You are half way through a tournament and are one of the chip leaders. The blinds are 400-800 with a 100 ante and there are nine players at the table. Your stack is at 212,000. A player from MP raises to 2200 and he has a total of 34,000. You suspect that he is desperate and is just trying to steal the blinds.

The player next to the button has 41,000 in chips and calls the raise. You know this player, and know that he wouldn't smooth call here with a monster hand. If he had a strong hand he would re-raise pre-flop.

Now, you are on the button with Q-3 off suit. Up to this point you've re-raised only twice pre-flop all day, showing AA once and KK another time. What is the best play?

This is all about table image.

If you have spent all day cultivating a tight pre-flop image, there is no way you want to get called and show Q3, so you can't make it cheap to call, if you are going to play you have to raise big enough to make them fold.

With the read you have given it is clear that a $10,000 bet would most likely be un-callable by either player. If they have made it to the middle of the tournament with decent stacks they are not going to risk their tournament life on a marginal hand. The exception would be the limper, if he had a small to middle pair and put you on a squeeze play he might be willing to go all in here.

The issue here is that ever time you bluff you are "spending" your image. Make enough of these calls and you are no longer a pre-flop rock, so are you getting paid enough to use your image here. When I answered the poll I said fold, because as I glanced over the quiz I read 2 $2,200 bets = ~$4,000 it didn't seem to be the right price for the amount of image you were spending, but you are actually getting $6,500 once you add in the full price of the bets and the blinds and antes.

Pull this off 3 times, you have spent your image and gotten paid about $20,000, a nice low risk way to add 10% to your stack.

Just goes to show you should always post your reply before you vote.

Putting in a $10K raise will squeeze the initial raiser, because he will have to worry about the caller as well as you. Once you get by him the smooth caller will be inclined to feel that tangling with the big stack isn't the same as calling a short stack from position and should fold. If he re-raises then he changed gears and has Aces and you can release after the obligitory stall to pretend you had QQ.

The only problem of course is if one of the blinds wakes up with a hand, which is why an All in is a bad move, 10K will get the same results without risking a big hit from the last two players that have not even looked at their hands yet.


Me I would fold, why play such a weak hand and possibly ruin my table image should I get reraised.

LOL ... did Mike Matusow write this question?

I don't care about "ruining" my table image (I usually have a crazy one anyway - which I actually like with a deep stack like this), but there's just no reason to risk making a play here for a measly 6.5k, which is nothing compared to your stack. I'd actually like the reraise more if you had a stack between 15-20k, in which case if you raised you'd be going all in and relying on your tight image to help you get folds.

But even then there's no reason to risk it with this hand. Throw it in the muck and move onto the next hand. You can certainly find better spots than this.

Fold or raise 10K.

Q-3 blows for 10K, so Im folding.

play the players not the cards. raise to 10k.

I think its a choice between folding and raising to 10,000

Calling with a rubbish hand against 2 players seems ambitious as you would only be doing that to steal the pot later.

Raising to 5500 forces both players to call which bloats the pot and would make your anxious opponents feel more pot-commited in later streets.

Going all-in is committing too much to win too little and only helps you lose the maximum.



Folding risks nothing but is passing up on a potential opportunity.

Given the reads both players would struggle to call a raise to 10k so it might be possible to steal cheaply. The problem is we only know the likely strength of the players hands, not their likely reactions to a reraise. Put another way, we know our table image but do they? If they were good enough players then this option gets my vote, otherwise against calling stations folding seems best.

It would seem that the players might be reasonable to bluff against with a 2.5 BB preflop raise indicating some knowledge, and the cautious description given of the caller.

I'll go with raising to 10k

What? Why is he desperately trying to steal the blinds with over 40 BBs? I could see this if his stack was about 12-15k... but I don't think 34k is even close to desperation mode.

Everyone will hate this...but why not call in position? If you can't put either player on a worthy hand, you could very well be live against both, and people to take the pot down on the flop, regardless of whether you hit it or not. Spiking a Q could very well bust the shortstack.

On the surface, image or not, I don't see the point in risking 10k to win 6500, which amounts to increasing your stack by 3%.

However, typically speaking you want to win at least once per revolution simply to stay ahead of the blinds - even when your stack is huge - winning here takes care of three revolutions.


I don't think you risk ruining your image here - it IS a good squeeze situation and it's not like this exact scenario is gonna happen every time you're on the button...even if you make this play every time the opportunity presents itself you won't impact your image as a tight re-raiser....it could be 100 hands before a squeeze play scenario comes up again.

And, yeah, to the one poster who questioned why buddy is desperate with 34k, and almost 40 BB's - his M is only 16, and he is probably half the average stack....not necessarily dire straits, but not exactly comfortable - in 50 or 60 hands he WILL be very desperate. I can see someone with this type of stack making more plays, or at least loosening up considerably when first to act, just to keep ahead of the blinds.



A fold isn't wrong (many pros advocate playing extremely tight and taking less risks with a large stack - others advocate taking -ev chances with "meaningless" extra chips), but a bet has merit - and then it simply depends on the purpose of your bet and/or your goals for this particular hand.


If you want to steal, then 10k is a good-sized bet - it's big enough to scare all but the best of hands, so if you do get reraised you know you're dead AND you can get away from it, losing less than 5% of your stack - the two guys in question won't call that bet with drawing hands 'cause their stacksizes don't give them the implied odds. You essentially need to steal the pot 2/3 times for this to be profitable, and that is likely the case.


If you want to play, and maximize implied odds, the call or raise to 5k all but ensures that the raiser, the limper and the BB will play, and possibly the SB. You need to hit the flop hard, but you are in position, so, it's not bad to see what happens here.


I honestly think you can make a plausible argument for all options except the all-in - risk reward just doesn't add up.


Raise to 10k is likely the best play long-term....closely followed by a fold. Raising to 5k and calling aren't terrible either provided you know their purpose.

Provided you are disciplined enough to get away from of flop of Q74 when someone comes hard at you.

But doesn't "spending" your table image just leave you with a different table image? Can you not use whatever table image to your advantage given the right situation (which this quiz demonstrates in my opinion)? What if you find yourself with KK later on in the same situation (which is almost exactly what Harrington uses to explain the squeeze in Vol I if I recall correctly)? If indeed you read them to not be able to make that call, how can you not make the raise?

I certainly like the 10k raise in this situation too, especially if you have the read on both players and a tight table image.

My questions is though, how do you play this if you get a caller or a push from one of these? This is a problem I have when I commit myself to a pot like this. Do you fold not risking your chips, but more importantly your table image? If you fold this, or even if you call it, you'll lose that image....wouldn't you?

Depends on the context. It's probably a call if the shortack looks sick and then pushes the flop. If it goes bet/raise to you, we can fold. We can probably raise a check/bet to see where we are and get away from it if we take a lot of heat. We have greeeaaaat position though!

Raise to $10,000, thus sandwiching the original raiser, whom you thought was stealing. If he calls, the next guy almost immediately folds and you're heads up, but he will probably fold if you read him correctly. As you've also stated, the guy in the cutoff doesn't show much strength with a smooth call, so I'm not too worried about him calling your raise. My opinion is that $10,000 gets the job done and you scoop the pot right there. You use your sandwich against the Or.Raiser and your read against the caller.

It might make sense to reraise with suited connectors or a small pair (in case you get called), but Q3 is not even playable.....i say fold!

You do realise that this move has nothing (or at least very little) to do with our cards, right?

If I'm raising to 10k here I can do it with two Uno cards - that you have Q3 is irrelevent.

Anyone saying to consider calling here is WAY over thinking this. I think you guys are just trying to think out of the box and wouldn't actually do this, but if actually would in this situation ... you'd always be a welcome player in any game I play in.

Calling here with this hand would just be dumb ... no good small ball player, even those that play a ton of hands like Daniel, Hanson, Gavin Smith, etc. would ever call in this spot. Now with 98o that's a different matter ... and with a suited connector or small pair it'd be expected. But Q3o? That's just asking to give away chips. Raising seems unnecessarily risky to me, but calling is much moreso.




Actually, I completely agree with the other guy. The move would make a lot more sense with a hand that could take a flop like 76s. Your cards only don't matter if you don't get called, and these two players have 34k-41k between them. Your cards would matter less if you moved all in or if they were much shorter stacked, but even then a hand like Q3 is going to be dominated by every hand that calls you besides AK and possibly AJ-AT if they're nuts enough to call with those hands. A hand like 87s will only be dominated by higher pairs which are very unlikely. With a small pair you'd probably just want to call, but 76s in this very specific situation probably plays better with a reraise.

IF you're going to reraise here, I'd much rather raise to around 6.5k-7k. It looks more scary than the raise to 10k and gives you a much better value on your raise. It only needs to work about 50% of the time preflop, and that's not even considering that you still have a good chance to take the pot down postflop either by getting lucky and hitting the flop or continuing your representation of a big pair on a non-scary flop (just about any flop without an A in this case).

Also, personally, I get most of my strong reads post flop. I'd never be too certain that these players were that weak preflop, so that greatly adds to the risk factor involved. So I still stand by this not being a neccesary move at this point, since it won't add much to your stack and your chip position is extremely favorable. There's no need to take risks like this with a big stack.

And since the raise options given are either raising too small or too much, I'm positive Daniel's answer is going to be to fold here. I'm pretty sure Matusow would reraise to 10k here with these reads, but making this move just doesn't fit in with the small ball style of play at all.

Your cards don't matter because they are Q3. The only time you want to see a flop with Q3 is when you have psychic knowledge that the flop is coming 333 or when you are playing limit and trying to cultivate a loose table image.

And you can recast the problem all you want, but you were given reads in the problem, if you never going to play your read, play checkers. You don't have 76s or AA, you have a crappy unplayable pair of hole cards. So you play the players or you fold. It takes no imagination to fold Q3 and it is never a bad play, but this is the perfect set up for a squeeze play. Weak raise, Weak call, two stacks that can't afford to tangle with you, you have a tight image, the only reason not to try and pick them off is to protect your image. (or you don't trust your reads, now I may not trust my reads, I clearly don't trust your reads, but this is Daniel F*&$!@# Negreanu making the read, I'm gonna go with it.)

It is a low risk play to pick up $6,500 and make everyone at the table a little more nervous of the big stack.

making this move just doesn't fit in with the small ball style of play at all


Yes it does. You make a raise preflop to steal a mid-sized pot. It fits smallball perfectly.

Daniel himself says that he doesn't get strong (read: very reliable) preflop reads and is amazed at how John Juanda is able to. I'm primarily an internet player, so my reads mostly come from betting patterns, and the only thing you can somewhat figure out preflop from a standard raise and a call is a wide range of hands. There's no super specific reads possible from these results, and the post mentioned nothing about a strong physical read, just a general "feeling". This sounds more like a feeling that a player like Matusow or Juanda would act on, but not the type of feeling that a primarily postflop player should act on.

And by the way, I do usually go with my reads (sometimes too often, sometimes not enough), but I find its best to have a very strong read before I make an unnecessarily risky play, particularly with such a big stack. And for me, personally, I'm not able to get a strong enough read preflop from a standard raise and a call.

These types of thoughts go through my mind often at a poker table, but often the best conclusion often ends up being the obvious one and moving onto the next hand. Particularly in good structured events its important to not try to get too fancy and end up donking of chips when there's no need to make the move. If this question wasn't written by Matusow, maybe it was written for Matusow, as this is exactly the type of hand that can lead to a Matusow like blowup when the reads on one of the players is wrong or when one of the blinds wakes up with a monster.

No ... it really doesn't. Smallball players typically don't reraise with trash very often. They often get the image of a maniac because they play so many pots, but they actually are very careful to protect their stacks when they have big ones.

You don't want to get called, and you are making a raise to 10k because your reads and experience suggest that you won't....if both players fold 2/3 times (along with the blinds), you profit.

You are not going all-in because one of the blinds may still wake up with a monster....you are not calling or minraising because you don't want to play 4 players with q3o, even in position. (you can call/smallraise here, just know exactly why you're doing it)


ftr - if I had a had like 76s that is where I'd be inclined to make a smallish reraise, or call, from the button.


As far as me - in this scenario I can virtually flip a coin between raising to 10k or folding.

I don't hate a raise, but if you're going to raise, raising to 7k is way better than 10k.

Since that's not an option, I think folding is easily the best choice there is.

Fold or Raise to 10k. Both work. I would raise. Showing Q-3os would destroy your table image which isn't bad because switching gears to loose aggressive from tight passive would confuse players and players with no reads usally either fold big hands or call all the way with medium ones. Thats a good reason to raise.


Folding is a good idea too.....Q-3 is a garbage hand that is dominated by many many many hands that anyones could be raising.

Your table image isn't going to be ruined cos its unlikely that people will see your hand. A good number of times this will work and your opponents will both fold. There's no point having an image if you aren't going to use it. If we are facing a solid hand, we might face a call, but we'll still have position. If we are facing a monster (which are reads say is unlikely), we will know about it. Either they will re-raise (in which case we will be in a good position to fold) or we will again have position on the flop.

Raise 10K.

A fold is a legitimate move as well, but you can't let your stack erode. Although you are in a comfortable chip position, you should be playing to win.

This is sorta complex in my opinion.

The first player may well be trying to steal the blinds. Maybe.

But in order for the second person to just call I think he's got a big big hand here.

This is why.

He may not be worried about the first guy, but he has to worry about the action behind him, clearly he is not. I don't care what this guys image is. If he wanted to take this pot down he would make a bigger raise here to discourage the blinds from calling him down. I know you have to have a bigger hand to call than to raise so ....

My range on this guy would be something like this. Either he's got a big pair. AA, KK, QQ, or a big suited AKs AQs. The reason I don't think he has a limp hand like 8-7s is because he's not likely to have many opponates in the hand and he doesn't stand to make much if he flops a straight or the like. If two more people were in the hand I would give more credit for that type of holding.

Since I put him on this range of hands, and there are still more people to act behind me I'm folding here. Especially since Q-3 is definately not the hand I wanna go to battle with here. An overcall is all but suicidal here. And another thing to consider is if you wanna double up two short stacks with this sort of hand. Why give more chips to two small stacks? I want these two small stacks to fight it out and maybe one will knock the other out. You're up another position and even if one doubles up he's still well behind your stack, he still has to respect you.

I fold.

Thoughts?

This hand kind of reminds me of Dan Harrington's 2004 WSOP squeeze play. We all know how tight he is.

He noticed Arieh raising from every position with marginal starting hands. Raymer calls with A2 knowing this. So, dan took his 62 and reraised them big... and they both folded. So, if you're projecting that type of image I think it's ok to raise to $10,000 here since it will be respected and you know that the caller doesn't need a great hand to call his raise.

Also, your hand is garbage, if you had something like 87s where you would like to see a flop with I would prob just call, but since your hand is so bad, you're going to make this play with lesser hands than you're going to call with.

You can't call. Blinds are so small compared to your stack that you should play tight and everyone has seen that you do so. It's between folding and raising to 10k.

Folding would risk you nothing and it just proofs even more that you are playing very tight when someone else sees that you could have squeezed them out of the pot but you didn't. That would give you leverage to make even a better bluff later on against someone you would want to take chips away from.

Raising to 10k is always +EV and would show others that you are capable of doing so. Also helps you to get chips later when you do everything exactly like you did with that Q3 when you hit a monster. Someone raises and other player lims in and now you make the same move with AA. Someone in the pot who saw you make the move last time hears a bling in his head and reraises you and you have set you up for winning a huge pot or even bust someone out of the tournament.

You just need to go with your feeling. If you feel even a little bit afraid that you are going to get called, then fold. It helps you later on. Don't go gambling if you are not sure. If you know they will fold, go for it, as I said, it's +EV.

Btw. I'm not a pro. Just a man who thinks a lot and does the exact opposite just to see that I should have done exactly what I thought in the first place. It's just in my nature

you have an M of 100 and a trash hand...easy fold

with a better hand I would consider the squeeze play and raise 10K, but not with Q3o

I will start by saying that I have not yet viewed the answer to this question, but I do see that it has been posted, so even with the risk of sounding like a donkey, I will give my two cents.

I assume that because you added the point about you having a tight table image and a read that neither of the two players in the pot have a strong hand, your gut is telling you to make some kind of SICK play, which I am ok with.

The question now becomes - How SICK of a bet?

Some would argue that you should make a raise to between 8 and 12k, but I think this is the worst thing you could do... If you were right, and the preflop raiser was weak, that doesn't mean that he isn't still desperate to accumulate chips! With a raise like this, it looks like you are raising just enough to fold to another re-raise (which you are).

So... Raise enough to show that you wont fold to a raise (which you won't). You can raise to 27-30k, and if the preflop raiser moves in, it's an insta-call, if the preflop raiser folds and the initial caller moves in, it's an insta-call.

This play provides equity in a few different ways:

1. If both players fold, you win a sizeable pot with a weak hand.
2. If one player moves in and you call and lose - Good news - you only lost <20% of your stack, and "Tis Mearly a Flesh Wound!"
3. If both players move in, you can call and bust two for only 10k for a 100k+ pot
4. If you turn your cards over, the table will see that you have switched gears, and the next time you have a monster, it will be easier to be paid off!

I am interested to hear what you think!

Having shown serious hands that you reraised with preflop, your image must be pretty tight. A 10,000 bet is close to a third of their stacks and they cannot hurt you. The downside of this is that the table will tighten up since players will (correctly) realize that they need a better hand to enter a pot in the future. You will pick up the pot this time but the chances that someone will slowplay a monster or you will be called next time goes up because players will be entering with serous, defendable hands. That said, a tighter table also means you can shift to smaller raises and pick up blinds cheaper. If the 10,000 bet is the wrong answer, I will be fascinated to hear the rationale for a different course of play.

There is no real reason to be involved in this hand even if you think you have a good read, i would rather let the short stacks fight it out. To win tourneys you have to play basic solid poker and raise/calling with queen 3 doesnt make sense at all. Come on that question is an easy one for any pro.

Fold. Risking 10,000 to win about 5,800 is not worth it and is not going to make much difference in your chances of winning the tournament if it works.

I'm almost completly certain that the best play in this postition would be a big bet of 10,000. I can afford a raise like this and it would be extemely difficult for the other two players to make the call, as I have turned over KK and AA earlier in the day and a call off that size would get them pot committed pre flop on the short stack. If they call and I miss the flop completely, I mite try a continuation bet, but if they re-raise, I'll lay down my Queen 3. However, if I hit the flop , I would probably check raise either one or both off them all-in.

But that's just me, I could be wrong.

Q3 ??!! I just barfed on my bacon sandwich.

ill fold that for no raise

Where did the first 23 questions ans answers go ?

Follow this image:

Thanks Zach !

Since you established a tight image throughout the game,
you can seriously consider Raising to 10K.

If they're good players, they would have picked up the fact that you only raise with monsterhands
AA and KK's .. So why would they think now, you have something else.
If your 10K raise get's called by one of them, you know you're ****ed,
and fold.
by Raising you think outside the box that they put you in, and be a bigger surprise.
You don't give away anything and, still get the chips.

So I say.. Raise to 10K.

WOW,.. WOW,.. WOW,.. Why get involved in this in the first place? Man,.. you're sitting on a decent stack and you're going to get yourself involved with this garbage? Pleazzzz come and meet me on my table,.. I can always use some 'free chips'. I would think you'll be getting PLENTY of better oppurtunities than this for making a steal. Who cares if you've got 'good position' with Q-3o,.. if you even do spike the Queen on the flop you're giving yourself a GREAT chance to lose ALOT of chips to gain what in the beginning??? Damn,.. way better moves to be making than this unecessary one.
Say you get a call or worse, a push,.. then what??? You gonna lay down the hand and potentially lose your image then,.. lose the oppurtunity to make a steal when you've got at least something to fall back on if you need to play it out. This is just out and out garbage. I'm amazed at the stuff I'm reading here,.. seriously!!! what are your ROI's lookin' like right now? How's your ITM?? Maybe a good chance to look at your game and make some drastic adjustments to it.
GL I say,... you're gonna need it. I'll keep trying to rely on skill for now, thanks.

why get involved? ur chip leader dont risk your stack on a crap hand! you have no reason nor any money invested in the pot! lay it down and be patient

If the reading of Daniel is on the spot, re-raising could be a move. Very risky though since the original raiser could be desparate enough to go all in for a race.

My reading is not as good as Daniels so I would pick a better hand to play with.

Hello everyone....this is my first post!

Daniel has given you all the information you need to know to make the correct decision here....

First....Since you are familiar with the fellow sitting in position before the button who called the 2200....you know that he does not have a strong hand....a large bet by you will scare him away....

Second....Because you have raised twice pre flop earlier in the game and showed AA and KK both times....you should take advantage of this by putting up a sizeable bet that will not only scare away the fellow in positon before the button....but it will lead the rest of the players to believe that you are doing it AGAIN....raising pre flop with a monster hand....

To raise only to 5500 would be a mistake because it is too easy for the other chip leaders to make that call and it will NOT give you the information you are looking for....you need to find out just how strong your opponents hands are by raising 4 to 5 times the pot....

If you get re-raised....then it is time to fold the gay waiter....(Queen with a tray)

If you get called....then you better get a damn good looking flop....or just rely on your experience and ability to read the players at the table to decide how to procede....

ok i read like the first 5 of these and everyone is saying fold or reraise to 10k. i agree with it being a fold or raise situation in which i think it is a fold spot cause it just isnt worth it unless you're image is so tight that when you do come in with hand there is no way you are getting action which is hardly ever the case.

however, why 10k if pot is 6500 and the raise is 2200 i think 8700 gets the same respect as 10k and it saves you some chips if you are reraised. doesn't sound like alot when you have 220k but it could add up if you make a few of these plays that backfire. it also makes it easier to get away from if the shorter stack pushes. 10k looks like a bully raise to me and if i am the button i would be pushing a very wide range over that bet.

While I think the optimal play is to raise to 10K, my own style advocates a fold most of the time. I think the timing is pretty good here for thie re-raise to 10K, however.

I would stick with your current image as a tight player, especially if both players are mid range stacks and your a chip leader. Few players would risk more money unless they have a premium hand from a raise of 10K. If you fold, it does nothing, you stay stagnant, and one of these players might get stronger in the long run.

I would take a risk and raise it to 10K, simply for the fact that both players will likely fold their hands because of more psychological reasons; your a chip leader, you can afford an all in call, and you don't play marginal hands often.

I answer to this sceario I think fold is the option. Why get involved when your chip leader in a late position. You dont need to try a risky bluff here especially since they are likely to call the bluff anyway.

*waits fo rnext hand