this one if from memory. THe original raiser is a weak tight tag and the BB is an idiot.

player A opens from MP1 or MP2, folded to me otb and I three bet with KK, idiot boy calls from the BB, and player A calls.


flop comes: A xx two hearts(I have the king of hearts)

checked to me, I bet, idiot calls, player A CRs, what is my play here.

the pot is sitting at ~13 sbs whenit gets to me after the cr

I'd fold. Chances are he's got it, hoping someone was going to bet the flush draw or bluff at the ace.

Is the A a heart or the xx both hearts?

Either way...I'm putting weak tight tag on AK and button on flush draw. You could fold, but I say wait call the extra small bet to see if you can find the flush redraw. If not fold to a turn bet.

Maybe?

but does the pot size make this a peel?. This is a fairly big pot, and I'm pretty sure that idiot boy might come along for the ride, so that adds implied odds







I am the button. IIRC, it was the xx that were hearts

But it seems like he has possible implied odds in position if idiot BB will call turn too. That is implied odds to a set if OR doesn't have A-A.

Beat me to it

Yeah, I think you peel here with the pot odds, and fold a non-heart, non-K turn if he bets again (that's assuming idiot boy is highly unlikely to 3-bet the flop).

I guess, but there is a good chance our heart redraw is tainted. If we are assuming original raiser has at least one ace, maybe two, we could be in trouble going along for the ride. I think AhQh is a possibility also...since he is pretty weak he would be afraid of the flush otherwise.

I think a king is the only real out (unless he has AA), and while it's tempting to peel one off it's not profitable.

okay, the pot is of a decent size, but can I make enough bets back if I peel? maybes I should be looking to fold here, cause player A isn't exactly tricky, and I can't see him pulling that move with anything less then AK, AQ, or AA, but I think AK or AQ are more likely as he would probably let a card go if he had top set

I think it is and I just started being analtical about implied odds with 2 streets to go and the possible scenario if idiot BB calls turn, it should be.

In the past I'd fold this but I think I need to start calling in this situation, esp with an "idiot" BB who will call a turn bet like K dawg implied.

Yeah I did the calculations on this hand...

It would be 14-1 on Your immediate call (including BB call), so You'd have to make back 8 SBs to ~ break even. 8 SBs is 4 BBs, so if BB calls 1 on the turn, and You can get OR for 3 BB then it's break even. If You do hit and OR bets and BB calls, You raise and get 4 right there on the turn.

I think the math is right...

Someone can correct it if its rwong


Edit: Shit I f'ed up. It's 13-1 like You said... but regardless if You can get 4 on the turn and at least 1 on the river then it's +EV

keith, i peel here and fold to a bet on any non-k/non-heart turn. i'd bet/fold if checked to on those same turns.

if it's a heart, i just call a bet or check if checked to.

you have probably between 3 - 4 outs,and you don't really have strong reverse implied odds here. with BB coming along, this is close enough implied odds to call profitably.

aseem

I disagree with this. Weak tighty could have AA or the Ah, both of which give pretty strong reverse implied odds if you hit.

What could player A have in this situation, that he would check-raise with against a raiser and caller (I'm assuming this is a full ring game)? I guess he could have something like QhJh, or even QhQx, JhJx, but it doesn't seem likely. I'd guess AQ or AJ. I don't see what he could have here (I assume he's not a complete donk?) that would make staying profitable. You can't really give yourself credit for more than 3.5 outs max (the extra 1.5 for your possibly tainted flush draw). Yes the donk adds some nice implied odds, but enough to make drawing to 2 kings profitable? Not likely.

okay, the pot is of a decent size, but can I make enough bets back if I peel?


Nope.

It's close though.

It was kind of hard to gauge that opponent because K said he was TAG and weak tight. If his preflop raise was 0 then I'd be worried

you're right. i didn't read up to that point that the two hearts didn't include the ace.

yes, this decreases your implied odds significantly. it's bad enough if he has the lone Ah (1 in 3 times) but if he has the Ah and another heart (about 1/4 of the time he has the Ah), you're drawing very slim.

ok, yes, i'd fold here.

i also realize that with the weak/tightie, you're not going to get so many bets out of him, especially on a four-flush river, unless you're beat.

thanks,
aseem

yeah, to set the record straight, i wouldn't worry about AA at all. that's just fearing MUTB imho.

aseem

Yeah it's close, depends on if BB would call 2 on the turn and A won't fold A-K / Q.

But Yeah it's close.

people, a set of aces if a near unlikely. This guy is aggro enough PF to cap aces, so his call of my three bet told me what the range of his hands are. I think that he is also aggro enough PF to cap QQ, but I don't think that he'd cap AKo or AKs OOP here

I wasn't assuming AA here, I highly doubt he has AA.

I'd peel and re-evaluate the turn.

Since it's close, I would rather not let these opponents (particularly A) think that he could push me off the flop with a c/r all the time. Also, if A has a flush draw, he is likely to check the turn if it doesn't come in. The only hand that has you in a lot of trouble is Ahxh.