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tskillz187
Villain and I have quite a bit of history. I have my stats update to last 100 hands, so right now he's a 24/22/3, but previously I have had him as high as 45/42/2ish. Basically I think he likes to play LAG but might have gone card dead last 100 hands, or adapted to a super donk at the table, by just nitting up (for him) and waiting to value town him.

I'll take criticism on all streets, I usually raise this PF, but CO is a mega donk who I have been raising quite a bit PF and I feel like he could spazz shove on me, which I don't feel like dealing with right now, also SB and BB 3 bet from the blinds an okay amount, though they haven't done it in 2 opportunities with my button raises yet.

Absolute Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed) Absolute-Poker Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($100.90)
UTG ($23.60)
MP ($41.71)
CO ($79.40)
Hero ($84.20)
SB ($82.05)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q, K.
1 fold, MP calls $0.50, CO calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, 1 fold, BB checks.

Flop: ($2.25) 6, 7, K (4 players)
BB bets $1.5, MP folds, CO folds, Hero calls $1.50.

Turn: ($5.25) 3 (2 players)
BB bets $3.5, Hero calls $3.50.

River: ($12.25) T (2 players)
BB bets $4.5, Hero...


Criticism on all streets, please. I thought the hand played out weird, maybe it's a standard raise on the flop, meh.
No_Neck
I am a showdown monkey, so I show down here smile.gif decent price on the river he could think JJ is good ect.

And you have a history so he knows you are a drooler
rdtedm
I definitely like raising the flop. Cant decide wheter to raise or call the river, but its definitely not a fold.
SCS
Until CO starts to play back at us, I'd raise KQs on the button against 2 limpers every time. Also, I wouldn't expect the blinds to 3 bet me that often since I'm raising 2 limpers and not opening. But you'd have a better idea about how they play than I do.

I'd raise the flop here. You most likely have the best hand, and villain will call with a wide range, including straight and flush draws, and worst Kings.
SCS
QUOTE (rdtedm @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 1:35 PM) *
I definitely like raising the flop. Cant decide wheter to raise or call the river, but its definitely not a fold.



I don't like a raise on the river. We may get villain to fold KT, but that's probably just wishful thinking.
tskillz187
FWIW I've never seen him throw such a small bet out on the river. For me, I'd be more inclined to call a bigger bet on this river against this villain. But then again the bet is soooo small.

On the flop I thought villain was bet/3betting so much of his range, it also makes later streets difficult to play if he calls me. Maybe I'm just a call station donk now, I dunno.
rdtedm
QUOTE (SCS @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 11:41 AM) *
I don't like a raise on the river. We may get villain to fold KT, but that's probably just wishful thinking.


Why does villains range only hold one K.. K10? He's in the BB so he can pretty much have any K here and bet like this.
SCS
QUOTE (rdtedm @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 1:52 PM) *
Why does villains range only hold one K.. K10? He's in the BB so he can pretty much have any K here and bet like this.


Do you think villain plays K8, K9, etc this way?

What hands that we beat is villain calling a river raise with? What hands that villain has that beat us are folding?
NoBBiR
I think given that you called the turn assuming he did not hit a flush and that you were not drawing dead, the way you called him down and the awesome price on the end all add up to make this a call.

I don't particularly like it though.

I'd love a raise OTB preflop though. Isolate those limpers ftw. I see you've gone over this, but I think if you're only worried about the donk CO limp/shoving on you that you should still be raising with position. I'm not saying I'd like him to shove, but I feel like people (retard fish especially) don't do this often enough to use as a reason not to still raise preflop.
tskillz187
I think I'm more worried that SB or BB 3bet me than donk check shoving. Donk/CO though is difficult to play with in bloated pots if I don't flop best, he's effing crazy.

I think maybe I give SB and BB too much credit for 3betting wider than they are though, just because I know they are solid players. They also have incentive to want to bluff me because they hate me.
Giggidy
I like raising the flop too.

As played I call teh river
NoSup4U
I definitely raise pf here. You have a great hand and the button.

For those that want to raise his flop bet, what is your plan if:
A) He shoves
B ) He calls and checks turn to you? (and what if turn isn't a spade?)

As played I call river.

Mark
Syous
I'm so tilted by pf. Who cares if he shoves on you, as mark said, you have a great hand and the button. RAISEYDAISEY!!!!!

I don't play this hand differently as played

any info on teh bb?
tskillz187
QUOTE (Syous @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 1:52 PM) *
I'm so tilted by pf. Who cares if he shoves on you, as mark said, you have a great hand and the button. RAISEYDAISEY!!!!!

I don't play this hand differently as played

any info on teh bb?


Alright, I'm raising it in the future.

BB is a solid player that I'd prefer not to tangle with. I see him get in ridiculous spots with the CO/donk, with very odd hands, he also played a session where he 3bet me like everytime, and eventually he had KK>AT aipf against me.

I think he thinks I'm weak/tight.
Sheiky
I play post flop the same
Syous
QUOTE (tskillz187 @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 2:07 PM) *
Alright, I'm raising it in the future.

BB is a solid player that I'd prefer not to tangle with. I see him get in ridiculous spots with the CO/donk, with very odd hands, he also played a session where he 3bet me like everytime, and eventually he had KK>AT aipf against me.

I think he thinks I'm weak/tight.


it doesn't mean he's gonna cold 3bet you just because u're raising ur button. And you can always 4b bluff or call since you have positino if this happens.

That makes river a bit interesting. If he thinks a big bet will blow you off, oh man a fold is so close imo w/that underbet there. But he could also be a retard and think a small bet ont he river would be a nice cheap bluff lol
simo_8ball
QUOTE (tskillz187 @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 10:07 PM) *
I think he thinks I'm weak/tight.

Only a little. smile.gif

QUOTE (Syous @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 10:51 PM) *
But he could also be a retard


I'd say it's borderline.
pokerinc
I like raising pre and raising the flop donk.


Also like seeing Mark posting more in strat again.


But the later streets I'd just call there. Don't think we'd get there played more aggressively though.
Dictius
don't you want donks spazz shoving on you pf? sure we probably have to fold this time but if we keep annoying him by raising pf and he keeps spazz shoving he's going to do it at the wrong time eventually.
regionx8
Anyone raise the turn here? No reason to belive he has a flush he could have a weak king and bet out on flop. he may have even hit 2 pair here with k6 or k7 considering he was bb and just checked. Turn may be just as scary for you as it is for him. If he calls, river will probably be check/check or if he bets you can be pretty sure you're beat. If he folds a weaker hand you still got 2 streets of value from him betting out.. and there are several hands that he folds that are ahead.
No_Neck
QUOTE (SCS @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 1:41 PM) *
We may get villain to fold KT,




THIS MADE ME SMILE!
simo_8ball
QUOTE (No_Neck @ Friday, August 22nd, 2008, 5:05 PM) *
THIS MADE ME SMILE!

I do think villain would fold KT to a raise on the river.
SCS
QUOTE (simo_8ball @ Friday, August 22nd, 2008, 12:12 PM) *
I do think villain would fold KT to a raise on the river.



That's assuming he does have KT, which is the only hand villain could fold to a river raise imo.
tskillz187
I ended up timing all the way to the end. I really wanted to fold, but I puke/called and Villain showed up with 7s10x.

If turn is checked to us, do we bet?

Edit: Villain is Simo, btw.
No_Neck
QUOTE (simo_8ball @ Friday, August 22nd, 2008, 12:12 PM) *
I do think villain would fold KT to a raise on the river.



maybe to a big one but getting people to fold two pair is kinda silly imo.
SCS
QUOTE (No_Neck @ Friday, August 22nd, 2008, 1:36 PM) *
maybe to a big one but getting people to fold two pair is kinda silly imo.



For a thinking player calling a raise on the river on this board would be pretty tough. Not saying he'd fold, but he'd certainly have to think about making a call here.
simo_8ball
The problem I had was that I'd rivered two pair on a board where every single draw got there (45, 89 and spades).

That's why my bet looks weird. If I bet bigger he doesn't call with worse hands very often, but if I check I have to call a bigger value bet when it's likely I'm beaten.
Sheiky
QUOTE (simo_8ball @ Thursday, August 21st, 2008, 11:06 PM) *
Only a little. smile.gif
I'd say it's borderline.


NoSup4U
Why are people saying villain is going to bet/fold to a raise KT which is top two pair here? And why would we want to bluff raise him when we have top pair?

Hand seems pretty simple imo. Raise pf. Calling and raising flop are both probably fine depending on villain. Call turn (or bet if checked to and flush bricked), Bet or call river. Fold if villain ever raises you.

Mark
trystero
QUOTE (NoSup4U @ Friday, August 22nd, 2008, 3:26 PM) *
Why are people saying villain is going to bet/fold to a raise KT which is top two pair here? And why would we want to bluff raise him when we have top pair?

Hand seems pretty simple imo. Raise pf. Calling and raising flop are both probably fine depending on villain. Call turn (or bet if checked to and flush bricked), Bet or call river. Fold if villain ever raises you.

Mark


^^

You call here because your hand's got showdown value. The price is attractive, and just as you don't "expect" kings to suck out against aces, so you don't "expect" to be good here, if the opponent's competent. But you should at least break-even, and it's usually better to call, both for image purposes and to gain information about his hand (of course, he also gains information about yours, which you can manipulate at a later point and time).
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