Party 10 sng

10 handed

Hero (1100)
UTG (2000)

Blinds 30/60

Hero dealt 10 10 in SB

UTG raises to 225, folds to Hero, Hero?

What is you read on UTG?

Without a read I would fold as that raise looks to me off hand as a monster that has you beat.

no reads.'


so ur standard play against an unknown is fold?

fold., UTG @ 2k in level 3 (i think level 3) wont make a raise like hat unless he's holding QQ-AA and AK. sometimes AQ depending on donknissity
only hand u can flip is AK, AQ
just calling is going to leave you hurt if any over cards fall.
My advice
fold > call/push regardless what hits, > push preflop

edit: Dont pay much attention to this, cuz i'm still for folding
why i picked call / push regardless before "push preflop", is because villain looks like he will be willing to call any raise u make preflop., hands like AK AQ get a look at all 5.
instead of pushing and praying, at least now u get some FE as FIV if he didnt hit an A or K or Q. u also dodge 2 more streets.

good that makes me feel better...

i folded and felt like the worlds weakest player....

i've seen players make large preflop bets from UTG with any pair over 4 etc.. and thats just crazy at a 10 man table that early.

I think folding is a standard move, plenty better spots

how much do you care about sng's? I'm impatient so I'd push.

Folding is better because it's safer and you don't have any reads. But if I'm multi-tabling sng's and blinds are 30/60, I'm gonna take a shot. At best you're prolly 50/50, lol

Flat call, reevalute flop. Might bet out with 1 over, might check, might even c/r with 1 over. But I aint letting go of this preflop, and Im not re-popping.

no one else thinks folding is weak here ? i'm pushing this most of the time unless i have a real good read that says the 5th best hand in holdem is no good. ive mucked AQ a lot in situations like this but i really think 10 10 is too strong a hand to muck against one raiser in a SnG.

to the above poster i dont think you can just call because oop we will be forced to fold too many times when overs hit to a CB when our 10 10 is good. So its a push or fold..i lean towards push but thats just me i guess.

with our M, I push.

This is an easy fold unless UTG has given you reason to believe he's terrible. At best you're a race. You're about to move into button and we'll assume you're a quality aggressive player. So, preserve your stack for your upcoming late position hands.

Fold > Push > call

What's wrong with racing when we have an M=10 and q = 0.5 ?
And not close to cashing.

We also have fold equity.

*best* case is we're racing. Well, and maybe 88 or 99. And we're about to move into late position where our aggressive skills and non-crippled stack can win us some money.

Also, no. Against UTG I doubt we have fold equity.

Against mp3 or later, I'm probably agreeing with you. Against UTG 10-handed, not so much.

I push here with an M of 10. I think that we do have some fold equity as the UTG "steal" is also a possibility (UTG is the new button etc.). I hate calling but I would push rather than fold.

It's close though and I'd probably fold 9's so my line in the sand is right here.

yeah, little fold equity, tru..but even 15% is significant.

Here's a thought:

I did a quick and dirty range for villain and gave him this weighted allocation:

Underpair: 5
OverCards: 28
OverPair: 20

Percent he folds these to a push:

UnderPair: 50%
Overcards: 20%
OverPair: 0%

If we assume we are:

80% vs UnderPairs
50% vs Overcards
20% vs OverPairs:

then we

win 315 15% of the time
win 1190 32% of the time
lose it all 52% of the time

So, given there are 10 players left and M=10, can we afford to not gamble to dbl up now?

I'm still saying puuuuuuuuushhhhhhhhh

Do you disagree with my numbers or my rationale that we should gamble?

Your numbers are close enough.
I disgree with your rationale. We are an aggressive skilled SnG player who still has an M or 10. 10 is NOT panic mode. 10 is 'I can't cherry pick, but I can still get my money in good.' And with M=10, you have plenty of leverage to steal in the upcoming hands.

Of course, this is just for a generic 10 person $10 SnG. There's lots of room to adjust if UTG is bullying or the table is all TAG or passive or whatever.

But go bears does bring up an excellent point. Maybe the line isn't too far off. I certainly push with AK and QQ (Duh). What about JJ and AQ.

M of 10 isnt that bad right now in a sng

not like MTT's remember, table wont keep filling up with people.



i've cashed many times because of folding gambling situations.

its an SNG. They play much differently than MTT's.

i'm with you on this one

also the play is usually so bad i can probably wait for a situation where i actually have an edge then gamble for my stack

I've won a lot of chips gambling in that spot.

That said, the less than standard raise gives me pause.

Against a range of 99+, AJs+, KQs, AJo+, KQo you are a slight underdog, and with the awkward stack sizes, you need to push over calling. Fold and wait for a better opportunity.

Maybe I'm influenced by busting out in 7th in last night's Neg O, when my TT ran into big stack's KQo...

against 9 others and a q = 0.5 I think the time to gamble with TT HU is now.
The next blind level puts your M at < 8.
We have to overcome 6 otherstacks to cash.

Aren't the starting chips in these 800?
If so, we're ahead of average in chips.
And, we're ahead of average in skill.
Why gamble?

-M

no.
2000.

NO, its not.

we still have FE with an M of 8 even when blinds go up, and we could easily over come a few rotations while waiting for a better spot.

TT can push, but can TT push vs a UTG raiser?

there is math, and there is comon sense.

different style, I guess.
I think we risk more by picking a half dozen spots to steal 90/150 than we can by racing here or getting him to fold AQ, JJ.

yea, and we are 20% sometimes.

at low buyins, I'm not as concernd with who raised.

furthermore, I'm not as skilled as you and thus, would gamble more.

************************

I'm not doing this 100% of the time.
And it's close for me.

am i reading this right? UTG raises 3 and 1/2 times the BB and we fold 10, 10 in the SB?

This is how everyone needs to end their posts

lol. kidding.

i dontknow if we've ever played, i always thought u were a majority limit cash games?




its push or fold brother.

i was until April of this yr.
now playing SnG's almost exclussively.

which site?

always NL He?

Party

"CSC_Actuary"


Occasionally play 5 table SnG or the 40k Guar MTT.

mostly 6 Man at the $20+2 level.

yes, always NLHE