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benhoug
There were 3 of us to the flop. MP seemed straightforward, playing pairs and big cards. I had no read on Cutoff and I was on the button. I had been playing pretty laggy and had just gotten caught up in a big pot w/ MP where his QQ beat my 99. Like I said, I had been playing laggy.

MP = $228
CO = $77
Hero = $200

MP limps, folds to CO who also limps, I raise to $8 on button, both players make the call ($29 in pot)

Flop: A icon_suit_spade.gif K icon_suit_spade.gif 7 icon_suit_spade.gif

MP checks, CO checks I bet $14, MP makes it $45, CO movs in for $69 total and I moved in over the top for another $178, MP calls.

What does everybody have???
sprewell
QUOTE (benhoug @ Monday, September 4th, 2006, 9:48 AM) *
There were 3 of us to the flop. MP seemed straightforward, playing pairs and big cards. I had no read on Cutoff and I was on the button. I had been playing pretty laggy and had just gotten caught up in a big pot w/ MP where his QQ beat my 99. Like I said, I had been playing laggy.

MP = $228
CO = $77
Hero = $200

MP limps, folds to CO who also limps, I raise to $8 on button, both players make the call ($29 in pot)

Flop: A icon_suit_spade.gif K icon_suit_spade.gif 7 icon_suit_spade.gif

MP checks, CO checks I bet $14, MP makes it $45, CO movs in for $69 total and I moved in over the top for another $178, MP calls.

What does everybody have???


CO has three of a kind sevens
MP has AK and HERO has the flush ?
Zach6668
Not enough information.

MP range includes a ton, including 77, two spades, A7, K7, etc...

Same with CO.

I say hero has AA, KK, AK, but I don't like the way you played it, if you have that. QTs, QJs are possible, or even other suited connecters if you play that way.

- Zach
Naismith
I'm going to say three flushes since these "guess the hands" things always turn out to be something wacky.
simo_8ball
Posting the results would really help with the guessing.

Anyway, here's my thoughts:

The potential range for all 3 is the following:

77
low flush
mid flush
high flush
AK
KK
AA

Let's look individually.

MP -
1) Limps in. This gets rid of AA,KK,AK.
2) Check-Raises large on the flop, and calls 2 large allins after reraises. I think this gets rid of 77.

Conclusion: He has a flush, and it is almost certainly a large one. JT/QJ/QT.

CO -
1) Limps in. This gets rid of AA,KK,AK.
2) Checks behind on the flop. I don't think 77 is likely here. This is backed up by the fact that after a bet and a large reraise he pushed allin, knowing he is getting called.

Conclusion: He has a flush. 8s9s or 5s6s.

You -
1) Were playing LAG. This makes all hands possible.
2) You bet $14 on the flop. This makes all hands possible.
3) After a big checkraise on the flop and a reraise allin from the CO, you push for $178. This has to eliminate a low/mid flush.

You are harder to pinpoint. This could be a set, or this could be the nuts. I think you bet more on the flop with a set, so I think you have a high flush, either Q high or J high.

My 'guess' is that this is flush>flush>flush, and it is a tossup between you and MP as to who has the nuts.
benhoug
QUOTE (simo_8ball @ Monday, September 4th, 2006, 2:31 PM) *
Posting the results would really help with the guessing.

Amazingly enough there was no set on this hand which should narrow down the holdings significantly.

One person has correctly guessed one player's hand, and a couple people ballparked another, but nobody has put me on a hand yet.
DonkSlayer
QUOTE (benhoug @ Monday, September 4th, 2006, 9:35 PM) *
Amazingly enough there was no set on this hand which should narrow down the holdings significantly.

One person has correctly guessed one player's hand, and a couple people ballparked another, but nobody has put me on a hand yet.



Ben were you Qs10x?
Zach6668
QUOTE (DonkSlayer @ Monday, September 4th, 2006, 10:34 PM) *
Ben were you Qs10x?

I like this guess... or even QsJx.
benhoug
QUOTE (DonkSlayer @ Monday, September 4th, 2006, 6:34 PM) *
Ben were you Qs10x?

Ding, ding, ding... We have a winner.

MP played AK off like a donkey, and I was very fortunate to draw out on CO's 6 icon_suit_spade.gif 3 icon_suit_spade.gif and make the nuts. Honestly I didn't think there was any way MP could possibly call my bet, but he found a way.

I was really trying to get CO heads up w/ lots of dead money in the pot w/ my overpush, but MP somehow found a way to think top 2 was good against a push and overpush on an all icon_suit_spade.gif board.
simo_8ball
Wow. WTF is MP doing? You said he seemed straightforward. Limp-calling preflop, then checkraising that flop is NOT straightforward. I have to stop giving people credit for being reasonable players.

I don't see MP folding anything for your reraise. After his checkraise he is committed. I think you should fold this. CO has to have a flush, so you have 7 outs. If, as was likely from the action, MP has a flush as well you are 22%.
You don't have the odds to call, and MP will probably push over the top anyway, so this is push or fold after the checkraise. Best case is you are calling $55 more into $157 (I think). Only if you had a lot of fold equity over MP (and it would have to be huge) then you would have about the right odds to continue.
benhoug
QUOTE (simo_8ball @ Tuesday, September 5th, 2006, 12:05 AM) *
I don't see MP folding anything for your reraise. After his checkraise he is committed.

Pot committed???? Really???? At that stage in the hand he HAD NOT even invested 1/4 of his chips, and he was relatively deep. Is that really pot committed?
simo_8ball
I don't particularly mean pot committed. I just mean he is going all the way with this hand, almost all the time. What can he checkraise you with, and fold to your allin? I don't see him folding a set or a flush. Slight chance he folds a low flush. He has plenty of boat outs with a set.
I don't put him on AK, even now you've told me he had AK. It's just such a minute possibility that it's not worth considering.

The fact is, you are getting ABOUT the right odds ONLY if he folds. If he calls, you aren't getting the right odds. Even if he only calls 25% of the time I think this is a wrong move. Fold the flop.

If it helps, imagine he checkraised allin on the flop. Would you call allin?
benhoug
QUOTE (simo_8ball @ Tuesday, September 5th, 2006, 7:08 AM) *
If it helps, imagine he checkraised allin on the flop. Would you call allin?

There's no way I call if he puts me all-in, but I'm not the one w/ a decision here.

I didn't think there was any way he could call me w/out a SUPERSTRONG hand here and I didn't put him on AA or KK, b/c people just don't limp/call w/ those pre-flop. He may have 77, but do you really call off 90% of your stack w/ bottom set vs. 2 all-ins on a flush board??? Basically I thought he would've had to have a really good flush to call me, and I had the nut card, the Q icon_suit_spade.gif, so he couldn't have that strong of a flush.

Obviously I gave the guy too much credit for being able to lay down a hand, but if I'm in his shoes I don't see how I can call my bet with anything he could possibly have.
simo_8ball
You said you had been playing LAG, and had got it allin with 99 vs QQ preflop. He will give you less respect than he would most players.
Many players would fold here with 77, or with a mid flush. I personally don't see it much though. As I say, do you think he will fold there almost all the time? That is what you need for this to be breakeven. If he has a mid flush he could put AA/KK/77 in your range.
krup24
So you came over the top with 6 outs or 24% I wouldn't suggest that move for long term success. You really got lucky.
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