This is a hand my brother and I were quabbling about over dinner, and wanted to see what others think preflop and flop.

blinds 5/10
6 players

UTG has approx 850 chips
BB/Hero has aprrox 440 chips

average is 530.


UTG raises to 60.

Hero sees A K and raises 100 to 160.

UTG calls 100.

Flop: Q J 5 (sorry, don't remember the number card, it was low and not a spade)

Hero...? checks.

UTG bets 175, hero folds.



The villain is average...he plays pretty normal (not loose, not tight) but plays more pots when he has chips.

BB/hero is tight passive with flirts of aggression. The table has played with him before and knows this.


My brother put the player on a very tight hand range (AA-1010, AQ AK AJ). This led him to believe he would be called no matter what and hand to hope for a free turn. He also thought he would check raise all in if the villain put it a weak bet (or had a read).

I thought a larger preflop bet (130-150) and and push on the flop was a much better line. He seemed to ignore the fact that he took control of the hand and the villain doesnt know we missed the flop. He kept saying any hand that can call him preflop would call him.


How do you play this?

The 6x preflop bet by villain makes it very difficult to play this hand. I would normally raise but a decent raise (like to 160) put over a 1/3 of your stack into the pot. A higher pre-flop raise for sure commits you to the hand.

If you jam the flop, villain is getting 2.1 - 1 on the call. Almost any hand that I put him on will call as what could he have that you are ahead of?

I think that I check/fold also as with the blinds that low, you can still come back with 280 chips.

With a 6xBB raise preflop and my stack situation, I would think about folding AKo (blasphemy!) - I would put someone on a very high range of cards of which you are behind most of them. I can't see calling and hoping to flop an A or K. I doubt that he would fold to a jam.

the 60 dollar raise is what ruins lots of plays here. IMO he is doing this with a big hand or a smaller pair. A read could decide our play; unfortunately i peaked at my 53 offsuit and gave up on the hand already.

Actually i think your fold AK has merit IF the villain doesn't raise small pairs like this. Some players, especially the chip leaders, want control of the hand, but they don't want many players, hence the larger than norma raise. But ive never folded AK in a situation like this before...i can't fold big slick, i just can't! It's 6 handed and we aren't near the money yet (another table of six is also competing). A gamble might be in order.

I've changed my mind, i like pushing all in preflop. I think we need to take the chance that he has 9s or AQ and ram it. He might call with these hands anyway and im sure he's calling with pairs 10s and up (he can't fold these).

I think what irked me the most was by checking the flop he practically pushed the pot towards the villain saying, "take it!".

with his stack he is probably going to bet 9/10 when we check.

I would push pre-flop, but getting to this point I push instead of fold. I'm about 20% to the nut straight or flush, and my 6 over card outs might be good 1/2 the time making me about 33% plus folding equity.

If I just call and dont hit on the turn I no longer have calling odds, and my FE has disappeared, plus my stack is crippled.

that's the problem I had with checking. Even if UTG checks back, what do we do when a blank turn hits? Tough to think he would believe our bet, and he could easily be slowplaying.

I think we pick up this pot a decent amount of times going all in...I'm still not sure though.

I wouldnt mind seeing a pre-flop all in here. You say this guy is fairly average. Does he often make 6x the blind raises??? Start trying to see what range his raises are for different hands. Can anyone here advocating just calling this hand preflop??? I just dont like being out of position here. If we raise and the flop misses such as it did we are in a very tough spot. If we jam preflop we eliminate postion. If we just call we can still take a stab at the pot here or we are not as crippled if we check fold. That may be too weak of a line though. Just looking for more opinions on this.