I know the "general situation" posts aren't always helpful, but I have a question about a specific move in NLHE.

Sometimes, I bet a hand that I wouldn't be comfortable calling with. In Limit, I don't mind checking in order to encourage people to bluff at me, because it's just one more bet back. In NL, I'm much more apprehensive about encouraging bluffs, because I have a hard time calling down with marginal cards.

Say I get to the river OOP with TPDK on a fairly harmless board with a decent size pot and decent size stack left. My opponent also has a decent size stack, and he's capable of bluffing when checked to. Often, I'm betting out here. If he raises me a good amount, I can probably get away. If I just check to him, I'm afraid that he's going to bet me off the best hand.

I guess what I'm asking...is it okay to bet OOP in NLHE in order to discourage the bluff? Or should I just get better at encouraging them and picking them off?

get better at picking them off. I hope I never discourage a bluff.

So if the pot's at $30, and you hold JT with a T being the top card on the river...you really want to check and encourage you opponent to throw in $100? Can you really call that?

Basically, the move is a value bet/bluff blocker...but again...I'm not sure it's correct.

blocker bets are one of my favorite things.

BUT, you need a hand that gets called by worse hands and only raised by better hands. that is, if you're raised, you will know with high certainty that you are beat.

so, on those types of situations with marginal hands, i would check/call.

aseem

I think blocker bets are one of the worst moves in poker. I remember a post a while back about someone asking when to call a big river bet, and I covered this in a response, so I'll just quote myself, because I like it.




Even though I stated its harder for him to bluff when you lead out a small amount, that doesn't mean I support blocker bets to prevent a bluff. This is simply because you dont want to lose that value. There's a great caro tip in the second supersystem that covers this pretty well, basically you dont want to discourage your opponent from bluffing.

If you hand isn't good enough to stand a big bet, and you dont have a read on your opponent, then you dont have to play the sheriff and you can just let your hand go.

Basically, you want to have complete control of your table, your opponent, and your game. Plays that are weak shouldn't be part of your game unless you are deliberatly trapping or deceiving your opponent. A blocker bet is weak, its along the same lines as a post oak bluff, again, a good section in supersystem, by brunson. Good players will attack these. And you won't receive value from bad players because now you've discouraged their bluff and they will be forced into making the right decision, raising the best hand and folding the worst.

Imo, most of your hands should come down to betting out for value, or check calling with a decent enough hand in situations your opponent could be bluffing with a worse hand.

However, if you dont want to take the time to get a read on your opponent, and a specific read on the particular situation you are in, then blocker bet away. I would much rather put my opponent on a range of hands, and I realize that maybe this time, the flush didn't get there on the river, the straight didn't get there, the board paired and I have a marginal hand, so the best way to extract value is check/call, as this isn't a value bet situation. There will be times I have to fold to his bet, and times when I can pick off a bluff. It depends on your opponent, his perception of you, and your perception of him and so on.

Oh, I'm certainly not advocating the blocker bet in every situation. Against certain opponents on specific rivers, I don't mind encouraging a bluff. By blocker bet, I also don't mean a weak bet. I almost always bet half to a full pot if I'm going to bet.

If I had to guess at my frequency of bluff blocking, I'd say around once every session or two. So, it's not a super common tool...mainly cause like you said...building a pot with TPGK OOP isn't a good idea.

I'll try to be on the watch for a specific example over the next few days.

So imagine my elation when I read this in the latest issue of CardPlayer...



http://www.cardplayer.com/poker_magazine/a...5101&m_id=65576

P.S. Sorry for the thread necromancy.

the blocker bet doesn't even have to be on 5th street.
you may punch it on the turn OOP (80% - 120%+ pot bet)
if you think you are ahead and against certain types of opponents.
even if you get called here, you still have a good chance of getting a free showdown.

There are certain situations where this bet works. (In a tournament, where you're not sure if you're ahead and you don't want to commit your whole stack.) However, in general, I think it's almost always a -EV move. I found that the biggest leap I made in my NL game was deciding to check and then make a decision when I was unsure, instead of pounding out "defensive bets".

The thing is that you usually do better in either situation by checking when you're unsure. If you're ahead, you're much more likely to get a bluff out your opponent who will read you weak and try to take advantage. Likewise, if you're behind, your opponent will be more likely to try to "price you in" and bet a smaller amount.

Even if you just keep going with a bet that's 1/2 the size of the pot, say after a straight or flush draw gets there on the river, your opponent is likely to think that you had a hand the whole way, not that your draw got there. He can still come over the top, and you're not solving anything in terms of a decision making process, you're just putting money in the pot with negative value. If your opponent doesn't have anything, your opponent will either raise or fold, so you're just raising the stakes of the decision if he decides to raise you, and giving him money when you bet/fold.

I'll use this check/call in many situations; not just when a scare card comes on the river. Say you have A-9 suited in a two-way pot and you flop an ace against an aggressive opponent. You're usually better off check-calling than firing a bet here, as you'll get action when your hand is good, and you might make your opponent slow down somewhat if you're behind. Also, by using this play when you have a hand, you actually discourage bluffs in the long run, will be scared to bluff you after you check-call them multiple times and show them top pair.