ok, other than I should've raised preflop (I had been making a lot of moves already so I chickened out) what do we think about the turn bet and the river c/c

Poker Stars
Limit Omaha Ring game
Limit: $0.50/$1
9 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (9 players) hero is MP3 with 8 4 T A
4 folds, hero calls (1.5:1), CO folds, Button calls (2.5:1), SB calls (3.5:0.5), BB checks.

Flop: J Q 5 (4SB, 4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, hero checks, Button checks.

Turn: 9 (2BB, 4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, hero bets, Button calls (3:1), 2 folds.

River: 5 (4BB, 2 players)
hero checks, Button bets, hero calls (5:1).

Results:
Final pot: 6BB

if this was pl i would pot that flop 100% of the time.


im not sure about limit though. you have some equity here and you really want a2s a3s and 23s to fold, but the pot is really small.

Huh? you would pot that flop?! Wow, please tell me where you play and your online username. My kids need some new shoes.

Why are you calling with an A4 to begin with? Because it's suited? The only time to play an A4 is if you have a 2 or 3...maybe a 5 with it. The fact that you have an 8 in the hand as well means instant muck.

Heres a tip. If you have a 7, 8 or 9 in your hand, it's not good.

Ask around. A48 is garbage. Even suited. You will lose money in the long run if you play this hand.

despite all literature to the contrary, being overly tight in o8 is actually the best way to lose money. i make more money from "TAGs" then i do from crazy maniacs. unless you are playing in games with 6 players to the flop who chase third nut lows you need to open up to win.

the preflop mistake he made was not raising, but he already acknowledged that.

the thing about 7s, 8s and 9s. ill tell you a secret. they don't take away from the value of your hand as quickly as good combos (like a suited a4, the at, and the t8) add to it. and here even the 8 and the 4 stretch to make a straight if you want to get really pedantic about it. saying that an 8 in your hand makes it unplayable is flat out wrong.

and yes, i pot that flop 100% of the time in pl. i could tell you why, but then i would have to kill you.

dude no offense, but if you didn't look at the posts in this forum I've been at this awhile. when all fold to you and you have a suited ace str8 gaps all the way up the board with a lo draw and emergency cf protection the hand is not garbage. I'm not saying it's super strong, but I def prefer a raise to a fold. (if you play the way u say which a lot of people do I'm paying you off like never!) fwiw

Hey Antistuff the point I was looking at was what do you think about checking the river there to induce a worse hand to bet? (as I said if I hadn't been pushing the issue and starting to get resistance I would've raised pre 4sure still feel like I should've)

I'm personally okay with betting out on that turn, especially since you do still have a redraw in case someone has K10. Since you weren't raised on the turn, it's certainly possible that someone just filled up. As played, I check call the river all day long. If you're shown K10 or a boat, you limit your losses. Also, there's a lot of hands that won't pay you off, so there's not a ton of value in you betting the river. I just feel like there's only a small range of hands that will call on that river, and a larger percentage of hands are going to either just fold or raise. Like anti said, if this was PL, it'd be entirely different.

Your hand preflop isn't terrible but it is marginal at best. I would raise preflop (which you already realized) and for sure bet the flop to drive out any one way low draws and thin the field. The turn bet is standard. I think you should have value bet the river, you will get called by a worse hand more then you think and you can fold to a re-raise because he HAS to have you beat to re-raise you.

hilsamania: shows [Kd 7d Qc 8c] (HI: two pair, Queens and Fives)
rvrchsrhtr: shows [8h 4c Ts As] (HI: a straight, Eight to Queen)
rvrchsrhtr collected $5.75 from pot

I don't know that he calls here if I lead

For the record you shouldn't be playing results. But he may call you thinking you were trying to pick up the pot on the turn.

i agree about leading the river. i think he raises the turn with a hand that would have boated up.

what hand would he raise there? the str8 came in on the turn and I led out. If I lead and he raises I have to fold. If I lead and all he has is a busted draw he folds. The only hands I see him calling a bet on the end with is a big two pair maybe

if you've been making lots of moves and playing like a maniac i might call that river against you with as little as AQ.

so i guess it depends on what you think he thinks of you. but the way you described yourself you have set yourself up to make lots of thin value bets.

I see your point, and yeah I'd probably call myself with AQ too, but I do think it's pretty close

I don't have much to add on this one that anti didn't cover.. I just wanted to bold that in case anyone reading this thread missed that.. It's the $$$ quote for sure.

FWIW i limp that hand PF, too. Especially if i've been active. Its awfully hard to get the button to lay down anything solid + the blinds to run away screaming from a late-middle position raise. And lord knows AT84 isn't the kind of hand i'm looking to play against 1-2 random hands for 2 bets cold. Of course, I usually have a general sense of the players i'm set to pick on in my blind wheelhouse, so I could definitely raise here if the table has been overly tight. I still wouldn't fault anyone for limping, although it's hard to strike gold flopping the joint in an unraised pot. /shrug.