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Full Version: Taking Lag To A Whole New Level ($215 Sng)
FCP Poker Forum > Poker Strategy Forum > Tournament Play
iggymcfly
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t40 (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

CO (t2000)
Button (t2200)
SB (t1960)
BB (t2000)
UTG (t2000)
UTG+1 (t2000)
UTG+2 (t2000)
Hero (t2000)
MP2 (t1840)
MP3 (t2000)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 3, 3.
UTG calls t40, 1 fold, UTG+2 raises to t180, Hero calls t180, 4 folds, SB calls t160, 1 fold, UTG folds.

Flop: (t620) A, 4, K (3 players)
SB checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero bets t400, SB calls t400, UTG+2 folds.

Turn: (t1420) 7 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero is all-in for 1420.

This is from the second hand of a SnG. Obviously, there were reads involved or I wouldn't have played the way I did. Here's my thinking on every street:

Preflop: That larger than normal raise is QQ, JJ, or TT 90% of the time. I'll call and play for set value.

Flop: Well, I did put the raiser on QQ, JJ, or TT. This wouldn't be a bad time to try a position bet.

Turn: OK, when I got called, I was absolutely ready to throw in the towel. The SB obviously has an ace or better, so it's time to give up. Right? Well, on the turn, the SB made the universal signal for "I have a hand, please don't bet into me" by stalling for about five or six seconds before checking. It did seem pretty weird that he didn't go for the C/R on the flop, and I figured that the most likely thing was that he was legitimately weak. $215 SnG players are usually able to lay down hands if they think they're beat, and there's no way he can put me on a bluff, especially when I could easily be trying to push out a flush draw on the turn. I figure that if I push, the bluff only has to work 52% of the time to show a profit, and at this point, I figure it's way higher than that.

Thoughts?
Stylin_Fish
Risk/reward seems a little lopsided to me. It looks like a pointless move early in a SNG.

But changing up play never huts.
SavageHenry
if you trust your read and willing to go broke here then shove in. I think its the only way your winning the pot. i don't see the villian calling your initial 400 with an unpair though...a moderate or weakish ace is a lot more likely. The only other think i can think of is a set of 4s.
reedmcneal
QUOTE (Stylin_Fish @ Wednesday, June 21st, 2006, 11:04 PM) *
Risk/reward seems a little lopsided to me. It looks like a pointless move early in a SNG.
gobears
This obviously works better if villain is a strong player as he would be likely to lay down a PP like QQ-1010. I don't think that you can discount AA/KK/AK though as his preflop raise could indicate those hands as well.

I really don't like villain's check on the flop as he raised preflop showing strength so a standard CB is almost mandatory with that flop. Either he is weak or trapping with a monster and willing to let you bluff into him.

I see the flush/gut shot on the board but he might be willing to take a chance to get your chips.

If he has QQ-1010 and is a strong player since this is a $215, I think that your turn bet has a good chance of picking up the pot.

Myself, I would have let the hand go after I didn't hit the set.
iggymcfly
One thing I liked about the move is that having exactly as many chips left as were in the pot, it allowed me to make a strong all-in move to steal, and still not look suspicious or lay more than 1:1 against my move working. Again, I've never seen the call flop/stall turn move used to induce a bluff, so I figured that he was legitimately weak, and that I'd probably get a fold here about 70-75% of the time, making my move very profitable.

One thing about my STT strategy is that by design, I tend to make a lot of aggressive moves early so that I either get a huge stack and get into a position to bully or go out early and move on to the next SnG. I almost never get 3rd through 6th.

Anyway, I trusted my read, went with the big bluff, and got the fold. I ended up building up a huge stack and taking 3/4 of the chips in play, but I caught some bad luck late and finished in 3rd.
timwakefield
I wouldn't take the 5-second stall into very much consideration. He could quite possibly just be playing a tough hand at another table, answering the phone, changing the tv chanel, etc etc.
SavageHenry
the stall/check i think is usually "please don't bet here i want to check this down". The stall/bet is 50/50. ive seen big hands and nothing with this move so i usually just play my hand and don't put to much faith in that tell.

The autocheck is the one that bothers me. i;ve had a couple people autocheck the nuts to me to induce a bluff.

i might agree with Tim if this was 20+2 or something. i don't think most people are going to be mucking around in a 200+15.
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