I don't, but when it comes to Dave, it is success DUE TO good music.

I would agree with that.

You will never be able to convince me of this. The musical tastes of all Dave fans I know is just awful (not including you), which really doesn't help their cause. I just think his shit is so cheesy. Give me a break, this also goes out to OAR.

Yeah, I can understand you not digging it, but there's definitely musical talent there. The guy can play guitar EXTREMELY well. There's really no denying that.

Then we'll agree to disagree - from the sound of it, I would most likely dislike some of your favorite bands....

Well that's just plain wrong.

KG, you do a wonderful job of being an elitist.

Seriously, my avatar is the greatest album ever. So, therefore, you're wrong.

you've GOT to be kidding me


the entire lineup of DMB are incredible musicians. there is not one weak link in that entire band.

maybe you look at the music as a whole, but i look at the instrumentation behind each song, and it's damn good.

Seconded. You're even more of an elitist than I originally thought...

and no. it's not. it's good. but not the best ever by any stretch of the imagination

No, it seriously is.

Bob Dylan

(See topic, "Bob Dylan".)

not so much elitist as hardcore fan.

i like radiohead a lot, dont get me wrong.


but i hate when any person likes a band so much that he begins to give them more credit than theyre do, and put down other music, simply because it isnt that band.

Bro, I'm sorry, but it's not even Radiohead's best album.

good arguement.


i know better than to argue radiohead with a hardcore radiohead fan, as they are completely blind to most other forms of good music.

so i will let this rest.

Ok, they don't get their due credit.

I like a bitch load of bands, so there goes that argument.



Now, this is a debate I'm interested in.

I go back and forth almost monthly.

But for the past couple months I have been at Kid A.

Or perhaps "Dylan, Bob"

1- i agree they dont get the recognition they deserve by MAINSTREAM media, but then again, who does? Their fans more than support and endorse them, more so than most. So "there goes that arguement"...


2- you're arguement of kid a being "the best album ever" completely discredits any other musical input. It is, at best, their second best cd, and doesn't break the top 10 in "greatest albums of all time"

For me, it started as The Bends, then OK Computer became number 1, then Kid A, and now it's OK Computer again.

I completely agree with CW on this. Hell, I may even give DMB more credit than they're due, but I wouldn't ever venture so far as to say they had a "Best album ever" - and the same certainly can't be said for any radiohead album.

I personally love DMB AND Radiohead, for totally different reasons, so I'm split on this issue. I don't think either of them have put out a "best album ever" (although I CAN hear arguments for OK Computer, since it was so seminal), but I do think both bands can hold down their own when it comes to "Best Live Act."

AMAZING.

Man, I love how it takes away my musical input.

At best their second best album has to be a joke. I'm sorry it isn't accessible as it should be. The only debate is whether or not it is better than OK Computer, but seriously it is lightyears ahead of The Bends. Find a more innovative album.

I'll back off on my best album ever rant, because that is just strongly opinion and I'll admit that.

Seriously, 20 years from now, Radiohead will be widely regarded as one of the best bands ever. Mark my word.



Man, I'm so psyched for the Radiohead tour this summer. I'm seeing them a minimum of three times.

Should run me upward of $200 or so...but worth it.

As will the Dave Matthews Band.. Hell, they already are regarded as such.

I totally agree that 20 years from now, Radiohead will be widely regarded as one of the best bands ever. I think they are now, by certain outlets. And rightfully so.

1- it does, because it shows that you have a ridiculously biased point of view

2- that's what I'm saying, and imo, it isn't much of a debate. OK computer was their best album, hands down.

3- that's terrific, but again, debatable. Assuming you are correct, there are bands that have been recognized for longer, and will still be regarded in that way 20 years from now.

I think they will be looked upon fondly 20 years from now, but will never be mentioned in the same breath as the legends.

So, it takes away my musical input on anything, ever.

Awesome, I should just go kill myself seeing as how music is my life.

Being a martyr does not win debates

well if you're going to put words in my mouth and respond like a six years old, then yes, you should.


it was said within the context of the current topic. do i need to explain this to you?

Well, you did say any other musical input.

I interprted it as "you like Kid A a lot, and since that in my opinion is wrong then you have no musical credibility" Whatever, sorry for the misinterpretation.

But I will defend Radiohead until my death.

as would most hardcore fans of any band.


but as in any discussions, a hard biased toward any issue will not make an objective discussion possible. end of story.

Don't ever say anything that intelligent this late at night again.

I think i just had a stroke.

HAHAHAHAHA.

Well done.

hhahaha my apologies.. yeah i dont know where that came from...

when i debate things i kinda get like will ferrell in old school..


i just black out and the fingers start flying over the keyboard.. i dont even remember what we were talking about..


was it kelly clarkson?

Well, that was fun.

Pavement- Slanted and Enchanted

Good album.

Not to bring up Radiohead again, but when I saw Radiohead live, Stephen Malkmus & The Jicks opened up for them.

Pig Lib is also an excellent album. I think I like Malkmus' solo stuff better than his Pavement stuff.

Really?

I think you're the first person I have ever heard that felt this way.

I love both, but I really don't think his solo stuff comes anywhere near Pavement's stuff.

Hate to bring up DMB again, but I'm going to try and listen to them again just because of this debate. I mainly hate them because of their fan base which is a terrible reason.

Yeah, it might be because I heard the solo stuff before Pavement, so I got attached to it first. I'm not sure. I do love Pavement, but I just feel the solo stuff a little more I think.

I used to be the same way with Tool. I hated them because I hated the fan base, then I got over it, and now I'm a total Tool nerd. I became one of those I disdained.

Take in a few of the live albums. Masterful.

listen to DMB live stuff...

given, it's more appreciated if you play an instrument (which i dont remember if you do or not)

highlights are definately the bassist and drummer. one of the best rythm sections around now... in terms of mastery of their instruments and working together

dave's guitar is highly underrated. the parts are complex, time signatures are unconventional, and singing and playing is always a challenge.


add in the fact that he's piss drunk 24/7.. and he gets a ****load of credit in my book




tool is one of my favorite bands. I'd say if there was a band that I would defend to my death, it would be them. or anything that chris cornell has been involved in.

Seeing that I play the guitar, bass, and drums I think I could appreciate it.

then it definately wouldn't be wasted on you


seriously, give it a good listen.. it really is much more intricate than upon first listen

I agree 100%. Carter Beauford (drummer) is A-****IN-MAZING.

Boyd Tinsley (the fiddle/violin) player is amazing too.

I doubt I could appreciate the violin.

Unless he plays it really fast, then I would just assume it is good.

If you go through the live albums in order - the evolution of the band is wonderfully prevalent.

Start with Red Rocks, then Listener Supported, and so on.

And his acoustical album with Tim Reynolds is one of my all time favorites.

that's a GREAT one for a guitarist to appreciate

reynolds is a nutcase


even tho acoustical isnt a word

**** you college boy!!

Out of nowhere comes a hiphop mood.

Ghostface- Supreme Clientele

great cd

anything from wutang alum is good in my book

I'm listening to pharoah monch


he has a song called "hell" where all crucial words in the first 7 bars start with an F or an "f" sound

its ridiculous

I see I have missed a lot over the last few pages....are people really trying to hold DMB and Radiohead in the same light? Get serious, people. At the end of the day, Dave Matthews makes pop music for the masses. Granted some people in his band have some definite talent, but Dave himself is a mediocre songwriter (in my opinion). Radiohead is widely regarded as one of the top bands around (if not the top band) by most music critics. They are already considered one of the most influential bands of the past 20 years....What other band could release an album that sounds anything like Kid A and have it open at #1 on the charts? CardWarfare, I don't plan in getting into any kind of heated debate about it, since I could care less about DMB, so we can just agree to disagree. If you like them, that's cool. They are just not for me.

Oh, and bigkg I agree with you, Kid A is their best work. OK Computer will always be the critical favorite, but Kid A has always been my personal favorite as well.

Anyway, today I am going to go with one of my favorite albums of all-time, Rubber Soul by The Beatles....