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Moneyball16
PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FCP)

Button - fairly solid preflop, loved to slowplay everything postflop no matter what the conditions
CO - solid multitabler, one of the better players playing this limit
My image - losing pretty badly, probably pretty nitty. Not hitting any hands.

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with T icon_suit_diamond.gif , T icon_suit_spade.gif .
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 1 fold, CO calls, Button calls, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (11.33 SB) 9 icon_suit_diamond.gif , 9 icon_suit_heart.gif , 5 icon_suit_heart.gif (5 players)
UTG+1 checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero bets, CO raises, Button calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, Hero calls?

My plan here was to c/r any non-heart in which CO bet and button didnt raise. Good or Bad? Alternatives?
Head_Trauma
QUOTE (Moneyball16 @ Saturday, December 23rd, 2006, 12:01 AM) *
PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FCP)

Button - fairly solid preflop, loved to slowplay everything postflop no matter what the conditions
CO - solid multitabler, one of the better players playing this limit
My image - losing pretty badly, probably pretty nitty. Not hitting any hands.

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with T icon_suit_diamond.gif , T icon_suit_spade.gif .
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 1 fold, CO calls, Button calls, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (11.33 SB) 9 icon_suit_diamond.gif , 9 icon_suit_heart.gif , 5 icon_suit_heart.gif (5 players)
UTG+1 checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero bets, CO raises, Button calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, Hero calls?

My plan here was to c/r any non-heart in which CO bet and button didnt raise. Good or Bad? Alternatives?


I like just calling the flop. I think donk-betting the turn if it comes T or smaller is the best line. You will most likely only be raised by a hand that crushes you, in which case you can lay it down. Considering your read is that both players are fairly solid, it is tough to imagine either are on a 9. Betting the turn makes sure you make them pay if they are drawing to hearts, which almost surely one of them is. It just seems that you can find out the information you need by betting, rather than check-raising.
mikeysong
i like 3betting as it defines your hand and makes bet/folding a lot more acceptable (if someone hits a flush or does have trip 9s) on the turn/river
Actuary
I don't think there is enough value or info in a 3 bet to risk a cap.
we have to call a cap.
We could be againt 88 and a FD.

But solid players play J9s, T9s here in pos easily.

I'm calling flop and leading any non-heart turn.
I could fold if raised there.
mikeysong
??

U think 88 would cap there and raise the turn?


head_trauma

your plan isn't bad either, but I hope you have the discipline to fold to a 3bet. Also, you need a read on CO that he's aggressive enough to fire another bullet in a multiway pot if he only has an FD.
Actuary
QUOTE (mikeysong @ Saturday, December 23rd, 2006, 3:10 PM) *
??

U think 88 would cap there and raise the turn?


No, I think CO might have 88. But yeah, he wouldn't cap then.

But he could have 9Xs and Button have FD, and then it gets capped.

I combined too much in other post.
Moneyball16
My read during the hand was that CO could have alot of two pair/trips combinations, but was still ahead of him more than 50%. Im not sure If he would have played a fd like this. My real concern was button. After seing him slowplay so much before under many conditions(Draw heavy boards, headsup with betting lead) I figured he had either a 9 or a fullhouse or was on a flush draw.

Given this info I felt I could safely c/f any heart board and for all the non heart boards I felt the CO would bet and button would raise if he was slowplaying on the flop or call if he was on the fd. With this specific read would my line be best?
iggymcfly
Lots of contradictory information here. Mostly this:

QUOTE
CO - solid multitabler, one of the better players playing this limit
QUOTE
Im not sure If (CO) would have played a fd like this


This is an absolutely standard line for a FD. Is CO "solid" or is he weak/passive? If you really think he wouldn't play a flush draw like this, then it's an easy calldown. If you're not worried about CO taking a free card, then there's no reason to get more bets in here, and you do want to see a showdown. Also, if button's my definition of solid, I don't see him calling a C/R on the turn with two pair, so I don't really like that line either.

Against most opponents that play the way of your initial description though, I'd just 3-bet the flop and bet/fold the turn. If CO caps, I'd still bet/fold the turn, assuming that a FD's very likely, but that he won't raise without trips or better. If a heart falls after button just calling the 3-bet, I'd still bet/fold, since you'll just be up against two pair combinations a lot of the time and you want to get value there. If CO is tight and he caps on the flop, you can probably safely C/F a heart turn.
Moneyball16
Im not sure how he would play a fd just because I didnt have any notes saying what he did with them.
iggymcfly
Oh OK, thought you were implying that you didn't think he would play a FD this way. Against a standard solid opponent, I'd assume this is a FD a large amount of the time, and an even larger portion if he caps. Definitely the line from the second paragraph then: 3-bet flop, bet/fold turn unless it's capped and a heart comes off in which case turn becomes a check/fold.
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