Lets say we have a villain with reasonable stats like 22/18/2 and has a fold to 3bet of 70%

He plays 40BB deep.

He opens a pot from MP for 4BB, making the total pot 5.5BB

He will only fold to your three bet, or shove over top of it, and nothing in between.


Say we're in the CO/Button. What range of hands are we three betting? How big are we making our three bets? Do we ever fold any of our 3-bet range to a shove?

It seems to me that we'd want to make the minimum raise with those constraints. If our hand is worth playing for all our chips, we get the money in and if it's not then we lose the minimum.


I realize there's more to the question than that, but I wanted to get that in there.

I've never had good luck vs short stacks and I wish they were ****ing outlawed.

Good point except we're not HU. There are still other players in the pot so I think trying to exploit this by min-raising trash would be -EV. Also, what range is *good enough* to play for all our chips if it is a HU shove we're facing?

I've heard (am not sure and don't feel like thinking) that if villain folds to your 3bet more than 67% you can 3bet any two and show a profit. So I'd 3bet really wide to 10bbs in position 12bbs OOP and I'd fold all of my hands that weren't 3betting for value. Basically I'd call with AQ+ TT+.

+1

I like

Problem is if he's paying attention he'll quickly pick up on the fact that you're 3-betting wide and he'll adjust.

You'd be surprised. Most people have a style that they are comfy playing and a style they are not comfy playing at all. Instead of adjusting he'll probably swear a lot at his monitor and think about how happy he'll be to shove on you for value when he gets a big hand. Folding to 3bets 70% is not outrageous or anything, it's a little too tight, especially for only having 40bbs.

Once you get to things like 3-4-5 betting, even if you spot something in the villain that is a leak it's difficult to pull the trigger on 4bet bluffing a lot more if you aren't used to 4betting and folding. It feels like you are lighting money on fire when it doesn't work.

This is a funnier rant in person, just sayin...

A lot of the decent shortstackers are massive multitablers, and don't notice that we are exploiting them. The one or two tabling shortstackers are usually too stupid to notice or do anything about it.

It's very rare to find a shortstacker that will adjust correctly to our light 3 betting and if they do we can always readjust.

FWIW in this example: 1. most short stackers buy in for 20bbs. 2. most short stackers do NOT fold to 3bet% 70%. 3. Most short stackers 3bet like mofos.

So I think the example is very much the exception to the rule.

It depends on what network you're playing on. AP/UB requires a min of 40BB's. Also there are plenty of times when shortstackers double and stay, or there's that semi-ok player who loses a pot and doesn't reload.

I just find it interesting that with 1/10th of the stack, the short stack size has essentially committed the entire 3-bet for value range.


Also, it's very doubtful that the short stacker will be able to adjust due to the hit+quit nature of the strategy.

I disagree with one point before me, the shortstacker doesn't have a ton of room to "adjust" so unless they have a great hand and standard raise, with they would have done anyways, then 4-bet shove, which if they had a good hand thye were already doing we SHOULD probe them a lot. Use a deeper stack and position to your advantage and evaluate your hand when you get played back at. Mostly they don't pay attention and it is easier for them to got to a different table then stay and adjust.