As usual, the Pro Bowl is a jopke.

Brett Favre? Really? Putting him in over Chad Pennington is complete horseshit. Pennington has more yards and a passer rating ten points higher. He also has the fewest INTs in the league....whereas Favre LEADS THE ****ING LEAGUE in INTs. They might as well not have this game anymore. (Not to mention Favre is working with Cotchery and Coles....Chad is working with, um, Ted Ginn and Greg Camarillo and Davone Bess. I like those guys but still.)

In the interest of fairness, I will say Ronnie Brown did not deserve to make the Pro Bowl. He just doesnt carry the ball enough; Ricky gets too many carries. Slaton should have gone.

Slaton only started from like the 6th game of the season on, hard to justify isn't it? Even though he split carries I'd say Chris Johnson was a far bigger snub than Slaton.

Some people on ESPN were saying Romo got snubbed but missing 3 games kind of kills his chances unless he played perfectly in his other games and he hasn't.

As I said in another thread, 1st year players RARELY make it. Or the first year any player does well. It's more of a last 2-3 seasons pro bowl.

I agree with pretty much all of that, but your first statement is the truest.

Obviously we're a bit biased toward Miami, but I agree that you can make a pretty good argument for Pennington over Favre (and you can make a really good argument for Rivers over both of them). Unfortunately it's a popularity contest and Favre plays in the biggest city in the country. And Pennington doesn't even have his most reliable receiver (Camarillo) anymore.

The Pro Bowl is worth about 5 minutes of debate, because really it's just stupid.

Rivers and Deangelo Williams are the two biggest snubs that I saw.

Definitely Rivers was snubbed, with Brett Favre getting a popularity vote OBV. Fan voting is a joke, coaches and players should be doing the voting. But what fun would that be for the fans? It's def. a double-edged sword.

I'm just curious why you guys think the guy who QB'd a team to so many close 4th quarter losses should be voted in. Granted I haven't followed them that close this year but I don't remember him playing remarkably well when I did.

Rivers has the best QB rating in the NFL, more touchdowns and yards, and less INTs. Obviously Favre's team has more wins, but that's all he leads in.

Weren't those 4th quarter losses due to the defense not being able to protect a lead?

Those first two games where they lost on last second TD's, he threw for almost 600 yards, 6 TD's and 1 interception.

His season totals are 3,500 yards, 28 TD's, and a 101 QB rating. That QB rating is tops in the NFL.

He had a bad game against an historically good Pittsburgh defense; was that the one game you saw?

edit: Dammit, rocketpoker.

Pro Bowl doesn't mean MVP, it doesn't matter how bad the team has played if you put up the numbers you should be in.

CJ3 is in the pro bowl. Rivers biggest snub. De'Angelo was a big one also along with Forte, but look who is there. Not really anyone that didn't deserve it there. Turner, Portis, ADP. Portis could be the one you take out, but De'Angelo made his case a little late.

I'll look into this more tomorrow.

Your right, I was listening to a show talking about the rookie running backs and how it was easier for one in the AFC to make it than the NFC. I got him mixed up with Matt Forte.

Not everyone agrees with that, especially when it comes to QB's. They are ultimately judged on how how many wins their teams get, and Rivers team isn't even going to end up with a 500 record. And those loses are not all on the defense.

OBV and all those Jets win are not on Favre.

I mean by the numbers put up at the position I would have taken Pennington over Favre also as well, I mean 17 INT is just not a good year regardless of TD pass totals. I think he has like 21 TD's to 17 INT's which is not good. Pro Bowl should be for players who have good years regardless of the team's success, the team success will come into play with the POY and MVP talks.

I'm not making a case for Farve. But there can only be one MVP, so the pro-bowl is the next best thing. Exspecially since a lot of players have incentives tied into their contracts.

Also if you look at what the Jets have done compared to the Chargers... you can see why Favre is getting the love. You can make similar cases for Kerry Collins and Matt Cassel actually. The AFC is kind of weird for QB's this year.

I completely understand why Favre is getting the love over Rivers, but that doesn't mean it is correct. 3,500 YDS 28 TD 11 INT is better than 3,000 21 TD 17 INT, agreed?

As stated by Fryer earlier. Pro Bowlers regularly get the nod the year after they first deserve it (rookies and younger players), but also receive it in a year too long (Favre'ish players).

Statistically yes, but the QB's are the teams leaders and their fortunes rise and fall with the team more than any other position. Chargers were supposed to be title contenders, the Jets average, one exceeded expectations and one fell way flat.

Agreed, but swap in the Dolphins instead of the Chargers into your argument.

IS the pro bowl completely decided by just fan votes or are there other factors?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_bowl

thank you.

I bet you are all going to be shocked by me saying this but, JOSH CRIBBS.
Not only is he one of the leagues best kick returner, punt returner, and special teams tackler, but he is also a QB, WR, and HB. AND, the Browns punter is hurt and might not play on Sunday and Josh will be the backup because he's the third string punter.
So this year, Cribbs might play kick returner, punt returner, special teams tackler, QB, WR, HB, and punter. Talk about a utility man that deserves to be in Hawaii.

Even you people who hate me cannot deny that Josh is an outstanding football player that deserves to be in Hawaii.

A QB? He is 0 for 2.

A WR? 2 catches for 18 yards

A RB? 124 yrds total rushing 2.2 yrds/carry

Lets look at what he does do well.

Kick Returns
6th in return avg in the AFC
6th in total return yards in the AFC

Punt Returns
9th in the AFC in avg
6th in the AFC for total yards

Yeah he is for sure a lock for the PB.

Yeah, but you totally glossed over special teams tackler and 3rd string punter.

18 tackles

No punting records.

Dammit, I was wrong again. He should be inducted to the HoF right after his performance playing both sides of the ball in Hawaii in Feb.

Sorry showstopper, my bad.

Wow...

OWNED!!!



http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3re9l_owned-by-gifs_fun

[quote name='Jadaki' date='Thursday, December 18th, 2008, 8:47 AM' post='2935958']
you can see why Favre is getting the love.





no, we cant. Rivers, Pennington, Cassel and Kerry Collins all were much much more deserving.

I am so sick of the unabashed Favre love. The guy has been a mediocre QB for YEARS now. I cant stand it. I hope sooooo much that the Dolphins knock them out of the playoffs and then both the Packers and Favre can go sit at home for the postseason.

Thomas Jones, Kris Jenkins, Alan Faneca and Darrelle Revis are the reasons the Jets could make the playoffs. Favre has not been much of an upgrade at all. By pretty much every measure we have, Pennington has had a better year than Favre.

But he's a gunslinger!

Phillip Rivers, Chad Pennington, Matt Cassell, Kerry Collins and hell I'd even take Tyler Thigpen's numbers over Favre's this year. Turning the ball over as many times as he has is just not Pro Bowl caliber. John Madden probably spent every free minute he had casting votes for Brett!

You are my hero. FRPOTD (Football Related Post of the Day)

With this explanation Eli should have been last year and the year the ravens won Dilfer should have been there.

And with that explanation Ben Rothlisberger, Kerry Collins and either Pennington, Cassell or Favre should also be going to the Pro Bowl.

Believe me I always thought Favre was great. Yeah he did force a ton of things but he got the job done. However with this whole Jets thing this year it really made me look down on him.

You know years past Cribbs has been great, but you have to admit that the browns this year have been extremely disappointing. Makes you really wonder also about Edwards.

What I think....

AFC Roster Offense-
QB-Peyton Manning, INDY- Starting is definitely fine by me here. 3500 or so yards and 23/12 (not as stellar as in the past) but leading your team to seven straight W's after starting 3-4 deserves a start imo.
QB-Philip Rivers, SD- Without question the biggest snub in the pro bowl. 3500/28/12. The main reason his team is has at least 6 wins. Would be considered for the MVP race if SD's record was much better.
QB-Jay Cutler, DEN- Has some good games mixed in with some bad ones. Has helped lead his team to 8-6 and most likely a playoff birth.

Who got in that didn't deserve to:
Brett Favre, NYJ- Has help lead the Jets to a 3-way tie amongst the AFC East. Yes he will be a first ballot HOF'er, but his timing of throw "the" INT has hurt his team too. If you take out his game v. Arizona in week 4, he would have 15 TD's to go along with 16 INT's

Injury Replacement: (Obviously Philip Rivers, but I'm going on my scale.)
Matt Cassel, NE- Has shown why BB has kept him behind Tom Brady on the depth chart. Has turned from 'game manager' into 'gun-slinger'. Has shown great ability to make key throws, and very well could have a starting job next year. Not to mention the Pats are tied for first in the AFC East.


RB-Thomas Jones, NYJ- 2nd in the AFC in rushing TD's, and leads the conference in yards.
RB-Steve Slaton, HST- When Ahman Green has been injured, this kid has carried the load. Averaging 4.9 a pop and can be a threat in the passing game, he has shown he will be the future of Houston for years to come. The Mario Williams pick looks even greater now.
RB-Chris Johnson, TENN- He gives that Tennessee the offense to hit a homerun at any given time. Has four 100 yard games, and eight touchdowns, even with LenDale getting the majority of the goaline carries.

Who got in that didn't deserve to:
Ronnie Brown, MIA- He has recovered from his ACL Tear after being the only bright spot in the Dolphins 2007 season quite nicely. Has give the NFL a new look being able to run the Wildcat offense to an extreme effect. It comes down to only one 100 yd game in his last 10 with just four TD's.

Injury replacement:
Marshawn Lynch, BUFF- With the passing game struggling greatly, Marshawn has eclipse 100 total yards from scrimmage in four of the last five. One of the main reasons Buffalo has been competitive in games late, and one of only four AFC backs with 1,000 yds.

FB-Le'Ron McClain, BALT- Nearly 700 yards from a fullback not expected to help carry the load. This is an easy pick here.

WR- Andre Johnson, HST- Leads the league in yards and receptions. This kid is a total beast when 100% healthy, and this has been an offense lead by an injury prone Matt Schaub and backup Sage Rosenfels.
WR- Wes Welker, NE- Has been Matt Cassel's goto guy whenever needed. He may only have 2 TD's but he moves the chains when needed with his 102 grabs.
WR- T.J. Houshmandzadeh, CIN- Yes I am a Bengals fan, but T.J. has been the loan bright spot with backup Ryan Fitzpatrick under helm. He has yet to reach the 1,000 yard mark but he's been really the only reason Cincinnati has been able to put up points on the board.
WR- Brandon Marshall, DEN- There has been a few games where he hasn't been all there. Has had some inconsistencies of route running but has solid hands and T.O. like abilities. Was suspened week one but came back in week 2 and 3 with 24 catches for 341 yds and 2 TD.

Who got in that didn't deserve to:
Not a single one of these can be dropped from the AFC Roster without a legit reason

Injury replacement:
Reginald Wayne, IND- Has been Peyton's goto guy to get the job done and has taken the #1 spot away from Marvin.

TE- Tony Gonzalez, KC- Without a doubt the best TE ever to play the game. One pace for more than 1,000 yards and having eight TD's, Tony has shown why week in and week out he is currently still the best TE even in the league, even at his age.
TE- Dallas Clark, IND- Runs the routes that many WR's don't care to run. Takes his fair share of licks and has 60+ catches and over 600 yds with 5 touchdowns.

Not deserving:
Antonio Gates, SD- He is coming off a toe injury that ended his postseason, but he just hasn't been the same pro bowl TE that we are accustomed to. Has yet to have a 100 yard game and just doesn't look that sharp.

Injury replacement:
Owen Daniels, HST- As of late he hasn't been part of the offense in Houston. When Matt Schaub was his quarterback before he sprained his MCL, Owen has a 100 yard game to go along a 2 TD game. Was 2nd in the AFC in catches among TE's going into week 16.

Offensive line.... I'm not going to get to in depth here since I could watch the majority of the games but here's my go at it.
The main change I would make would be taking Jason Peters off of this list and putting in Jake Long. After holding out for a big contract, Peters looked horrendous and rusty after coming back.
Jake Long I believe has either aloud 1 sack or none, starting at left tackle. I'm not completely sure if that's accurate, but if you've aloud that little amount of sacks as a rookie LT, you deserve to goto the Pro Bowl.

Next to come, AFC Defense.

I'm not a Favre fan, so I'm not defending him. But when a big name QB changes teams, and that team is suddenly in the playoff hunt (and lets not forget the big win vs TN happened while voting was ongoing) then no one should be surprised that he got in.

That pro bowl voting is finished before the regular season is over is the really silly part of the process.

1) if CP was the QB of the jets, I bet they have at least one more win this season.
2) if you take the Arizona game off the books, favre has more interceptions than touchdowns
3) the jets are no lock for the playoffs
4) Phillip Rivers is having a disgusting statistical season. You can poo poo that all you want, but before you do let me just show you what you are poo pooing...


64 percent completion percentage, 3515 yards, 28 td's 11 ints 101.4 qb rating.


That's a sick year, and deserving of the pro bowl.