This may be old and have been covered before but I haven't seen it......
A plane is standing on a runway that is made of a large conveyor belt. The plane fires up its engines, but as it moves forward, the conveyor belt senses the speed of the plane's wheels and moves at exactly the same speed in the opposite direction. Can the plane take off?
I'm after good solid logic and math rather than just a yes or no on this one.
0
Can The Plane Take Off?
Started by spm, Mar 08 2007 01:45 PM
226 replies to this topic
#2
fryer98
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:46 PM
No.
#3
Ouch-8s
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It's not a flying tour group, Jerome
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:46 PM
Of course it can.
I'm retired.
#4
JoeyJoJo
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:49 PM
QUOTE (fryer98 @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 1:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No.
QUOTE (Ouch-8s @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 1:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Of course it can.
[/thread]
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#5
Jelly-Filled Ace
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:51 PM
Harrier.
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#6
spm
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:51 PM
QUOTE (JoeyJoJo @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 1:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
[/thread]
Hey Joey. I posted your thread about 'Embarrassing Touchings' on a site that I use in the UK. They loved it.
#7
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:53 PM
QUOTE (Jelly-Filled Ace @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 1:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Harrier.
No this is a standard jet liner.
#8
Ouch-8s
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It's not a flying tour group, Jerome
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:53 PM
QUOTE (JoeyJoJo @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 1:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
[/thread]
yeah that would probably be best before anyone says something silly, which is what always happens with this question.
I'm retired.
#9
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:55 PM
Other than a Harrier jet, no. The principles involved are not the speed of the wheels on the surface below but the speed of the wings with relation to the surrounding air.
#10
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:55 PM
QUOTE (spm @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 1:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hey Joey. I posted your thread about 'Accidental Touchings' on a site that I use in the UK. They loved it.
I'm internationally famous.
Homer: Moe, I need your advice.
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Homer: See, I got this friend named... Joey Jo Jo... Junior... Shabadoo.
Moe: That's the worst name I ever heard.
Moe: Yeah?
Homer: See, I got this friend named... Joey Jo Jo... Junior... Shabadoo.
Moe: That's the worst name I ever heard.
#11
checkymcfold
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:56 PM
QUOTE (spm @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 3:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This may be old and have been covered before but I haven't seen it......
A plane is standing on a runway that is made of a large conveyor belt. The plane fires up its engines, but as it moves forward, the conveyor belt senses the speed of the plane's wheels and moves at exactly the same speed in the opposite direction. Can the plane take off?
I'm after good solid logic and math rather than just a yes or no on this one.
A plane is standing on a runway that is made of a large conveyor belt. The plane fires up its engines, but as it moves forward, the conveyor belt senses the speed of the plane's wheels and moves at exactly the same speed in the opposite direction. Can the plane take off?
I'm after good solid logic and math rather than just a yes or no on this one.
unless the conveyor belt moves the air, too, i think the plane's good to go.
edit for a more full explanation:
barring the rotational-inertial/frictional force in the wheels that will actually move the plane backwards when the conveyor belt goes (which would always be less than the full force of the conveyor belt, anyhow, unless the wheels were locked still), the engines that are "pushing off the air," at least functionally, don't experience a counteractive force to the engine in any appreciable way. hence, the plane still goes forward.
QUOTE (Dirtydutch @ Tuesday, December 2nd, 2008, 12:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
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#12
Ouch-8s
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It's not a flying tour group, Jerome
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:56 PM
too late
I'm retired.
#13
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:56 PM
No, it won't take off. Lift is caused by air moving over the wings. If the plane isn't making forward momentum and there is no air blowing, it won't take off. No math needed.
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#14
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 01:57 PM
QUOTE (JoeyJoJo @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 1:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm internationally famous.
Is that a statement or a question?..... well you are now, if only at least to a small community.
#15
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 02:00 PM
This has been discussed to death several places on the internet. There are two types of replies -- those who accept the problem at face value, in which case the plane takes off, and those who assume all sorts of ridiculous friction variables that would only exist under extreme conditions, and in that case, no, it wouldn't take off, it would be torn to pieces.
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#16
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 02:00 PM
QUOTE (Dogpatch @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 4:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No, it won't take off. Lift is caused by air moving over the wings. If the plane isn't making forward momentum and there is no air blowing, it won't take off. No math needed.
QFT
#17
fryer98
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 02:01 PM
QUOTE (hblask @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 5:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This has been discussed to death several places on the internet.
Where is this place you speak of?
#18
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 02:02 PM
QUOTE (hblask @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 2:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This has been discussed to death several places on the internet. There are two types of replies -- those who accept the problem at face value, in which case the plane takes off, and those who assume all sorts of ridiculous friction variables that would only exist under extreme conditions, and in that case, no, it wouldn't take off, it would be torn to pieces.
In this case we are only talking about the theoretical aspect, not the actual.
#19
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 02:04 PM
QUOTE (fryer98 @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 4:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Where is this place you speak of?
I couldn't tell if you were asking for links or making a joke.
If a joke: ha ha
If a link: Straight Dope and the followup. This site also has discussions. Also, just search on "plane on conveyor" for lots more.
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#20
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Posted 08 March 2007 - 02:07 PM
QUOTE (spm @ Thursday, March 8th, 2007, 5:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
In this case we are only talking about the theoretical aspect, not the actual.
Theoretically or actually... the plane is not moving. It won't take off.
Go the gym, get on a treadmill. When you run you will feel no wind on your face. No wind, no lift.
Now, attach a chain to the front landing gear and put the plane in a wind tunnel. It's not making forward momentum, but the wind being forced over the wings would cause lift and the plane would take off.
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