lenmccart
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 7:37 AM
Hello everyone,
I have been lurking at this board for a long time, and I figured it was time to get involved. I am already quite aware of the tightrope that must be walked to get an actual response, but at the same time I am looking forward to potential battles with Ron Mexico and Royal!! Thanks in advance for your patience as I am just learning how to play.
My actual poker question is about how to properly play small to mid pocket pairs pre-flop in limit. I just can't figure out the best way to do it. It seems like anytime I raise 6-9's I am going to get called by any High Ace, KQ, KJ, or something like that. Inevitably, a high card is going to fall on the board. How should I be going about those hands?
What about smaller paris? Should I just being calling 1 bet max on small pocket pairs in hoping to hit a set? Or should I be willing to call a bigger raise?
At this point in my game i play very small limits, like .05/.1. I just want to grind out a bit and learn how to properly play the game before moving up any and losing all my money.
Thanks in advance,
Flip
BeanGW
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 7:55 AM
Hi. Post some specific hands. Focus on reads you have on opponents, your position, etc.
Generally speaking I will raise 9-9 and above in an unraised pot anywhere, anytime. Sometimes I'll reraise with 9-9 to isolate.
Pocket pairs below that, I'm limping, calling one, folding for two.
lenmccart
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 9:59 AM
Regarding position: If I am in early position, would you still reccomend raising with 6's-9's? Or would you just call the BB? Three-bet a raise from late position, or just call a late position raise?
If I am in late position and its folded to me, how much should I raise, 2x BB? What if there are a couple limpers, 3x BB? Do I want to get isloated with that hand and knock out any overcards?
Is there any cure for people calling with a big Ace or even Ace-rag in the small stakes I play. Or is that just a danger of the level?
Thanks for your advice and sorry I don't have any hands to show, I am just thinking theoretically here? I plan on posting some hands in the future to get a better gauge of how to play. I think I generally play too passively and I am trying to learn how to be more aggresive, but still smart. I tend to forget that they don't know what I have and that I can control the range of hands they could put me on by agressive betting. I got SSHE the other day and that has already vastly improved my game.
Thanks again.
Flip
BDPoolie
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 11:15 AM
For me, I like to raise in any position with 7-7 or up. If it's 6-6 or below I'll just call.
If it's already been raised, then I'll just call it.
If it's been raised and then re-raised before me, and I haven't put any money in the pot yet, I'll only call if I have 10-10 or up.
But, if I'm the initial raiser, and then after the flop if it is checked to me, I'll bet it, no matter what comes. You have to see where you are in the hand. If you just check it around, maybe someone has called you with K-J. You can't give them a free card to hit it. You gotta make them pay for it. If they hit it, well, then they hit it, and you reevaluate from there.
lenmccart
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 12:57 PM
QUOTE
But, if I'm the initial raiser, and then after the flop if it is checked to me, I'll bet it, no matter what comes. You have to see where you are in the hand. If you just check it around, maybe someone has called you with K-J. You can't give them a free card to hit it. You gotta make them pay for it. If they hit it, well, then they hit it, and you reevaluate from there.
Excellent advice...I never thought about it that way. I guess I am currently playing not to lose, instead of being willing to risk a few chips to establish the hands at the table.
Thanks!
Disc_Golf
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 1:06 PM
How long have you been playing? What books have you read?
avsfan
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 1:16 PM
QUOTE (BeanGW)
Hi. Post some specific hands. Focus on reads you have on opponents, your position, etc.
Generally speaking I will raise 9-9 and above in an unraised pot anywhere, anytime. Sometimes I'll reraise with 9-9 to isolate.
Pocket pairs below that, I'm limping, calling one, folding for two.
What do you do if you have pocket 22's on the button pre flop and Utg raises and everyone up to you calls ?
CobaltBlue
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 2:07 PM
QUOTE (avsfan)
What do you do if you have pocket 22's on the button pre flop and Utg raises and everyone up to you calls ?
Obviously, he's calling.
len, raising anything below 99 from EP is generally not a good idea. That said, you can profitably raise some of the middle and lower pairs from later position...particularly if it's an open-raise. When playing short-handed, you really need to be raising most pairs pre-flop.
Also, don't freeze up when an overcard flops in this situation against one or two opponents. Obviously, be careful it's an ace. And, if there are two or three overcards, you should be very cautious.
avsfan
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 2:38 PM
QUOTE (CobaltBlue)
QUOTE (avsfan)
What do you do if you have pocket 22's on the button pre flop and Utg raises and everyone up to you calls ?
Obviously, he's calling.
One off the button you again have 22 5 ppl limp to you?
lenmccart
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 7:37 PM
QUOTE
How long have you been playing? What books have you read?
I have only been playing for about 6 months now. I've read a number of books that I got from the library. Harrington 1, Caro's Book of Tells, Hellmuth's book (i know...i know), and I just bought Small Stakes Hold 'Em, which is excellent and has already vastly improved my game.
So far I am in the black overall (like I said before, I play the micro stakes, so its not much in the black...but its something). At this stage in my game I am just trying to make sure I make the proper play most of the time. BUt as i said before, I still play too passively. I plan on getting Poker Tracker and I think that will help analyze my game a lot. But I already know half the problem! I feel pretty confident on my pre-flop game, but just because I play fairly tight. I will every once in a while make an attempt at stealing the blinds, but only if the position and table warrants it. My main focus is going to have to be making the correct post flop play. Right now I tend to call down when I have a good hand...even if I know they have a better one. I assume that is a common rookie mistake. I'd like to get in a bunch of play in the coming month beacuse I will be taking a trip out to LA to visit my sister and we are going to go to Vegas for a night. I'd like to play in a small buy in tournament there (reccomendations?).
I appreciate all the help you have given me so far...I'd like to continue this type of dialouge throughout my progress and I can give update reports often. Maybe I can be your prize student! I play on Full Tilt and Power Player (with the free $25). I've cashed out for $90 on Power Player and I just need a little longer to get that bonus there, so thats good. I think on Full Tilt I am about $1.50 down, but I should be clearing the bonus soon. We'll just start over and I'll start keeping track daily of my wins/losses and any questionable hands.
Again...thanks everyone who is involved!
Flip
Disc_Golf
Tuesday, September 6th, 2005, 7:54 PM
If you are playing tight, that is great. You are already ahead of the competition. Now, make sure that you are almost always coming in for a raise. Push that edge. Also, if you raised preflop, you should lead out on the flop about 75% of the time, whether you hit your hand or not.
Over time you will learn which flops are safer to stab at.
Good luck and put up some hand histories for us to look at.
lenmccart
Wednesday, September 7th, 2005, 4:57 AM
QUOTE
One off the button you again have 22 5 ppl limp to you?
Judging by the responses I am getting here, I should probably just limp here as well. The only calls I would be getting from the potentially 8 people in the pot would be better hands than me. I figure if I raise, and I get isolated, I am still, at best, a coin flip to win the hand. I don't think that should be the hand that I try to make moves on. Obviously, if its a tournament and I am short stacked, its a different story.
I just can't imagine that raising in this situation would be +EV (picked that term up yesterday!).
Thoughts, corrections, snide remarks?
CobaltBlue
Wednesday, September 7th, 2005, 4:20 PM
Occasionally, you'll have people advocate raising in a huge pot pre-flop with 22...but it's generally best to just play limp-along.
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