the cap on 7th sucked


PokerStars Game #17769326315: 7 Card Stud Limit ($5/$10) - 2008/05/29 - 06:54:25 (ET)
Table 'Euforbo' 8-max
Seat 1: guy7777 ($158.50 in chips)
Seat 2: sz168 ($227.50 in chips)
Seat 4: Saosin007 ($433.50 in chips)
Seat 5: Gatyoll ($206.50 in chips)
Seat 6: marchione ($160 in chips)
Seat 7: 95crane ($339.50 in chips)
Seat 8: nutzforU ($191.50 in chips)
guy7777: posts the ante $0.50
sz168: posts the ante $0.50
Saosin007: posts the ante $0.50
Gatyoll: posts the ante $0.50
marchione: posts the ante $0.50
95crane: posts the ante $0.50
nutzforU: posts the ante $0.50
*** 3rd STREET ***
Dealt to guy7777 [Qh]
Dealt to sz168 [5s]
Dealt to Saosin007 [8s]
Dealt to Gatyoll [3h]
Dealt to marchione [Qc 6c 6d]
Dealt to 95crane [Ad]
Dealt to nutzforU [3c]
nutzforU: brings in for $2
guy7777: folds
sz168: calls $2
Saosin007: folds
Gatyoll: folds
marchione: calls $2
95crane: raises $3 to $5
nutzforU: folds
sz168: folds
marchione: calls $3
*** 4th STREET ***
Dealt to marchione [Qc 6c 6d] [7h]
Dealt to 95crane [Ad] [3d]
95crane: bets $5
marchione: calls $5
*** 5th STREET ***
Dealt to marchione [Qc 6c 6d 7h] [6s]
Dealt to 95crane [Ad 3d] [9s]
marchione: checks
95crane: checks
*** 6th STREET ***
Dealt to marchione [Qc 6c 6d 7h 6s] [7s]
Dealt to 95crane [Ad 3d 9s] [9d]
marchione: bets $10
95crane: calls $10
*** RIVER ***
Dealt to marchione [Qc 6c 6d 7h 6s 7s] [8h]
marchione: bets $10
95crane: raises $10 to $20
marchione: raises $10 to $30
95crane: raises $10 to $40
Betting is capped
marchione: calls $10
*** SHOW DOWN ***
95crane: shows [Jd Jc Ad 3d 9s 9d 9c] (a full house, Nines full of Jacks)
marchione: shows [Qc 6c 6d 7h 6s 7s 8h] (a full house, Sixes full of Sevens)
95crane collected $124.50 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $127.50 | Rake $3
Seat 1: guy7777 folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)
Seat 2: sz168 folded on the 3rd Street
Seat 4: Saosin007 folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Gatyoll folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet)
Seat 6: marchione showed [Qc 6c 6d 7h 6s 7s 8h] and lost with a full house, Sixes full of Sevens
Seat 7: 95crane showed [Jd Jc Ad 3d 9s 9d 9c] and won ($124.50) with a full house, Nines full of Jacks
Seat 8: nutzforU folded on the 3rd Street

Bet 5th. *every single time*.

He expects you to bet. You *have* to bet. If you check, you come off as ridiculously strong and get no money in the pot as the favorite. You check to pray he makes some sort of a hand, but now you are rooting for him to catch miracles in order to even call latter street bets.

You essentially have to lead 6th anyways, so all you've done is delay the action one card, and still have no guarantee he's coming along for the ride. Sure, we only get burned one in, say, twenty times we do this. But checking 5th here is probably only a good idea if all you have is the open pair of sixes and are trying to rep better for later street bluffing. If he's got perceived outs on 6th, he'll call 5th based on the chance you have a ragged two pair or a pair and some sort of draw/naked open pair..

It works in reverse, really: there's a much greater chance he won't believe your bet on 5th and call than there is that checking 5th will allow you to garner extra bets further down the line. He'll need a pair and/or flush/straight possibilites to call you anyways, and those hands will call the bet on 5th. Showing this down also allows your bluffs and semi-bluffs to have a little more bite.

I'll be the first to say Stud hi isn't the strongest part of my HORSE game, but you def want to play as big a pot as you can here against a hand that needs serious help, not delay betting until he's getting a decent price with a legit chance to beat you. If you need extra incentive: you get to see how willing he is to toss a decenter starter against an open pair. Useful information for later hands you play with Villain.

i talked with they guy afterwards ( we have a history) and he admitted 6th was a bad call for him ~ i still got too cute and i came off looking like a fish

thanks for taking the time cappy

Agree with cappy... bet 5th

Definitely screams I have a monster when you check when your door card pairs...

Just think of it in terms of the long run. "this hand" is one hand of many in a poker session. I mentioned checking 5th is a decent play if all you have is that pair of 6s, because it keeps the pot small and gives you additional information: if he bets into your open pair, you're never winning this pot by bluffing and didn't even risk the bluff bet. You still come off strong on 6th when you fire out, and the smaller pot gives him worse pot odds to make a call.

Value betting your monsters allows you the ability to steal pots in later hands. In your shoes, even losing the hand, I'd feel really good about myself if 95% of that money went into the pot in bunches with you as the clear favorite. That's money in your pocket over time: that's the important thing.

Your table image is also extremely important. Some players who play tight may find those kind of offensive checks earn them free cards when you actually are drawing later down the line, which has inherent value as well. I've adopted more of the agressive "Tasmanian Devil McFold"™ method of playing mixed games, and that level of aggression demands that I bet in your shoes in that spot. And even Action Dan Harrington will tell you that any form of slowplaying takes two Tango Partners: you need an aggressive villain who will actually bet for you. If you don't have that, you're just playing a good hand badly.

Here's another random thought to use as a barometer: If you aren't getting action after you've paired your door card, exactly how tight are you playing?

Yeah, I enjoy rambling.