Painter567
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 8:10 PM
http://www.pokerhand.org/index.php?page=vi...iew&hand=121012
The thing i remember about this hand is I raised and got called and once I miised the flop and it went check, check. I thought my A was good. Then he raises me on the trn and I remember feeling I was behind but also thought he may have a diamond draw. Turns out he had better than that, a diamond draw plus a gut shot draw. My ace ended up being good.
Thoughts?
LaydownKing
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 9:25 PM
In short handed pots, reads are crucial. Do you have one? Also, can you explain the flop check?
Painter567
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 10:07 PM
This guy was losing lots of pots and I felt he may bet even with my hand being best. Once the turn hit, i thought i was good but his raise caught me by surprise a bit. I took it for face value and read him for a draw.
PrtyPSux
Wednesday, September 7th, 2005, 12:12 AM
this hand doesnt make sense to me, I know im waay out of this level and the players here are quite tricky but his turn raise seems like an attempt to steal. he wouldnt cold call the PF raise w/ 3s and would possibly fold 6s in that position right? and he most likely wouldnt check the K (although he could if hes planning on raising ur turn bet no matter what hits) so the A hits ur probably fine unless ur up against AQ, Id say he has a flush draw and 3 bet the turn. of course I could be completely wrong, I havent watched too much of the 100/200 games, so I dont know how the players are. Also a read would help.
BTW, ur flop check was interesting, where u planning on c/r'ing the turn no matter what to rep a monster? or were u just playing passively against this specific guy?
Painter567
Wednesday, September 7th, 2005, 3:00 AM
Not really planning on CRing the turn unless I got there. At this point I was running only "so-so". Although this shouldn't affect how you play the next hand, it does and I had backed off of my aggressiveness. A few hands earlier I had AA shoved up my azz by 66 when a 6 hit the turn and I lost a $3600 pot. Like I said, shouldn't affect my play on the next hand but I am human and its poker.
akishore
Wednesday, September 7th, 2005, 7:21 PM
guys, this flop check is completely fine. not every flop should be auto-bet, and i believe this is one which definitely should NOT be auto-bet.
i like the check a lot if he's planning on raising a bet and if his opponent is aggressive. this "protects his checks" in the future, also takes control against a usual semi-bluff and lets him represent more strength cheaper (instead of betting, getting raised, and having to three-bet, or betting, getting called and being forced to bet the turn). this also makes your turn fold equity shoot way up.
if his opponent is passive, i like the check fine, too, since there isn't much to protect against on this board (other than the obvious flush draw, but giving a free card when you're not that far ahead--and are sometimes behind to two live cards + a flush draw--isn't that big a deal in this small pot) and a bet doesn't gain much information, either. you usually also have zero fold equity on a flop after a guy cold-calls a raise.
the turn bet is also fine, but i wouldn't mind checkraising this turn, either (if you plan on folding to a three-bet), again against an aggressive player.
two checks signify significant weakness and many aggressive players will pounce at this opportunity to bluff. also, three diamonds on board make a lot of people semi-bluff with a lone diamond in their hand when it checks to them. checkraising here charges them the maximum to draw when you are now usually ahead.
i think folding to a three-bet if you checkraise would be smart against all but the biggest maniacs since villian's flop check could have been a slowplay (AK, K6, K3, a set) or his hand could now be best (flush, AQ, A6, A3, etc.).
that said, the turn bet isn't bad. his opponent hasn't shown much strength, and if his opponent is passive, betting is better than checking (unlike the flop) since now the flush draw is much more prominent, and two broadway cards also makes gutshots present, and since passive opponents will only bet when they have you beat here but will check if they don't.
when he gets raised, calling down isn't bad, and i think it's better than three-betting by far. your hand isn't strong enough to three-bet, and getting capped would suck horrendously.
nice hand, OP, although i would checkraise this turn too if i checkraised the flop (which i think is far better than auto-betting the flop, btw).
aseem
Painter567
Wednesday, September 7th, 2005, 7:31 PM
Well thought out. Thanks for the input!