PokerStars Game #20548538494: Triple Draw 2-7 Lowball Limit ($1/$2) - 2008/09/20 6:24:50 ET
Table 'Latona' 6-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: iMaLiVeFiSh ($36.25 in chips)
Seat 2: millesimo ($49.25 in chips)
Seat 3: Crumbino ($56.75 in chips)
Seat 4: antistuff ($30.50 in chips)
Seat 5: kristisnake ($35.50 in chips)
Seat 6: BostonAustin ($33 in chips)
millesimo: posts small blind $0.50
Crumbino: posts big blind $1
*** DEALING HANDS ***
Dealt to antistuff [7s Ks 2s 3c Td]
antistuff: raises $1 to $2
kristisnake: calls $2
BostonAustin: calls $2
iMaLiVeFiSh: folds
millesimo: folds
Crumbino: folds
*** FIRST DRAW ***
antistuff: discards 2 cards [Ks Td]
Dealt to antistuff [7s 2s 3c] [Qs 3d]
kristisnake: discards 2 cards
BostonAustin: discards 1 card
antistuff: checks
kristisnake: checks
BostonAustin: checks
*** SECOND DRAW ***
antistuff: discards 2 cards [Qs 3d]
Dealt to antistuff [7s 2s 3c] [5h 4d]
kristisnake: discards 1 card
BostonAustin: discards 1 card
antistuff: bets $2
kristisnake: raises $2 to $4
BostonAustin: calls $4
antistuff: calls $2
*** THIRD DRAW ***
antistuff: stands pat on [7s 2s 3c 5h 4d]
kristisnake: stands pat
BostonAustin: discards 1 card
antistuff: checks
kristisnake: bets $2
BostonAustin: folds
antistuff: raises $2 to $4
kristisnake: calls $2
*** SHOW DOWN ***
antistuff: shows [7s 5h 2s 3c 4d] (Lo: 7,5,4,3,2)
kristisnake: mucks hand
antistuff collected $26.50 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $27.50 | Rake $1
Seat 1: iMaLiVeFiSh (button) folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 2: millesimo (small blind) folded before the Draw
Seat 3: Crumbino (big blind) folded before the Draw
Seat 4: antistuff showed [7s 5h 2s 3c 4d] and won ($26.50) with Lo: 7,5,4,3,2
Seat 5: kristisnake mucked [8h 2c 5c 3h 4h]
Seat 6: BostonAustin folded after the 3rd Draw

i think i get bostonAustin for another bet or even two here a decent amount of the time.

worth the risk? if i go to three on the turn she is never ever capping without a #1 or a #2.

I agree, a reraise on the turn screams huge hand. Flat calling makes it look like you're not quite prepared to go to town with your hand.

Not entirely crazy about the predraw raise since you'll be drawing 2 most likely OOP.

never open limp in 2-7. ever. i know this is a common mantra in lhe also, and i actually disagree with it there rather strongly, but in 2-7 i agree with it.

in fact, the instances where it seems to make sense to not either raise or fold predraw are rather rare, mostly involving being in the blinds or in multiway pots with a marginal hand (278 or something like that).

I would re-raise on the 3rd draw, I think you will earn extra bets this way then by just flat calling the bet on the 3rd draw and raising the river. Then again my image may be different then yours as I am capable of making a play with a 9 there.

I agree with anitstuff, there are few if any situations where you open limp in 2 to 7 TD. Plus the majority of hands you will be playing are 2 card draws so when you do raise it will scream of strength if you never raise with a 2 card draw. There are even situations where you should be raising with 3 card draws.

these guys don't know image, they draw to 8s or better and then raise 85 or better and call down with anything else. if they get to the last draw sometimes they will call with a jack or a ten. thats it, thats their entire strategy.

for them a 3 bet on a big bet street means that i have 23457. taking them to 3 town with a nine here is crazy, the fact that she raised my bet in the first place means that she is never folding. i am getting looked up with 86753 here (although i give her credit for at least an 86). (edit: at least an 86, lol)


however, calling stations that they are, if bostonaustin makes an 8 or better i am taking him and kristin for two bets each on the third draw.

something that i didnt think of at the time is that if i take it to three on the second draw bostonaustin is always going to call and kristin is going to pay me off, so thats a guaranteed extra bet at least plus i might get the whole shebang if boston makes a hand. so in retrospect, you are right, a reraise is correct, although i think we have different reasons for why we think so.

No we are on the same page, I should of clarified that I am capable of re-raising with a 9 here IF and thats a big if, my opponent is capable of breaking a 8, if they will call with the 8 and never break I would just muck a rough 9.

Why? There are two reasons that make me question this: 1) it seems that most of one's profits in this game (at least at the lower stakes) come from nailing players who overplay or chase marginal hands, so wouldn't you want to keep those players in the hand rather than chasing them out with raises?; 2) the difference between this game and hold em is that you can't disguise your hand to anywhere near the same degree in TD as you can in HE. When you draw cards, you give away lots of information. When you raise predraw and then draw 2, everyone in the hand knows pretty well where you stand. When you're doing so out of position, you put yourself at a huge disadvantage.

A 732 draw is actually a premium draw, you should not only be raising with it but also re-raising plus if you always limp with a 2 card draw you are to predictable even at the lower stakes.

I suck at all draw poker, but talking about poker in general i can say this. If you have a better than average hand, like a 732 pre-first-draw, and you can get your opponents to pay to play for a raise rather than a call, then you should raise; thereby pushing your equity edge and getting max value. If the players REALLY overplay/chase, then they'll pay two bets rather than one - and that's a good thing.

What are the odds of a 237 draw completing?

Not exactly sure. But its a favorite over almost every 2 card draw.

good players will instamuck to your raise on the end, but that works fine against idiots. nh '


it's worth saying that we're always raising preflop more for buying the button than we are for value. it's like razz in that very few hands are too far ahead of any other (assumign they're all 3-cd hands that aren't str8 draws) predraw.

Okay, but the challenge of raising it OOP is that you could end up against at least one 1-card draw (as happened in this hand). Boston obviously didn't complete his draw, but I can't imagine that 237 stacks up very well against 1-card draws.

Besides pat hands there is no hand where you are going to be in that bad of shape.

Does anyone have the numbers or know how to calculate them? It would be very informative to know the percentages of these kinds of situations.

it's actually not that important for 2-7, since any equity you're losing by 3towning a 3 cd hand that's behind into a better 3 cd hand will be offset by the blinds coming into the pot as dead money and the metagame extra value you're going to get when you're dealt a pat hand. predraw, just shove and pray .