Absolute Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $2/$4
9 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (9 players) Hero is BB with A T
7 folds, SB raises, Hero 3-bets, SB calls.

Flop: 8 5 8 (6SB, 2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, SB calls.

Turn: 8 (5BB, 2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

River: 4 (7BB, 2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

Results:
Final pot: 9BB

Anyone hate this?

Villain is 18/4/1.8 after 123 hands.

yes, i throw it away when SB decides to lead out the turn also,

If you're planning on looking him up, I probably raise the turn, and try to check back on the river.

But with the stupid line he's taking, this is probably just going to cost you another bet much of the time, because he's apt to lead again on the river.

I think your line is goot.

Wang

Well, the plan would be raise flop, bet turn, check river through UI. I didn't really have a plan on what to do if he led the turn or river. I figured there's no way that the 8 helped him at all, relatively. If he was behind, he's still behind. If he was ahead, he's still ahead. I kinda wanted to call him down based on the chance I have the best hand, and some info.

to gain some info, or for your own personal gain, i understand the calls.

but i think you're behind and the value of this hand/pot isnt worth it to me to call down 2 BB's on the turn and river

Royal,

You understand I only have to be ahead/hit one of my 7 outs 1 in 4.5 times here to be good to call down, right?

I'm getting 3.5-1 to call down, and that is IF HE BETS THE RIVER, which he doesn't always do.

So, I hit one of my outs 7/46 (15.2%), while I'm getting 3.5-1, meaning I'd have to win the pot 22.2% of the time. This means my hand only has to be good UI 7% of the time. I don't even think it's close anymore.

yea.

So do you feel strongly enough in this situation? I mean should we always rely on our pot odds in this situation? I can see where we [justify] a call, am i wrong to throw this away on the turn?
maybe this is why i dont play LHE

Even MORE tricky would be to smooth call the flop and raise the turn. I don't think we raise the flop b/c we really don't know where we are, and we're not folding him. He's more prone to call the flop/lead the turn than it might first seem; he'll do so having paired one of his cards, boating with his pckt pair, or thinking his A-high is goot, like you do. Flat calling the flop would make the turn raise even scarier.

If we do take my line and we get called and then checked to on the riv, do we check behind or bet again?

Yeah, that's probably why you don't play LHE. What else IS there to rely on? The weather??

Royal, I think it's less profitable to play merely using a calculator the whole time..you can actually use reads in LHE, which some people on this and other forums who still make money, do not do. The "read" should be about how often we're good so we can correctly calculate the odds.

Pot odds are very important though. They are in NL even more so, really.

Reads are math. Somebody disagree with me. Just do it, seriously, so I can flip out.

Board is Q994.

Villain has been betting the whole way, and we've been with him holding AQ.

Q falls on the river.

Villain promptly throws up on his cards. Scenes from the Excorcist come to your mind.

Math?

well the weather has been cold, will that affect our cards?
But i think with our raise on this flop and villain just calling, we lose some implied odds, so we really only have simple pot odds to go on here.


Maybe its because i have trouble looking at the large sample size aspect.

example, lets say calling 2 big bets is correct because of our pot odds and % of improvment makes it a neutral or positive play but our improvment % is very low, I would have normally leaned more towards letting those situations go. Although i played limit when i 1st started with my SSHE knowledge, then switched to NL, I do try to look at the long run +EV situations more

it could be a pp play but honestly

it looks more like a KQ type of hand than anything

you raised the flop and he still donks the turn. Donking in this situation screams more of a IHOPEYOUFOLD than a value bet, since a check-raise would be more likely to happen.

He's pushing you to fold so i call down

also,
I don't like raising the turn. You're rarely going to knock off PP or any other hand that beats you, calling down is better, especially since you can get an extra bet if you hit your A or 10.

Raising the turn is spewage imo. This is a blind steal situation and people love getting frisky here. Villain has made it clear that he is going to showdown by leading into pfr 2 times. With no fold equity this cannot be a value raise, because you are most likely behind. I would just call down.

BINGO.

Wow! Do you research these numbers? Or do you have them memorized?

You should be playing 30/60.

btw,

1. call bet on turn and fold river UI

2. raise turn and check river. Or fold to a 3 bet and a bet on the river if villain decides to lead.

Sarcasm?
-------

1. Na, not folding on the river if I call the turn.

2. Not raising when I can get to showdown for the same amount.

no, I'm serious. And I know for the fact I'm not the only one that has mentioned this to you.

I respect your game. Good thing you were one of the first ppl I met on FCP when I first started out.

gl!

Heh. Well, ty. I suck balls at BR/money management, even though I preach it day in, day out, lol, or I'd be playing higher than 1/2, 2/4 on a stake.

If you can't come up with those numbers in like 5 seconds, you don't even have any business playing 1/2

lol, this is true also. ISAMath, that's why I sensed sarcasm.

This seems like it has to be the worst possible plan for this hand.

I think his funky betting pattern is representing a pocket pair.
Whether he holds what he says he holds is a different story.

I call down.


--CM

1 I agree with, call/fold is pretty stupid

As for #2, if there is some chance he will fold it's worthwhile. Yes it costs you the same, but if there is a chance that he might fold a hand that beats yours, then it's worthwhile. If you think he can't fold a hand like 22 or 33, then go ahead and call down.

i agree wholeheartedly. i'd also say that if he's the kind of player that would 3bet a pp on the turn, i like a call down more too.

just to check, we're raising if we spike an A or 10, right?

If we're not, there's something seriously wrong with us.