Blinds are at 2k-4k with a 500 ante.

We have about 85k in our stack, average stack is 96k (2.4 million chips in play) and there are 25 players remaining...payout is VERY top heavy. $65k for first and $4.5k for 9th.

No reads as the tables were just shuffled at 27 players remaining and we haven't played with either of the players involved before.

utg player limps for 4k
We raise with QQ from utg+1 to 17k
player in middle position re-raises all in for 62k total.

limper basically states that he has AK, tanks for a bit and then folds.

93.5k in the pot right now and 45k to call

What's your play after vomiting?

I reluctantly call and quickly order a drink.

I'm guessing the shover has 77-JJ or AK/AQ. It is my opinion that shover is hoping to have enough equity in this squeeze play to getboth parties to fold. If AA, he would simply call, imo. With KK, he would do the same to see a flop to see if an A comes, at which point he can get out without putting his tourney life on the line.

By the same token, this kind of play could happen with AA, possibly KK, and the shover is hoping the raiser (you) will read him as weak and call, but I think it's highly unlikely shover has AA/KK.

And "knowing" the folder has AK:

I call.

You would shove AA/KK here with his stack for value. Calling 1/3 of his stack in this position would be RIDICULOUSLY strong. And if you're in this spot with KK, there's no way you flat and let AJ/AK or any other random ace get there. AA and KK are certainly included in his range, but I also think 77+ and AQs+ is his correct range.

Gotcha...that's why you are playing tournies like this and I am grinding crappy MTT's on Stars ;-)

Knowing this is a new table, do you spot any reads on the shover? When and how he looked at his cards, what he did after he looked, what his actions were during the shovage, etc...Likeliest tell would be length of time for his decision. He's looking at a limper and a raiser...

Pot is 10.5K + 4K + 17K = 31.5K + 62K shove = 93.5K

His shove gives a little better than 2:1 odds for a call. I guess I'm saying that, given there are only 2 hands that have you crushed and you suspect an A and a K have just been folded (thereby reducing the possibility of being up against AA/KK by 25%), those are pretty sweet odds.

Regards!

I am calling.

With the blinds this high, compared to what you would be left with. IDK, that is tough. You would still have some play left, but I personally could not see laying this down. Especially with the payouts they way they are, you are going to have to double at some point to have a shot and I am guessing the most likely scenario is an AIPF to get there because of the blinds.

Yeah, I call.

Before doing the math, I'm probably calling here. Since the pot is already pretty big, I don't think the shover's range is incredibly strong. He can be doing this with hands much worse than ours because the pot is already pretty big relative to stack sizes. While I agree that AA/KK are part of his range here, I think the odds are pretty low given the fact that utg basically said he has AK, as well as the fact that his range here is pretty big.

I might not include 77-88, simply because utg limping followed by utg+1 raising might not be a good time a shove middle pp's like 77 & 88.

Pretty +EV call, imo.

First, I apologize for puking and tip whoever cleans it up a hundo.

Then, I would call. I'd put the all-in guy on 1010+, AKo, AKs.... maybe AQss, but with no reads it's obviously tough. I would consider that to be the standard iso-shoving range in a spot like that, although I'm not completely sure if it's too tight.

hellmuthian snap call obv

This is one of those that I would be like, "Ugh, you have Aces or Kings you got me. Sigh. I call." Then you see he flips 99. And you're like, "Sweet!!" And all you're thinking about is "Cool, I'm gonna double up!!" Flop 87A "Hold!" Turn 6 "Dammit!! Hold ONE TIME!! NO 5, 9 or 10!! C'mon ONE TIME!! HOLD!!"





































































River 9.
"Motherfucker!! What the fuck!?! Can I run good ONE FREAKIN' TIME!!! God, what the hell do I have to do to run good ONE TIME!!"
Then to make things worse, someone at the other side of the table says, "Wow, I folded a 9."

gg

lol@Gallo

I don't see where the vomiting comes in. Your M is, what, 8? 9? Looks like a fist-pump instashove to me, and if you're beat or you get drawn out on, that's the nature of the beast.

ETA: After looking at responses, mk is the only one who agrees? Huh.

I do things in the opposite order: I call, see AA, and then vomit.

Funny fact: not only does knowing that an A and a K are out decrease the chance of villain having AA or KK, it also decreases that chance more than the chance he has AK. There are now 3 AA combinations left, 3KK ones, and 9 AK ones, making the comparative odds 2:3. That's about 3% better than the 3:4 comparative odds with four aces and four kings in the deck. (12 big pairs vs 16 AKs.)

OK, it's not much, and may only induce more vomiting in the end, but still...

we have 15 bbs effective before the hand and are facing unknown opponents. I think that alone would make me lean towards a call. If you beleive UTG it only reduces the chances of AA KK, so I think this is a must call.

I know Al is a waaaay better player than me, but why is this not a snapcall?

I never said it wasn't a snap call, I just wanted other opinions. I also never claimed to be a better player than anyone...actually I'm full of self loathing about my poker skill.

QFT
Check out his blog.
I keed. I keed.

POTW?

no love. I'm saddened.

The vomiting comes into play because you've just grinded for 13 hours to get to this point, finally have a stack that is about 10/24 and come up on this situation. If you're right, you are 2/24, if you're wrong you've got 20k in chips at 2k-4k/500 and if you fold you're about 15/24.

Everything points to snapcall if the limper folds (and I did fwiw) but I don't think any of that makes it any less of a vomit spot.

M is overrated in short stacked live tournaments imo. People make laydowns live that would never be made online...8bb shoves from late position induce folds from players with 50bb's for whatever reason.

There were 2.4 million chips in play which meant at the time the average stack was around 100k, making for an average M of 10 for everyone in the field.

I'd call.

Stacks are getting short for blinds/antes, and villain's around 15BB himself. Unless the shover was pretty tight (and we have no read here so oh well), I'm calling. We'll typically see a wide range here, like QT and 55 wide, and this could even be a stone cold steal attempt. Or it could be a little of both, with a weak ace or T9 that still has some value if called. If he has AA/KK/AK, he'll have to show it to me.

al, you have queens.

Nope.

I think his range should be 99+ AQ+

You're certain villain is that tight here? That's awfully tight for a short stack.

But that's tournament poker. I actually have more sympathy on this than you might think; I have been getting a little fed up with these kinds of situations myself and have been trying to learn cash game play. (I'm just so sick of playing well throughout a tourney, as you say, and then having to depend on winning preflop shove coin flips to make the real money.) It's sort of an ironic paradox, though: when I play cash games, I miss the sense of having the chance to win, to be the last person standing with all the chips. I guess that's why I enjoyed playing the deep stack HU tourneys with no blind increases; but that's not very practical when a match can go on for hours (or, theoretically, forever).

One thing I have thought of: what if they reduced the blinds at the final table? Or periodically raised them for a while to put pressure on the short stacks, then lowered them again to allow some play?

Loosh, I instacalled.

So why post a question about what you considered an easy call? I don't mean that in a harsh way; I'm just puzzled.

For discussion. To see if there is some different perspective. It's how you learn and get better.

Thats what I have been doing wrong all these years.

That range is not tight for the situation. There's a limp utg (which almost gets all live players thinking omg aces) and a 4x from utg+1. It should be failry obvious to him that he's getting called amost every single time.

I'm sorry you were beat but you know you can't fold. I mean everyone in this thread pretty much agreed this is a pretty clear call and these guys LOVE folding.

QUEEEEEEEEN
Q
Q
Q
Q

Did anyone else lol at this post? How could his range be anywhere near this wide?

Did I miss the result??? Or is Loosh assuming Al got beat because he posted this..?

It's probably a good assumption since he posted this. I mean, he probably wouldn't have posted it if he had won the hand and villain showed up with like JJ, AQ or AK

stop attacking the guy. what did he ever do to you?

Sally, where you at?

Loosh is assuming I got beat because I'm me.

I haven't posted (on here) what the result was.

As am I.
Post it already dangit, we all want to know what hand sucked out on you!!


Edit:Hmmm, me thinks you sucked out on AA or KK and binked a Q. nh, wp, gl

I read your blog...

...Good luck tomorrow (today...?)

I called and turned up QQ, and he tabled KK. I lost the pot and the chance to run up to second in chips with 25 remaining. Oh wells. BTW, an Ace flopped and if the UTG AK had re-shoved, I'd have folded and saved myself some chips.

Yeah, you shoulda folded.