and 3, but the judges did not agree. People seem to think Gomi is all that and a bag of chips, but he hasn't done anything impressive in quite a while. Not sure he would be in the top 6 or 7 in the UFC.

UFC veteran Jorge Santiago had another impressive win in the 4 man MW tourney as well. I think the UFC should give him another shot as he is on an impressive run and gawd knows the UFC needs talent at 185.

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f2/leben-fai...ug-test-869995/

I remember someone in here suggesting Leben had been doing steroids. GG.

good call

He will be back. I think Dana doesnt give a shit about steroid use.

Yeah, he signed Lesnar for one thing.

Who has never tested positive for steriods through. (In no way am I saying he hasn't used them I have a pretty big belief that 99% of pro athletes do or have used them) I just find it odd that in todays age people still automatically point to the "big" guy when the subject comes up. Lesnar has always been a massive man but lets not forget the Gracie's and Sherk's of the world who have tested positive in the not so distant past.

He looked ALOT bigger when he was in wrestling:

Before:



After:

There's no doubt that he used roids when in the WWE. The main difference between size then and now is he actually has to make weight at 265. He was 300+ while in the WWE. Most weigh in pictures show the fighters after cutting. He does come into the fights a bit bigger than that. He's still ridiculously huge.

Kick ass WEC card tomorrow.


Urijah Faber vs. Mike Thomas Brown
Paulo Filho vs. Chael Sonnen
Jens Pulver vs. Leonard Garcia
Jake Rosholt vs. Nissen Osterneck
Rob McCullough vs. Donald Cerrone
David Avellan vs. Aaron Simpson
Jose Aldo vs. Jonathan Brookins
Carmelo Marrero vs. Steve Steinbeiss
Danny Castillo vs. Rafael Dias
Rani Yahya vs. Yoshiro Maeda

The top 5 fights all have the potential to be barn burners.

Yeah, I'm not a huge fan of WEC, but the card is very good. I hope Filho comes out looking like the Filho and all this rehab stuff has ended the peak of his career.

Oh without a doubt. He's still an absolute freaking bohemoth. It's just that the main reason I suggested he juiced is because he was clearly much larger and defined during his time in the WWE.

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt as long as he passes drug tests but it is pretty disappointing that these guys like Sherk, Franca and now Leben are testing positive for this crap.

Of all of the roid users, Franca along with Gracie have been the biggest shockers to me.

But ya, until Lesnar's test come dirty, he's clean.

I subscribe to the innocent-until-tested-guilty way of thinking as well. The one thing that bothers me, though, is the way a lot of atheletes answer the question about steroid use. Lesnar was on E:60 a week or two ago, and the reporter started leading into the steroid question because of his past WWE days, and Lesnar freaked and walked off the set. They finally calmed him down a bit and the only thing he'd say is "have I ever failed a test?". That isn't a denial, it's answering a question with a question. Granted, there will always be the Rafael Palmeiros that will just lie to your face about it, but if I was one of them and I knew for a fact that I had never used PED's, I would be adamant about stating that fact if I were ever questioned about it. I really don't understand why a lot of atheletes get upset at the question and refuse to answer it with any sort of certainty. To me, if an athelete refuses to deny the rumor, it is probably about 80% more likely that he/she has used PEDs than if they just flat out denied it.

Well in his case, he's been answering this question forever, even dating back to his NCAA days. I'd imagine it get's quite tiresome. How many times do you have to say the same thing before people quit asking the same questions? The reporters should know what response they'll get.

I hope Randy humiliates him on the 15th.

In a lot of ways answering that question if you have done steroids is a no win situation.

I agree that the WEC feels a little minor league-ish compared to their bigger brother, but they consistently put on outstanding fights. I usually get more excited about WEC cards than I do for most Fight Nights on Spike.

Yeah, I get that too. The thing is, I've never heard Lesnar actually answer that question. I admit he may have answered it definitively 100 times and I just haven't seen it, though.

Agreed...if they have done steroids. However, if you have not done them and have no intention of doing them, I'm not seeing what the downside of answering the question definitively is.

I can understand if an athelete keeps getting questioned over and over about steroids, that they'd eventually get sick of dealing with it and start to give out "eff you" type responses. But I think the main reason that some of them have to keep fielding the question is because they never do give a straight answer.

I can't take full credit for this. my friend owen was part of the deciding factor on it. Needless to say, I'm not surprised as Leban looked a bit too gassed up and he's never looked likethat before

that's after cutting. I've watched lesnar since he was wrestling at minnesota, and he's always had a sick body that is a gift of genetics. Granted he probably juiced a bit when in the fed, but nowhere near the amount as many other wrestlers as his body looks more like a winstrol body rather then a stanzonal body. What that means is that he used the more "lean" roids that help more with injury recovery rather then pure bulk



he's always been ridiculously huge. I have no doubt that he cuts around 15-20 lbs for the weigh ins and did that in college. he's a genetic freak regardless of roids. Now I will say that I've always been a lesnar mark whether he was wrestling at minnesota, wrestling in OVW, Wreslting in WWf(E), Wrestling in NJPW, or fighting. so, yes there is a massive bias on my end IRT Lesnar




exactly. he's never tested positive whever he's gone. Now, we may question how stringent the testing policies were at the places he was at, but the proof remains in the pudding so far





I'll put up 100 on stars that says that lesnar dispatches couture. Randy's age is playing against him, and Lesnar easily could've been a olympic freestyle or greco roman wrestler if he so choose. It wasn't going to happen at the time as WCW, WWF, and NJPW all offered him big time contracts(with both NJPW and WCW offering him the top belt within 5 months of his arrival which means a massive cut on house %s), so with the money talking, he wasn't going to be an olympian

I think WEC is a great event, I wouldn't mind fighting in it! Seen some terrific fights and some WEC events have been a lot better than a couple of the recent UFC events.

Thanks for the reminder that it's on.

Denis Kang has been added to the UFC roster. Weeeeeeeee. Perhaps somebody to challenge Anderson Silva?

I hope they treat him like they treated Anderson when he first started with the UFC, one gatekeeper fight and then a title shot. Also, WEC is folding their MW and LHW divisions after tonight, and are bringing some of the fighters into the UFC. There's not many that'll be able to hang, but Filho will hopefully get a title shot against Anderson if he wins tonight and then wins maybe one or two fights in the UFC.

Edit: I just saw that Filho missed weight for tonight by 7(!!!!) pounds. He probably shoudln't count on anymore Zuffa paychecks.

Filho has been a huge disappointment since pride. What a letdown.

filho and silva are team mates, so it may be a while before they fight each other. Dennis Kang is a great addition to the MW division. It looks like finally there is a bit of depth to the MW division now

http://www.mmabay.co.uk/Story%20FilhowarnsSonnen.html
I find it interesting Filho was fined 25% of his purse compared to the normal 10-15% from what I've seen. Also, it says if Filho loses he will present the defunct belt to Sonnen even though it isn't a title fight, that'd be nice to see.
And just found out my dorm doesn't get VS and I'm sick as a dog... guess I'm going without tonight.

A few thoughts on WEC.

Rosholt didn't look near as good as what's been written about him lately. His main defensive manuver is blocking punches with his face. I'm assuming he's getting moved to the UFC after this fight, and they had better start him off very slowly.

Filho either needs to get his head straight or retire. He looked completely out of it and I don't think fighting is good for his mental or physical health at this point. I think it's safe to say his career with Zuffa is officially over for the time being after his performance tonight.

It might be time for Pulver to consider retirement. He's not young anymore, and he's even older in ring years. He can't sprawl and brawl these younger, faster, stronger guys and expect to just catch them with one shot anymore.

Faber has been putting himself in waaay too many bad positions lately, and was overdue to get caught. I love watching that guy fight, but he needs to get back to walking through people by taking them down and beating on them instead of trying to out-Bruce Lee them.

Overall, a couple sweet knockouts, but other than that a very lackluster night.

lol... get him paulo

So much for WEC PPV?

Also, am I the only one upset that Catone/Sadollah is on the card over Hazelett and Mcrory? That is a jits match that I would love to pay to see... and Sadollah is not intriguing to me yet. Could it be the UFC anticipating the new audience Lesnar will bring and not wanting to expose them to such a ground fight?

Lesnar at even money? Check the line sir.

http://www.pinnaclesports.com/ContestCateg...Odds/Lines.aspx

I'd be willing to bet something small with you (like $20) if you give me Couture at a good price.

For future reference, if you download TVU Player and tune into the MMA channel they stream the UFC/WEC events live.

Didnt couture start out at -150? I bet the line moves even more closer to the fight in Lesnars favor.

Love the line on Wandy

Not sure, I didn't see it very early on. I can see why it might shift though.

All the TUF champs get on the main card there first fight out. I am actually excited to see how he does and how much he has improved with 5 mponths at Extreme Couture under his belt. His fights werwe way more entertaining than CB Dollaways and he is on the Main Card at 92 a way deeper card.

What if Stephenson beats Florian? Do you give him another title fight so soon after getting destroyed by BJ? This fight makes no sence to me. Maybe Forian/Diaz would have made more sence.

http://www.mmabay.co.uk/Story%20Sonnentore...etitleshot.html
does a Sonnen fight seem silly to anyone else? With five Anderson fights left, it seems odd to have one be Sonnen. Also, who else thinks the UFC is trying to screw up HW? Losing Wedum seems silly to me.

Yea that seems like a shitty fight with all the possibilites for Anderson fights. Probally part of a merge of the 2 organizations.


Anyone think Brock can go 5? I think he will have to if he is gonna beat Randy.

Old UFC All access Brock Lesnar:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDrAXYEOS6s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbeFz07nFPg

He does similar circuit training to Sherk, so he should have good cardio. I think he's going to come out fast in the first round and expend a lot of energy quickly though.

I'm sooooo pumped to go this one. It should be awesome. I'm actually really looking forward to the Joe Daddy/Florian fight.

I'm curious what people think regarding the card on the 15th.

In the past some people have posted results AFTER the fight.

Lets discuss who we think will win and why.

For right now lets just assume that everything is even money. Later I will post current lines.

Lesnar vs. Couture - Couture

A lot of people are putting a large emphasis on Brock's athleticism and wrestling pedigree. While I think Brock has potential, he hasn't had enough time to evolve into a complete mixed martial artist. He also doesn't have many professional fights and he tends to come out quickly and expend a lot of energy early in the fight. I suspect that Randy will outwork him in the later rounds.

I do think Brock has a very good shoot and at some point Brock will be able to get Randy down, but if you look at his top game in the Herring/Mir fights it seems under developed. It's unlikely he's going to finish Randy with hammer fists. We haven't seen Brock on his back yet, but I think at some point Randy will get him down, sweep or reverse him and wind up on top.

I suspect that if this happens Brock would have a very difficult time defending. Randy may end up submitting him from side control or at least attempting it to gain the mount.

If they clinch against the cage it's possible Brock will be able muscle Randy down, but Randy is going to make it difficult for him with takedown defense and dirty boxing.

On the feet Randy has the advantage. His striking is far more developed than Lesnar's and although Lesnar clearly has heavy hands he's most likely going to have a difficult time against couture.

My conclusion: I can see 3 ways that Randy can win this fight, but I can only see one way that Brock can. (Maybe 1 and a half).

The rest of my picks for the main card are just general inclinations: KenFlo, Sadollah, Gonzaga, Maia

I'm on Brock at the opening line so I don't mind, and to be honest, I don't know. I'm just glad to get Brock as +105 and we'll see what happens.

I like Florian if he's smart with it. He can't get upset at how he beat Huerta and feel pressure to finish. I think he's a good enough kickboxer to stay away and pick his shots including takedowns if he frustrates Stevenson enough. However, this line is bigger than the Huerta fight, and I don't see why, I think Stevenson is a much better fighter, so I'm staying away from this.

I like Maia and will bet him, just think his improvement is rapid as we saw with the brutal knees in his last fight, so Maia and Lesnar will be the only two I end up with money on.

I'm hoping to get money on Lesnar right before the fight. I think the lines may swing towards Couture closer to the fight. I actually think that Lesnar is going to win. Lesnar will just be too big for Randy and Randy hasn't fought in a long time. I don't think that Lesnar will stand long and will go for the takedown immediately. The only way Randy wins if it goes beyond 4 rounds.

I think Maia will beat Quarry quite easily, but it still could be interesting. The grappler usually comes out on top. If the line gets ridiculous, I might put money on Quarry.

Kenflo & Joe Daddy will be great. I think it will be a close decision with Kenflo coming out on top. With this one too, if the line gets in the +175 range for Joe Daddy, I think it's a good bet.

I feel that Lesnar is going to win. Lesnar is going to get him on the ground and ride on him, and I'm thinking it'll be Lesnar TKO in the 4th. If Randy gets taken down, I don't think he will be able sub him from his back. The only way I really see Randy winning is by clipping Lesnar with a punch and stunning him enough to take him down. I also think Randy only wins IF he gets Lesnar down and IF he takes his back, which I can't see happening that often with Lesnars wrestling. I probably see it differently than most, but I don't think Randy wants any part of Brock in the standup for very long, he doesn't want to end up on his back either, which really leaves him with two options....either taking Lesnar down and getting mount or his back (which is unlikely), or getting taken down by Lesnar and sweeping him (even more unlikely).

Also, there's a lot of talk about Lesnar's conditioning. I don't think it'll be an issue. Lesnar is used to crowds so the nerves won't sap him, and he went 3 pretty grueling rounds with Herring and looked pretty fresh at the end.

I think Florian/Stevenson is pretty close to a coin flip. Florian probably takes it though, by picking apart Joe on his feet and forcing him to take some risks to take it to the ground.

Hazelett is going to sub McCrory in the first 2 rounds. I think this one is going to the ground early, and should be a good BJJ fight, but Hazelett is just too good on the mat.

Quarry/Maia is tough, and even though I freaking love Maia, I think he's going to get caught and KO'd. If it goes to the ground Maia has a huge advantage, but Nate has really good takedown defense and I think he's generally underrated.

Sadollah out with leg infection. Mcrory/Hazelett to the main card

This makes me happy.