This thread should've been made years ago. I'll start things off.
Lois.
Are all members of the denomination "Church of Christ" saved, or just some of them?
Follow up question. If people in other lands, who haven't heard about Jesus, can be saved through creation (as the Bible states), how is that possible... since they are not members of the denomination "Church of Christ'?
ground floor?
1
Ask Lois.
Started by brvheart, May 22 2007 03:29 PM
146 replies to this topic
#1
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Posted 22 May 2007 - 03:29 PM
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Posted 22 May 2007 - 05:56 PM
I don't see this lifting off the ground....
Of course, my response doesn't help the point I'm making.
If a weird "ask lois" bandwagon DOES start up (I'll give 5-1 that it doesn't... which he'll probably start just because I'm betting against him), I'll probably be a hypocrite and jump in later.
Of course, my response doesn't help the point I'm making.
If a weird "ask lois" bandwagon DOES start up (I'll give 5-1 that it doesn't... which he'll probably start just because I'm betting against him), I'll probably be a hypocrite and jump in later.
I was not lying. I said things that later on seemed to be untrue. - Richard Nixon
People come to Washington believing it is the center of power. It was only much later that I learned that Washington is a steering wheel that's not connected to an engine.
I look at the Senators and pray for this country.
It may be true that you can't fool all the people all the time, but you can fool enough of them to rule a large country.
People come to Washington believing it is the center of power. It was only much later that I learned that Washington is a steering wheel that's not connected to an engine.
I look at the Senators and pray for this country.
It may be true that you can't fool all the people all the time, but you can fool enough of them to rule a large country.
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Loismustdie
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Posted 22 May 2007 - 06:56 PM
QUOTE (brvheart @ Tuesday, May 22nd, 2007, 4:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This thread should've been made years ago. I'll start things off.
Lois.
Are all members of the denomination "Church of Christ" saved, or just some of them?
Follow up question. If people in other lands, who haven't heard about Jesus, can be saved through creation (as the Bible states), how is that possible... since they are not members of the denomination "Church of Christ'?
ground floor?
Lois.
Are all members of the denomination "Church of Christ" saved, or just some of them?
Follow up question. If people in other lands, who haven't heard about Jesus, can be saved through creation (as the Bible states), how is that possible... since they are not members of the denomination "Church of Christ'?
ground floor?
Okay, I am game, but you are not going to like my answer.
Let me start by saying this- I am staying at my Mom's house this week because I picked up 30 extra hours. Mom lives 5 minutes from work, I live an hour from work, and in a 70 hour work week drive time equals sleep time. Now, Mom has dial-up, so it was just dumb luck that I checked in. I am glad I did.
Here is your answer- No, because not all Churchs of Christ actually teach Christ doctrine. There are many more that don't than do. The issue, as always, is this- what do they teach? Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure, yet "Christian" conservatives would never say that- once saved, always saved, right? Doesn't matter what you do. Which is entirely the opposite of what Christ taught. He taught that by a mans fruits you would know him- we know what people are about by what they say and do. We know what they believe in by what they teach, preach, walk, talk, who they associate with,etc. And, that very thing ends up excludeing so many because we see that the walk they walk is not Christ paths, but something else.
That answer really just scratches the surface of the issue, but you should ask yourself this- what is it that Christ taught? Past "believe in me"- what then? Was that it? Or was there more? You know the answer is more, but 99.9% of the religous world would have you believe that the more is not neccesary, that belief alone is all it takes, but that belief that we get so hyped up about was supposed to ahve an effect on us, and cause us to change, not just accept Christ and then do taht which he taught against!(Once again, that would be 99.9% of the religous world)
As far as the saved through creation thing- what? No idea what you are talking about. The only thing that I can live by when it comes to a question like this is we know that if a person seeks answers they will find. So, I would say that these people that have been seeking Jesus and haven't heard about him- well, biblically they don't exist. Because-- if you seek, ye will find. That is a promise from God. He has delivered so far, why would he not deliver on that one? I have no doubt that there are churches of Christ in places that I have never been and will never be, because of this very idea. Places you will never see, have Churchs of Christ. I mean, lets say you were a person, uneducated except for the ability to read, and you picked up a Bible and read. What would you name your Church? Who would you name it after?
Just a couple things to think about. This will be a great thread, by the way, good idea.
So much for a comeback.
#4
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Posted 22 May 2007 - 07:13 PM
QUOTE (Loismustdie @ Tuesday, May 22nd, 2007, 6:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
. This will be a great thread, by the way, good idea.
LOL
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Posted 22 May 2007 - 07:52 PM
QUOTE (Loismustdie @ Tuesday, May 22nd, 2007, 9:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Okay, I am game, but you are not going to like my answer.
Let me start by saying this- I am staying at my Mom's house this week because I picked up 30 extra hours. Mom lives 5 minutes from work, I live an hour from work, and in a 70 hour work week drive time equals sleep time. Now, Mom has dial-up, so it was just dumb luck that I checked in. I am glad I did.
Here is your answer- No, because not all Churchs of Christ actually teach Christ doctrine. There are many more that don't than do. The issue, as always, is this- what do they teach? Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure, yet "Christian" conservatives would never say that- once saved, always saved, right? Doesn't matter what you do. Which is entirely the opposite of what Christ taught. He taught that by a mans fruits you would know him- we know what people are about by what they say and do. We know what they believe in by what they teach, preach, walk, talk, who they associate with,etc. And, that very thing ends up excludeing so many because we see that the walk they walk is not Christ paths, but something else.
That answer really just scratches the surface of the issue, but you should ask yourself this- what is it that Christ taught? Past "believe in me"- what then? Was that it? Or was there more? You know the answer is more, but 99.9% of the religous world would have you believe that the more is not neccesary, that belief alone is all it takes, but that belief that we get so hyped up about was supposed to ahve an effect on us, and cause us to change, not just accept Christ and then do taht which he taught against!(Once again, that would be 99.9% of the religous world)
I think that the Holy Spirit disagrees with you here. It's not the feelings or 'belief'... it's the Holy Spirit working through you.Let me start by saying this- I am staying at my Mom's house this week because I picked up 30 extra hours. Mom lives 5 minutes from work, I live an hour from work, and in a 70 hour work week drive time equals sleep time. Now, Mom has dial-up, so it was just dumb luck that I checked in. I am glad I did.
Here is your answer- No, because not all Churchs of Christ actually teach Christ doctrine. There are many more that don't than do. The issue, as always, is this- what do they teach? Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure, yet "Christian" conservatives would never say that- once saved, always saved, right? Doesn't matter what you do. Which is entirely the opposite of what Christ taught. He taught that by a mans fruits you would know him- we know what people are about by what they say and do. We know what they believe in by what they teach, preach, walk, talk, who they associate with,etc. And, that very thing ends up excludeing so many because we see that the walk they walk is not Christ paths, but something else.
That answer really just scratches the surface of the issue, but you should ask yourself this- what is it that Christ taught? Past "believe in me"- what then? Was that it? Or was there more? You know the answer is more, but 99.9% of the religous world would have you believe that the more is not neccesary, that belief alone is all it takes, but that belief that we get so hyped up about was supposed to ahve an effect on us, and cause us to change, not just accept Christ and then do taht which he taught against!(Once again, that would be 99.9% of the religous world)
QUOTE
As far as the saved through creation thing- what? No idea what you are talking about. The only thing that I can live by when it comes to a question like this is we know that if a person seeks answers they will find. So, I would say that these people that have been seeking Jesus and haven't heard about him- well, biblically they don't exist. Because-- if you seek, ye will find. That is a promise from God. He has delivered so far, why would he not deliver on that one? I have no doubt that there are churches of Christ in places that I have never been and will never be, because of this very idea. Places you will never see, have Churchs of Christ. I mean, lets say you were a person, uneducated except for the ability to read, and you picked up a Bible and read.
I'll even use the King James....Romans 1:20
20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
QUOTE
What would you name your Church? Who would you name it after?
Just a couple things to think about. This will be a great thread, by the way, good idea.
Just a couple things to think about. This will be a great thread, by the way, good idea.
So if said person came to know Jesus but didn't 'name' his church anything... he would go to hell? The point I'm getting to is this... if you don't go to a church that has the actual name Church of Christ on the building or thatched grass, etc etc then you will go to hell 100% of the time... is that correct?
CAPITALISM: God's way of determining who is smart and who is poor. - Ron Swanson ---> Video:Ron's Pyramid of Greatness Picture: Poster Size
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Posted 23 May 2007 - 06:03 AM
QUOTE (Loismustdie @ Tuesday, May 22nd, 2007, 6:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Okay, I am game, but you are not going to like my answer.
Let me start by saying this- I am staying at my Mom's house this week because I picked up 30 extra hours. Mom lives 5 minutes from work, I live an hour from work, and in a 70 hour work week drive time equals sleep time. Now, Mom has dial-up, so it was just dumb luck that I checked in. I am glad I did.
Here is your answer- No, because not all Churchs of Christ actually teach Christ doctrine. There are many more that don't than do. The issue, as always, is this- what do they teach? Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure, yet "Christian" conservatives would never say that- once saved, always saved, right? Doesn't matter what you do. Which is entirely the opposite of what Christ taught. He taught that by a mans fruits you would know him- we know what people are about by what they say and do. We know what they believe in by what they teach, preach, walk, talk, who they associate with,etc. And, that very thing ends up excludeing so many because we see that the walk they walk is not Christ paths, but something else.
That answer really just scratches the surface of the issue, but you should ask yourself this- what is it that Christ taught? Past "believe in me"- what then? Was that it? Or was there more? You know the answer is more, but 99.9% of the religous world would have you believe that the more is not neccesary, that belief alone is all it takes, but that belief that we get so hyped up about was supposed to ahve an effect on us, and cause us to change, not just accept Christ and then do taht which he taught against!(Once again, that would be 99.9% of the religous world)
As far as the saved through creation thing- what? No idea what you are talking about. The only thing that I can live by when it comes to a question like this is we know that if a person seeks answers they will find. So, I would say that these people that have been seeking Jesus and haven't heard about him- well, biblically they don't exist. Because-- if you seek, ye will find. That is a promise from God. He has delivered so far, why would he not deliver on that one? I have no doubt that there are churches of Christ in places that I have never been and will never be, because of this very idea. Places you will never see, have Churchs of Christ. I mean, lets say you were a person, uneducated except for the ability to read, and you picked up a Bible and read. What would you name your Church? Who would you name it after?
Just a couple things to think about. This will be a great thread, by the way, good idea.
Let me start by saying this- I am staying at my Mom's house this week because I picked up 30 extra hours. Mom lives 5 minutes from work, I live an hour from work, and in a 70 hour work week drive time equals sleep time. Now, Mom has dial-up, so it was just dumb luck that I checked in. I am glad I did.
Here is your answer- No, because not all Churchs of Christ actually teach Christ doctrine. There are many more that don't than do. The issue, as always, is this- what do they teach? Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure, yet "Christian" conservatives would never say that- once saved, always saved, right? Doesn't matter what you do. Which is entirely the opposite of what Christ taught. He taught that by a mans fruits you would know him- we know what people are about by what they say and do. We know what they believe in by what they teach, preach, walk, talk, who they associate with,etc. And, that very thing ends up excludeing so many because we see that the walk they walk is not Christ paths, but something else.
That answer really just scratches the surface of the issue, but you should ask yourself this- what is it that Christ taught? Past "believe in me"- what then? Was that it? Or was there more? You know the answer is more, but 99.9% of the religous world would have you believe that the more is not neccesary, that belief alone is all it takes, but that belief that we get so hyped up about was supposed to ahve an effect on us, and cause us to change, not just accept Christ and then do taht which he taught against!(Once again, that would be 99.9% of the religous world)
As far as the saved through creation thing- what? No idea what you are talking about. The only thing that I can live by when it comes to a question like this is we know that if a person seeks answers they will find. So, I would say that these people that have been seeking Jesus and haven't heard about him- well, biblically they don't exist. Because-- if you seek, ye will find. That is a promise from God. He has delivered so far, why would he not deliver on that one? I have no doubt that there are churches of Christ in places that I have never been and will never be, because of this very idea. Places you will never see, have Churchs of Christ. I mean, lets say you were a person, uneducated except for the ability to read, and you picked up a Bible and read. What would you name your Church? Who would you name it after?
Just a couple things to think about. This will be a great thread, by the way, good idea.
Ok---
I am going to jump in here on this converstation despite my better judgment, but just some perspective. I had this same discussion with someone a few weeks ago, and here are my thoughts....
There is a fine line between taking everything in the Bible 100% literal and handpicking verses to justify one's lifestyle. I think in the middle of those two is where people really need to be....at least from where I sit. Of course the Bible does say in John 14:6 -"Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.".....ok, good stuff....it also says Psalm 24:3-4 "Who may ascend the hill of the Lord? Who may stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to an idol or swear by what is false"...also good stuff.....so is this an "and" relationship or an "and/or"....do we know if one who has clean hands and pure heart can get to heaven without knowing Christ? Absolutely not....but we have to believe that God's grace is bigger than one statement/verse in the Bible.
Lois, you said Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure...how in the world can you say that? Nobody knows except God.
I guess all I am trying to say here, is that if someone lives their life with clean hands and a pure heart, but for some reason has never learned to story of Christ...I believe that they would go to heaven, but can I say that as an absolute? NO...nothing is absolute except God's love....and that cannot be "put into a box" or "quantified" by us to make statements about the fate of others.
If we were to take the bible as literal as I believe you are taking it, and the ABSOLUTE rule was John 14:6, and we also believe Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you...." than we could assume that God creates people only to condemn them....for He knows if they will learn the story of Christ before they die....and I struggle with the thought that God would create a person who for whatever reason (geographic location, environmental/social influence/etc.) never learns the story of Christ, only to condemn them to an eternity in Hell.
Just some thoughts...
Jayray
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#7
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Posted 23 May 2007 - 07:52 AM
QUOTE (Jayray @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 9:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Ok---
I am going to jump in here on this converstation despite my better judgment, but just some perspective. I had this same discussion with someone a few weeks ago, and here are my thoughts....
There is a fine line between taking everything in the Bible 100% literal and handpicking verses to justify one's lifestyle. I think in the middle of those two is where people really need to be....at least from where I sit. Of course the Bible does say in John 14:6 -"Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.".....ok, good stuff....it also says Psalm 24:3-4 "Who may ascend the hill of the Lord? Who may stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to an idol or swear by what is false"...also good stuff.....so is this an "and" relationship or an "and/or"....do we know if one who has clean hands and pure heart can get to heaven without knowing Christ? Absolutely not....but we have to believe that God's grace is bigger than one statement/verse in the Bible.
Lois, you said Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure...how in the world can you say that? Nobody knows except God.
I guess all I am trying to say here, is that if someone lives their life with clean hands and a pure heart, but for some reason has never learned to story of Christ...I believe that they would go to heaven, but can I say that as an absolute? NO...nothing is absolute except God's love....and that cannot be "put into a box" or "quantified" by us to make statements about the fate of others.
If we were to take the bible as literal as I believe you are taking it, and the ABSOLUTE rule was John 14:6, and we also believe Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you...." than we could assume that God creates people only to condemn them....for He knows if they will learn the story of Christ before they die....and I struggle with the thought that God would create a person who for whatever reason (geographic location, environmental/social influence/etc.) never learns the story of Christ, only to condemn them to an eternity in Hell.
Just some thoughts...
Jayray
I am going to jump in here on this converstation despite my better judgment, but just some perspective. I had this same discussion with someone a few weeks ago, and here are my thoughts....
There is a fine line between taking everything in the Bible 100% literal and handpicking verses to justify one's lifestyle. I think in the middle of those two is where people really need to be....at least from where I sit. Of course the Bible does say in John 14:6 -"Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.".....ok, good stuff....it also says Psalm 24:3-4 "Who may ascend the hill of the Lord? Who may stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to an idol or swear by what is false"...also good stuff.....so is this an "and" relationship or an "and/or"....do we know if one who has clean hands and pure heart can get to heaven without knowing Christ? Absolutely not....but we have to believe that God's grace is bigger than one statement/verse in the Bible.
Lois, you said Jerry Falwell did not go to heaven, I can say that as a certainty, 1 million % sure...how in the world can you say that? Nobody knows except God.
I guess all I am trying to say here, is that if someone lives their life with clean hands and a pure heart, but for some reason has never learned to story of Christ...I believe that they would go to heaven, but can I say that as an absolute? NO...nothing is absolute except God's love....and that cannot be "put into a box" or "quantified" by us to make statements about the fate of others.
If we were to take the bible as literal as I believe you are taking it, and the ABSOLUTE rule was John 14:6, and we also believe Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you...." than we could assume that God creates people only to condemn them....for He knows if they will learn the story of Christ before they die....and I struggle with the thought that God would create a person who for whatever reason (geographic location, environmental/social influence/etc.) never learns the story of Christ, only to condemn them to an eternity in Hell.
Just some thoughts...
Jayray
1) I realize that this is Lois' question to answer but I have to say a few things about this post. First, thanks for posting... it's never bad judgment to ask causal questions about your faith or someone elses faith.
2) You can NOT use the old testament to justify your position about being able to get to heaven without Jesus. I'm not saying anything about the actual topic because like you said... only God knows, BUT if John 14:6 says only Jesus... you will need something in the NEW testament to say the opposite for your point to be valid. Jesus wasn't born yet in the Old Testament so by definition there had to be another way to heaven. The only verse in the New Testament that even mentions this possibility is the one I already quoted. Romans 1:20, and even that is a pretty gray area.... the correct answer is, only God knows.
3) Lois has no idea about the heart of Jerry Falwell, he just knows that he wasn't a member of the denomination the Church of Christ and henceforth... according to Lois, not the Bible... he is in Hell.
CAPITALISM: God's way of determining who is smart and who is poor. - Ron Swanson ---> Video:Ron's Pyramid of Greatness Picture: Poster Size
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Posted 23 May 2007 - 08:55 AM
Would killing Scram be a sin?
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Posted 23 May 2007 - 10:49 AM
QUOTE (Jadaki @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 8:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Would killing Scram be a sin?
QFT
I was not lying. I said things that later on seemed to be untrue. - Richard Nixon
People come to Washington believing it is the center of power. It was only much later that I learned that Washington is a steering wheel that's not connected to an engine.
I look at the Senators and pray for this country.
It may be true that you can't fool all the people all the time, but you can fool enough of them to rule a large country.
People come to Washington believing it is the center of power. It was only much later that I learned that Washington is a steering wheel that's not connected to an engine.
I look at the Senators and pray for this country.
It may be true that you can't fool all the people all the time, but you can fool enough of them to rule a large country.
#10
SuitedAces21
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Posted 23 May 2007 - 04:50 PM
QUOTE (Jadaki @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 8:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Would killing Scram be a sin?
QUOTE (jmkiser @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 10:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QFT
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Loismustdie
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Posted 23 May 2007 - 04:52 PM
QUOTE (brvheart @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 8:52 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
1) I realize that this is Lois' question to answer but I have to say a few things about this post. First, thanks for posting... it's never bad judgment to ask causal questions about your faith or someone elses faith.
2) You can NOT use the old testament to justify your position about being able to get to heaven without Jesus. I'm not saying anything about the actual topic because like you said... only God knows, BUT if John 14:6 says only Jesus... you will need something in the NEW testament to say the opposite for your point to be valid. Jesus wasn't born yet in the Old Testament so by definition there had to be another way to heaven. The only verse in the New Testament that even mentions this possibility is the one I already quoted. Romans 1:20, and even that is a pretty gray area.... the correct answer is, only God knows.
3) Lois has no idea about the heart of Jerry Falwell, he just knows that he wasn't a member of the denomination the Church of Christ and henceforth... according to Lois, not the Bible... he is in Hell.
2) You can NOT use the old testament to justify your position about being able to get to heaven without Jesus. I'm not saying anything about the actual topic because like you said... only God knows, BUT if John 14:6 says only Jesus... you will need something in the NEW testament to say the opposite for your point to be valid. Jesus wasn't born yet in the Old Testament so by definition there had to be another way to heaven. The only verse in the New Testament that even mentions this possibility is the one I already quoted. Romans 1:20, and even that is a pretty gray area.... the correct answer is, only God knows.
3) Lois has no idea about the heart of Jerry Falwell, he just knows that he wasn't a member of the denomination the Church of Christ and henceforth... according to Lois, not the Bible... he is in Hell.
I know Mr. Falwells heart by his actions. By there fruits ye shall know them remember?
I wil get more in depth later with Bravehearts reply. BigDMcGee- seriously? Just a little lol post?
So much for a comeback.
#12
Loismustdie
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Posted 23 May 2007 - 04:58 PM
QUOTE (brvheart @ Tuesday, May 22nd, 2007, 8:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think that the Holy Spirit disagrees with you here. It's not the feelings or 'belief'... it's the Holy Spirit working through you.
I'll even use the King James....
Romans 1:20
20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
So if said person came to know Jesus but didn't 'name' his church anything... he would go to hell? The point I'm getting to is this... if you don't go to a church that has the actual name Church of Christ on the building or thatched grass, etc etc then you will go to hell 100% of the time... is that correct?
I'll even use the King James....
Romans 1:20
20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
So if said person came to know Jesus but didn't 'name' his church anything... he would go to hell? The point I'm getting to is this... if you don't go to a church that has the actual name Church of Christ on the building or thatched grass, etc etc then you will go to hell 100% of the time... is that correct?
I will say this. If I wanted to learn how to paint, why would I go to a school that taught me to do so with my eyes closed upside down? Sure, I may get some paint on a surface but I will for the most part suck at it. Think about this- one of the biggest things that Paul and Timothy harped on was unity, being of one mind- therefore, teaching one doctrine. Why was that? Because it didn't matter? Why did Paul take trips to correct Churchs that had gone astray? Because it didn't matter? Every example shows that it does. Shwo e one example in the Bible where he said teachig whatever was perfectly okay. You wont find it. The name is really just the surface of it- it's what the name stands for that causes them to be seperate from God.
So much for a comeback.
#13
brvheart
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Posted 24 May 2007 - 04:11 AM
QUOTE (Loismustdie @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 7:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I will say this. If I wanted to learn how to paint, why would I go to a school that taught me to do so with my eyes closed upside down? Sure, I may get some paint on a surface but I will for the most part suck at it. Think about this- one of the biggest things that Paul and Timothy harped on was unity, being of one mind- therefore, teaching one doctrine. Why was that? Because it didn't matter? Why did Paul take trips to correct Churchs that had gone astray? Because it didn't matter? Every example shows that it does. Shwo e one example in the Bible where he said teachig whatever was perfectly okay. You wont find it. The name is really just the surface of it- it's what the name stands for that causes them to be seperate from God.
This is where you're wrong though. I think I've shown over and over again that the ONLY thing that I go by is the Bible. I go to a non-denominational church, so I don't have any written church doctrine... we only use the Bible.... and we ONLY follow Jesus Christ. If the name of the church doesn't matter and I am truly seeking Christ in order to be more like him... how is it that I can be wrong? Jesus knows my heart. He knows that I desire to be more like him. He knows I am seeking him. How does this jive with what you're saying... I don't believe it does.
CAPITALISM: God's way of determining who is smart and who is poor. - Ron Swanson ---> Video:Ron's Pyramid of Greatness Picture: Poster Size
#14
brvheart
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Posted 24 May 2007 - 04:20 AM
QUOTE (Loismustdie @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 7:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I know Mr. Falwells heart by his actions. By there fruits ye shall know them remember?
I wil get more in depth later with Bravehearts reply. BigDMcGee- seriously? Just a little lol post?
I wil get more in depth later with Bravehearts reply. BigDMcGee- seriously? Just a little lol post?
Which of his actions do you think condemn him?
QUOTE (SuitedAces21)
QUOTE (Jadaki)
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LOL... nh suited.
CAPITALISM: God's way of determining who is smart and who is poor. - Ron Swanson ---> Video:Ron's Pyramid of Greatness Picture: Poster Size
#15
David_Nicoson
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Posted 24 May 2007 - 07:08 PM
QUOTE (brvheart @ Wednesday, May 23rd, 2007, 11:52 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Jesus wasn't born yet in the Old Testament so by definition there had to be another way to heaven. The only verse in the New Testament that even mentions this possibility is the one I already quoted. Romans 1:20, and even that is a pretty gray area.... the correct answer is, only God knows.
I'm not sure about that. If there was already a way to heaven, what Jesus' contribution meant to be?
I could be wrong here, but I thought the Jews believe that they stay dead until the Messiah comes and brings the kingdom of heaven.
QUOTE(bleacherbum3 @ Friday, February 29th, 2008, 3:28 AM) 
I'm invincible. Like Super Mario when he gets that star thingy.
#16
antistuff
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Posted 25 May 2007 - 05:17 AM
lois, does it not occur to you that this thread is entertainment for others at your expense?
QUOTE ( Barry Greenstein)
Successful gamblers are compulsive winners.
#17
Loismustdie
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Posted 25 May 2007 - 06:45 PM
QUOTE (antistuff @ Friday, May 25th, 2007, 6:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
lois, does it not occur to you that this thread is entertainment for others at your expense?
If I cared about that I deserve to go to hell.
So much for a comeback.
#18
Loismustdie
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Posted 25 May 2007 - 06:51 PM
QUOTE (David_Nicoson @ Thursday, May 24th, 2007, 8:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm not sure about that. If there was already a way to heaven, what Jesus' contribution meant to be?
I could be wrong here, but I thought the Jews believe that they stay dead until the Messiah comes and brings the kingdom of heaven.
I could be wrong here, but I thought the Jews believe that they stay dead until the Messiah comes and brings the kingdom of heaven.
The Old laws were nailed to the cross- and, with it, any other path to heaven. If the old laws are done with, we cannot pick and choose which ones to live by and not too. Without Christ, no heaven. That being said....
Braveheart, why in the world would it make any sense to name your church anything else but his? If it really is true that you follow everything in the Bible BUT that, doesn't that seem sort of obstinate? What point are you trying to prove?
I could see if maybe Paul reffered to a church here and there as "The Non-Denominational Church at Antioch" but that is far from the example we see. Why do anything else than the example we see?
So much for a comeback.
#19
antistuff
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Posted 26 May 2007 - 01:39 AM
QUOTE (Loismustdie @ Friday, May 25th, 2007, 6:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If I cared about that I deserve to go to hell.
as wonderful and selfless of a notion as that is it makes it all the more sad as you sit here and be somebody's circus.
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Successful gamblers are compulsive winners.
#20
Loismustdie
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Posted 26 May 2007 - 10:38 AM
QUOTE (antistuff @ Saturday, May 26th, 2007, 2:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
as wonderful and selfless of a notion as that is it makes it all the more sad as you sit here and be somebody's circus.
If that is/was Bravehearts motive for starting this thread that would be sad- except that's not true. If it was, that would be on him, wouldn't it? In the grand scheme of things I would have nothing to be ashamed of.
There have been times that I know that has happened,and what did I do about it? Put those persons on ignore. I do think that things get bogged down when I waste my time answering to pointless lines of thought in threads that otherwise had good conversations, for example, your currrent interjection is largely just a waste of space. It adds nothing to the conversation. Really, I wish the person who moderated this forum would be more proactive and just delete things that have nothing to do with the issues. It would streamline things quite a bit.
So much for a comeback.
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