This is mainly for people who do pray but feel free to add your thoughts as you wish.

We are called by GOD to pray. Not because we need to, because GOD already knows our hearts and thoughts, but because GOD wants to have a personal relationship with us. So to me, when I pray, I do not use fancy words or phrases. I do not drop on my knees with folded hands as depicted in movies. I pray where I am no matter where that is . . . in my car, the shower, at work . . . etc . . . etc. I use my normal speech even if it is not "proper". I express my emotions whether that be joy, sadness or even anger. Yes . . . it is OK to let GOD know that you are angry or frustrated. He knows anyway, why not tell him right? But getting to the meat of this topic . . . does prayer really work? How can you tell?

There are many examples in the Bible where GOD has answered prayer. But let's think about our own lives for a second. Has GOD ever answered your prayers? Some people will say yes to this question and some will say no. But we need to look at how we interpret if GOD really answered our prayers or not. So how can we measure if GOD really answered our prayers? First we need to decide how GOD answers them, then we need to apply that conclusion to our own life and finally reference back to examples in the bible.

Let’s first look at how GOD answers prayers. Does he answer specific prayers? How does he answer them? When does he answer them? How will we know when they are answered? These are all very good questions I have been asked in the past. Let’s first look to see if he answers specific prayers. Well the answer is really not cut and dry because frankly we just do not know how GOD works. If we pray to win the lottery for example . . . there is a pretty good chance that GOD will not answer that prayer for us. But if we ask for GOD to show us ways to improve our financial status then that prayer may be answered.

But how and when will he answer them? The brutal fact is sometimes GOD answers our prayers and we don’t even realize it. This is because he answers them in the way HE feels is the best and not the way WE feel is the best. In addition he answers in HIS timing and not OUR timing. I will use a personal example for this one. I was in a high stress position with a company for ten years. The company was really struggling financially and it was causing me a great deal of stress, some of which I took home to my family. It was causing me to be very irritable and touchy with my family, which obviously caused me to say some things I regret. This went on for well over a year. For this entire time I prayed for GOD to help me. I asked for him to help our company financially. I asked for him to help me relieve some of my stress. Well next thing I know the company is going into bankruptcy and I get laid off. On the surface it appears that GOD did not answer my prayers. BUT . . . I believe he did! You see after the company was discharged from bankruptcy they were actually a lot healthier. And although I went through one of the hardest times in my life while I was unemployed for 8 weeks, I eventually found another job in my industry and have never been happier in my life. I now work for a great, healthy company and my stress level is almost nonexistent. This not only helped me mentally but it helped me to be a better father and husband to my family. So although he didn’t exactly answer my prayers in the way I thought. He knew what was best for me in the long run and gave me exactly what I prayed for!

To me it is simple now. I know that GOD is listening when I speak. When I pray I know he hears me. I also know that he knows what’s best for me. So even though he doesn’t answer me sometimes the way I envision it, he stills answers. So what is a good biblical example of this? I always think about the story of Abraham. He prayed for children with his wife Sarah. Now GOD could have snapped his fingers and instantly given Abraham a child. But he didn’t. It was not until Abraham was 99 years old did Sarah become pregnant with a son. (He did have another son from Hagar but that is a different story). I’m sure both Sarah and Abraham doubted what GOD had promised them in prayer (it says so) and I am sure that they even thought it was funny that GOD waited so long (it says that too) but it does show that GOD will answer in his own time and way.

In conclusion, I believe that GOD does answer our prayers. I think sometimes it is hard to recognize his answers because of our narrow sighted view. Sometimes his answers are not our own and even do not make sense. But I do feel it works if we take off our blinders and recognize the whole picture.

Thoughts?

Good post. Prayer defintely works, even though we may not understand God's answers. I agree very much that God wants us to communicate with Him, because He wants a relationship with us, He wants to hear our thoughts, concerns, and our triumphs. I believe He even wants to hear us when we are angry with Him. That's all part of a growing relationship. Good job, this forum needs more posts like this.

"On the surface it appears that GOD did not answer my prayers. BUT . . . I believe he did! You see after the company was discharged from bankruptcy they were actually a lot healthier. And although I went through one of the hardest times in my life while I was unemployed for 8 weeks, I eventually found another job in my industry and have never been happier in my life. I now work for a great, healthy company and my stress level is almost nonexistent. This not only helped me mentally but it helped me to be a better father and husband to my family. So although he didn’t exactly answer my prayers in the way I thought. He knew what was best for me in the long run and gave me exactly what I prayed for!"


Ahhhhh, so all of your education, hard work, experience and diligence in finding another job would have been for nought without prayer.

When I pray other than forgivness I don't ask for anything.

I see prayer as a personal communication with god, not a "can you do this and that for me please"

Honest question here... so if GOD answered your prayer, what would have happened if you hadn't prayed? The business would have stayed intact, and you would have kept the job?

Or would the same thing of happened anyway, because that's what GOD wants? In that case why pray? If the events "caused" by your prayer would have occured anway I dont think we can say GOD answered your prayer, in any way, shape, or form.

It's not bad to ask for things in prayer. There again . . . if you ask to win the lottery . . . don't count on it . But the bible is clear on prayer.

Matthew 7:8
For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened.

Matthew 21:22
If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer."

Mark 11:24
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

John 16:24
Until now you have not asked for anything in my name. Ask and you will receive, and your joy will be complete.

James 4:3
When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.
*** This one addresses why we can't win the lottery . . . lol . . . ***

1 John 3:22
and receive from him anything we ask, because we obey his commands and do what pleases him.

Of course my education, hard work, etc. had something to do with it. It's not like I sit there, pray and expect GOD to take care of it all while I sit back and do nothing. Just because I believe in prayer doesn't mean that I don't live a normal life and make my own choices. I just choose to pray through my choices and trust that GOD will help me through the good times and the bad. And yes I believe that GOD answered my prayers in this instance.

I didnt ask if they had something to do with it, I asked if they would not have been sufficient without prayer.

And re your other post, I think you meant he helps you through ADversity, not DIversity...at least I hope so.

Ajd re your subtitle to the thread...How can we tell?....Youve answered that question yourself..you cant.

Thank you for correcting my grammar - yes I meant adversity.

For someone like you . . . your right . . . you can't tell because you have no Faith. I myself have Faith. That's what it boils down to. I could live my entire life not believing or not praying at all and I would live a normal life. But I choose by Faith to believe in GOD and believe in prayer. I do believe in prayer. I have noticed a difference in my life since spending more time with GOD in prayer. If you don't agree that's just fine with me. We could sit here and argue all day about whether or not prayer works. To me, in my life, it works . . . plain and simple.

To answer your question, would it have been sufficient? We'll never know because I prayed during that time and also had people praying for me.

I think it is a bad thing to ask for certain things. Its one thing to ask "please be with me for I am scared and at a crisis" and another thing to say "I want everyone to be ok and to never have problems and for my family to get rich and for a Tonka truck and...."

Alot of people believe that when we pray, its so we get stuff or so we can change god's mind on an issue. Doesn't help that certain people do actually pray that way (looking at certain evalangists on TV).

I see guys praying all the time in Football (soccer) matches and then they end up losing. So, I suppose if they pray to lose then it does work, but what if their teammates prayed to win. Does it work like a democracy?

I agree 100%. That's why I threw James 4:3 in there. The purpose of prayer is not for "stuff". TV Evangelists are the worst and most, in my eyes, are hypocrites.

James 4:3
When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.


When I said it is OK to ask for things . . . I wasn't referring to money or possessions. I was simply saying that it is OK to request things from GOD as in guidance, health, etc. But we must also know that GOD's will, will be done.

God is great with out him I wouldn't be the person i am today i challenge anyone to pray...after prayer it feels like a weight has been taken off your shoulders...

Selfish prayers are not answered . . .

James 4:3
When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives . . .

Then why post with ?'s, you have the answers and dont want to discuss them.

Well, I'm glad we are both in agreement, its just the outside view is "Christians pray to get stuff their way" (including one poster who made a comment about those type of prayers). I think its important to show that when we pray, its not just give me this and that. Most prayer is simply to give thanks without asking for anything.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/3...cf3709b&ei=5070

Interesting stuff. I would have thought at least the people being prayed for would do a LITTLE better because of their belief that the prayer would help (mind over matter and all that). Turns out prayer does absolutely nothing in this case.

I'm not saying prayer isn't great if it helps you out personally and enriches your life in some way...but to say that God really does anything about it is pretty silly...no? FOOSE?

God refuses to participate in any scientific studies.

i believe it does work. i have prayed for so many things in my life and would like to share one with you now.

about 4 years ago my father was having a huge operation on his neck.
there were complications this way and that and after about 8 hours of surgery done, the doc came out and told us that he was almost 100% not going to make it.
of course my mother and my whole family (about 35 of us) broke down in fear and sadness. everyone was everywhere and no one knew what to do.

then a voice inside me told me to pray, so I did. I prayed for about 30 min without stopping. about 2 hours after i prayed my dad was going to be alright. his blood pressure leveled his breathing was ok and everything was cool. he was out of the hospital days later.
thats what I call a miricle prayer

In your life maybe it's silly. In mine it's not. It all boils back to the same old argument. Is GOD real or not? I could post a dozen articles saying the exact opposite of what the article you posted says. That proves nothing. The article you posted proves nothing. Those types of "studies" are a dime a dozen. I have seen prayer work in my own life. If you haven't in yours then I'm sorry. I believe in GOD and I believe in prayer. So to answer your question . . . no I don't think it's silly.








Discuss???? You and I both know the only reason you come into the religion forum is to argue . . lol. I have seen you do it many times.

I never said I have all the answers my friend. I opened a discussion in the religion forum and directed it mainly to those who DO pray. As usual you come in with your snide comments and try to discredit anything that is said. Look, if you don't believe I don't have a problem with that. I'm not one to judge. I just simply said I'm not going to argue with you. Prayer works for me because I believe in it . . . if you don't that's just fine with me.

I guess one mans discussion is anothers argument. The only person Ive come close to arguing with is mattnxtc, who you have to admit is an embarassment to any group he chooses to associate with. The subject lines certainly imply that you were trying to discuss the issue, not just look for sycophants.

why must you bring me in to your attacks? I try to avoid discussions with you and monty as nothing gets accomplished and you choose to try to bring me back in? You live in a fairy tale world if you think any of your posts have ever proved anything. Monty still hasnt proved any shred of evidence and for some reason you choose to back him.

Its blatantly obvious what your problem is. You want proof of something that you willingly deny. You dont give it a chance and then laugh when it doesnt happen. It would be like you never giving a woman a chance and then arguing that loving a woman doesnt do anything

You will never expereince the power that prayer gives you b/c you will never open up to the thought that just maybe it does work. What you will do is sit here and try to "be smarter than everybody else. The funny thing is that much smarter people than you have attempted to discredit christianity and yet 2000 years later we are still waiting for that. So you can sit there in your ignorance and arrogance and talk about how prayer is pointless but the day you decided to truly give it a chance you will see its power

I'm glad to hear he came through ok. But I have a question.

Do you believe that if you did not pray he would have died?



Sorry, silly was a poor choice of words.

I do not think it comes down to whether or not god is real. I think that there is a chance that god exists. I'm not sure if he/she does or not, but I will definately admit that there is a chance.

BUT...that said there are only a few options in my opinion.

1. God does not mess with what is happening in the Universe. We're on our own, which is why sometimes prayer works and sometimes it doesn't...it's basically no different from variance in poker.
2. God does have the power to meddle with the Universe...and is an asshole for letting such horrible things occur, sometimes in his/her name.

I'm not sure which explanation I prefer...but I'm willing to listen to other ideas. Remember, I'm not even talking about whether or not God exists, because for the purpose of this argument let's assume it does. I am just saying that the belief that god actually grants wishes like a freakin' fairy is just too far-fetched. There is faith, and then there are people that kill themselves because they believe there is an alien spaceship behind Haley's Comet waiting to take them to a better life.

And this sums up my (and I assume many others) problem with the concept of prayer. I don't see how you can believe that God answers prayers, at least about external events, without believing that if you did not pray, God would not have saved your relative, given you that big break at work, helped you meet the girl/guy of your dreams, etc. And such a God that is that vindictive, that will only do such things if you pray, a God that would let people die if you didn't pray, that is not a God that I want to believe in, or, more importantly, worship. Now God may very well be that way, but count me out if that is the case.

So I am all in favor of prayer for personal strength, prayer to make yourself feel closer to God, and that sort of thing, which I do believe is what many of you pray for. But belief that prayer can actually change external events, as much as I would want it to in instances of my life, is simply not something I can get behind.

Extremely well put.

Thanks, I have my moments of lucidity I suppose...

edit: nevermind

edit#2...i think i edited too late, oh well

honsetly i do. its not something i like to think about, but if i didnt pray im pretty sure i wouldnt have liked the outcome

And now here come the questions.

1) If he didn't survive would you have blamed God or yourself that your prayers were not good enough

2) When other people pray and they don't survive is that their fault.

Its one of the reasons why I'm fine with god allowing evil in the world. Becuase if god can fix everything then we don't have a just god, we have a god who arbartrailly decides who to save and who dies.

I perfer a God that promises that the reward will be heaven, rather then the reward will be I will come and fix your problems as long as you do what I want.