i am 90% sure i played this perfectly, but discuss. at the very least, it's an interesting hand, IMHO:


i have everyone at the table stacked, most by a 2:1 margin, including the villain. blinds are still small, so it takes a few repottings to get players all in. this pot was never close to all in.


i have KQJ9 (doublesuited, spades and hearts) UTG+1.

i pot preflop. 2 folds, mp3 reraises pot, all fold, i call.

flop QKQ rainbow.

i check, he checks.

turn 2 offsuit.

i check, he checks.

river ace.

i check....

my plan is to call any bet on the river as played, since i showed so much weakness with such a strong hand, despite a fairly strong preflop read on the villain having AA (it would be 100% on AA if the player hadn't shown himself already to be competent and hadn't reacted so well to my being a LAGtard and raising lots of hands preflop--at this point he was one of two other players who had relative game at the table).

in any case, my thoughts were thus:

i am either way ahead or drawing basically dead on every street. he represented AA or MAYBE KK preflop and there's no low coming. if i play it weak, i can get a worse hand to bluff after i doublecheck and represent a2xx based on my action (every raise i had SHOWN DOWN at this point was a2bigbig or a2wheelx). i was going to bet out at any non-ace river, but i decided to check/call again because, again, a worse hand might take a stab, but i can't imagine that an ace can CALL a bet on that river since the straight filled up.

interesting? thoughts?

Yeah, looks like you played it well. Good analysis.

Yuk. I am with the 10% I'm afraid, but thanks for posting.

You fail build the pot when you are ahead and are proposing to put money in when you suspect you are behind.

I can excuse the flop check as a valid attempt to trap, but you have to bet the turn IMO.

He may even have had a Q in his hand and think he is trapping you. Make him pay.

If I found myself at the river without having bet then I would check/fold to any significant bet.

What's the point of developing reads if you don't act on them?

I am not sure about the PFR: I do like it as a deception play, but you also have a hand that can do well multi-way if it hits, so why scare off the mediocre lows and weaker broadway hands.

PFR is an absolute must. you can't raise only low hands in deepstacked O8 or you'll get crushed by good players capable of making reads in a 4-card game. this is the type of hand that plays well either HU (one low gets counterfeited more often than more-than-one) or very multiway, and in big tournaments multiway pots don't happen that often because lots of players are trying to nit their way to the $.

also, i was acting on reads the whole way. that's the whole point. certain hands in his range would likely act a certain way on every street.

if i pot the turn, i don't win any money from a worse hand unless he has AQ, and unless it's AAQx or AQ23 or something, nothing makes sense in his range after a preflop (possibly isolation) reraise. i can, however, induce a bluff after showing significant weakness on a non-low board. if the villain has shown himself to be a weaker player, then a doublecheck is a bad play, agreed, but he wasn't and had been known to take stabs at uncontested pots.

river A puts me in the same boat, except now he's definitely not holding a Q or he'd have bet the turn. same as with the turn, he's now got a hand that either won't call a big bet (except maybe AK, but even that would probably fire the turn), a hand that has me crushed (AAxx) that i don't want to bet into, or a hand that might bluff if i check to him. since i've shown so much weakness, and since the pot isn't huge relative to stack sizes, i've basically committed myself to calling a bet here. AA is no longer a VERY strong read, since i would imagine that hand would also bet the turn. there's also the possibility now that he was reraising an 8910J type hand to isolate and possibly got there on the river. if this is the case, he would probably call a medium sized bet on the end, but for that very reason would probably also bet if checked to. at this point, AA is likely enough that i can't repot, but i can certainly call a bet.

I really disagree with the PFR, but since you did (and called the reraise)...I fa shizzle don't wait to bet. #1) You should be happy to win a big pot right now. #2) You say that the villain is one of the few competent players at your table. If I were him, I'd expect you to Cbet / bluff at a scary board to see where you were at, and I'd probably mini-raise because I'd think you were full of ****. Yippie...push, because there it is very unlikely a "compentent" player would reraise PF with KK, obv unless he had A2KK or something like that. Since you don't have an A and everyone else folded, don't you put him on AAxx?

I hear you, but the fact that you are so OOP makes me very uncomfortable. You should be open limping to encourage others to enter the pot - or re raise, IMO. Your hand CAN be tough to play after the flop OOP, so you want to try to make it worth your while, especially while the tourney is still deepstacked.


You're kidding, right?

As Predator said: there is a reraised pot there for the taking on the flop & turn: take it down.

I agree with this to the extent that you can't only raise with A2 or AA, but raising OOP with KQJ9 is taking it a bit far IMO--the biggest danger is rev impl odds from making a K-high str or wrap to a K-high when your opponent has broadway or a B-way wrap. Examples, flop QTx, or KTx: they look good, but aren't when OOP. I think the hand has much more raising value in late position.

As for postflop, a line I like is to check(-call if necessary) the flop, and then lead the turn. If the flop checks through, villain may interpret a fast lead at the pot on the turn as an attempt to represent a Q and look you up. (In fact, this is a line I take pretty often with AAxx from villain's perspective on a paired-flop. Let flop check-through, call down.) If the guy bets at you on the flop, raising will rarely get you more than is in the pot, but a stop-and-go could arouse similar suspicion in your opponent.

BTW, as played I'd be willing to let this one go to a pot-sized bet on the end.



Guess I should've read the rest of the thread since Cham beat me to the punch w/ the OOP business.

Cham, it's interesting that you'd prefer a reraise to a raise though. Reraise sounds to me like a total disaster, same reasons just amplified

I would have bet the turn, but since you didn't I think your analysis is correct at the river and a check-call is good play because it minimises your losses should he have AA or KK and maximises your gains if he has nothing and bluffs at it.

This was a tourney right, and villain repotted preflop, right? Hero had over 2:1 chip lead over the rest, right?

Not trying to accumulate chips in a tourney is retarded. Only waiting for the nuts to win in a tourney is also fcking retarded.

Bet the flop, bet the turn, and bet the river. Save the fancy plays for the cash game.

Typo - meant to say "raise"