not drawing with odds in nlhe

[Wily 0]

Between hands during the wild MIT no limit holdem games, Aseem and I have interesting discussions on poker strategy and theory.One of the things we brought up two nights ago was going on straight or flush draws with large or all-in calls before us. At this big, loose table, I'm usually the "sore thumb" tight player - I play probably 20% of hands, fold when I miss flops, and get pushed around a fair deal - until I hit a monster, push back, and get paid off, usually in all in situations. One of the thing I don't do there is draw when it costs a lot to me, and the odds are only marginally correct for me to do so.For example: I hold QJ on a flop of A 10 9, rainbow. My stack is $100 or so (the blinds are only .25/.5, but the game is deep stacked and the biggest stacks always have more than $300). There is a bet of $7 from a big stack and a raise to $25 more before me - I'm almost certain that if I call the big stack will either call or push all in. Their stacks both cover mine, so if I do go all in the pot odds will be just about correct for me to play. I find this an easy fold.In another hand, I folded a nut flush draw and one overcard, and in another a flush draw plus gut shot straight draw, when the pot was laying me about the same odds as my hitting an out. I make these lay downs because I feel that I can wait until I have much better odds of winning hands (having top pair or a set) and then commit, and because I'm fairly risk averse in no limit games. Also, with large bets before me, I don't want to miss and take a big hit to my chip stack and be in a worse position for future hands. I think that over two nights of 6 hour NL games, I went on one flush draw in total, and zero straight draws. Does anyone else fold these, and prefer pairs and sets with more certainty?-Yang

[Vade 0]

I try to avoid going all in on a drawPot odds or not, you're way behind with at best 8 cards, presuming some of them haven't been folded

[akishore 0]

well, its okay to fold when you're getting only marginal odds, because you're right--there's no need to take hits to your stack.that said, i think you forget to take implied odds into account. if there's a bet and a raise, sure, fold a draw because you don't want to be reraised or to face a big bet on the turn. but if the situation is right, e.g. there is just a big bet, i would call more liberally. a few of these players sometimes even shy down on the turn (i use "sometimes" with caution :-) ), and you might get a free card.aseem

[wrto4556 0]

Yeah, I had someone at PM call me a fish for calling with a gut shot to the river...but I got his whole stack. :?