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Full Version: I 3-bet But He Didn't Fold. Now What?
FCP Poker Forum > Poker Strategy Forum > No Limit Texas Hold'em Cash Games
AimHigher
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG ($9.85)
MP ($20.50)
Button ($18.35)
Hero (SB) ($10.05)
BB ($16.25)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A, 10
2 folds, Button bets $0.40, Hero raises to $1.50, 1 fold, Button calls $1.10

Flop: ($3.10) 10, 9, 8 (2 players)
Hero?

Villain is 18/17/3/~100
trystero
What's his steal %? His 3-bet call %? Do you know much about his game?
Solar
I think I go ahead and bet here. He could easily have a hand like Aj, Aq, Kq that we really don't want to be giving free cards to. We're pretty much never getting anything out of small pairs so we just have to hope for now he doesn't have JJ or a set. I bet $2
AimHigher
QUOTE (trystero @ Saturday, April 18th, 2009, 5:40 PM) *
What's his steal %? His 3-bet call %? Do you know much about his game?


I don't have those stats handy since I just use RealTime HUD. A lot of those hands were from a previous session so I don't know too much about him.
trystero
We shouldn't be 3-betting ATo OOP if we don't have that sort of information. For all we know he could be very tight even in position, or he could fold to almost all 3-bets - in which case we'd fold out worse/etc, and we should be 3-betting lightly w/other types of hands. We don't need those specific stats, per se, but some read on his play, both pre and post, would definitely help.

So fold pf, IMO.
mtdesmoines
QUOTE (AimHigher @ Saturday, April 18th, 2009, 8:33 AM) *
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG ($9.85)
MP ($20.50)
Button ($18.35)
Hero (SB) ($10.05)
BB ($16.25)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A, 10
2 folds, Button bets $0.40, Hero raises to $1.50, 1 fold, Button calls $1.10

Flop: ($3.10) 10, 9, 8 (2 players)
Hero?

Villain is 18/17/3/~100




FPS

Check call mode IMHO
Dubey
I check/call re-eval turn.
Nashtak
I would lead out for 3 here.

Obviously you would have wanted to end this preflop but the flop is pretty good for you.

1. If he had an ace with a big kicker, you now have him dominated.
2. If he had an overpair, he would have probably re-raised; your 3bet shown strength so he shouldn't be affraid of you folding. The only overpair i see him call you 90% of the time preflop are jacks.


I definitely don't want to give him a free card here. Hands like AJ, KJ, AQ, KQ could be drawing to a straight (QJ has you beaten already). All these hands could be drawing to a flush too but you have the ace of hearts so only KJ and KQ could be drawing to a flush (QJ has you beaten already).

If he's on a draw, a bet of 3 here would give him 2 to 1 odds so he might call. From that point, re-eval the turn.
AimHigher
QUOTE (mtdesmoines @ Tuesday, April 21st, 2009, 4:53 PM) *
FPS

Check call mode IMHO


I have a hand that rates to be slightly ahead of a typical 18/17's button opening range, but I'm OOP so rather than call and have to check/fold the flop a lot, I 3-bet because a. I expect him to fold enough for it to be profitable and b. even if he does call I'll have control of the hand and he'll fold to a flop cbet a huge percentage of the time.
mtdesmoines
QUOTE (AimHigher @ Wednesday, April 29th, 2009, 11:22 AM) *
I have a hand that rates to be slightly ahead of a typical 18/17's button opening range, but I'm OOP so rather than call and have to check/fold the flop a lot, I 3-bet because a. I expect him to fold enough for it to be profitable and b. even if he does call I'll have control of the hand and he'll fold to a flop cbet a huge percentage of the time.



OK, that's reasonable. So what happened next?
AimHigher
QUOTE (mtdesmoines @ Wednesday, April 29th, 2009, 8:59 PM) *
OK, that's reasonable. So what happened next?


I almost got myself stacked but rivered an ace. icon_frown.gif

FWIW, I'm not saying the 3-bet is correct, just contending that I did have reasons for doing it. I just overlooked one consideration which is that my ROI will be horrible and I'll be OOP the times when I get flatted.
Dictius
QUOTE (AimHigher @ Thursday, April 30th, 2009, 9:30 AM) *
I almost got myself stacked but rivered an ace. icon_frown.gif

FWIW, I'm not saying the 3-bet is correct, just contending that I did have reasons for doing it. I just overlooked one consideration which is that my ROI will be horrible and I'll be OOP the times when I get flatted.



This is a pretty important consideration imo.

It's never horrible to play tight OOP.
NoBBiR
QUOTE (trystero @ Sunday, April 19th, 2009, 9:08 AM) *
We shouldn't be 3-betting ATo OOP if we don't have that sort of information. For all we know he could be very tight even in position, or he could fold to almost all 3-bets - in which case we'd fold out worse/etc, and we should be 3-betting lightly w/other types of hands. We don't need those specific stats, per se, but some read on his play, both pre and post, would definitely help.

So fold pf, IMO.


+1
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