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#41 11 to 1

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 10:02 PM

View PostZach6668, on Friday, February 16th, 2007, 6:10 PM, said:

I hope 11-1 is taking notes.
Oh yes. About the fewer mistakes: I really dig that poker tracker. I just played back all my recent big losing hands, over and over to see at every stage, where I made the wrong, or less optimal at any rate, decisions. It was great. You know, when you have AK and raise and some guy plays back at you with K4os and the board comes KK84T, well, not that much you can do and you just take a big loss, I guess. But I found a whole slew of things I wasn't looking at at all, and I did, indeed, take notes. I have them pinned all around my screen on stickys so I don't forget. Including Zach's suggestions for good blind-stealing hands to raise with.I am also reading all the posts over and over, comparing what everyone says and studying Zach's generouis explanation of EV for Dummies. BTW, Zach, I checked all my AA and I have always raised with them since I moved up from the PStars micro boards. I also decided I disagree with you, and that for me, my "delayed raise" strategy with AA and a few other big hands is not stupid at all. It worked like a charm at .5/.10 and .10/.25. The reason it worked is the same as the reason I won that KK hand I posted that looked like I played rather badly, because I understood the players. Thing is, now I don't. These new players are a mystery to me and now, I think, I must evolve into more of an odds/EV/position and so forth player. At least online, and this has all been great. I may go back and just read a lot of the old threads where you all have commented for a while. Meanwhile, I am playing back the hands of the other players, especially the winning ones and the ones I run into a lot. An amazing tool.
When truth is nothing but the truth, its unnatural, it's an abstraction that resembles nothing in the real world. - Aldous Huxley

#42 finztotheleft

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 10:03 PM

Hi 11 to 1,I'm a micro limit player too. I've made it up as far as 2/4, but just demoted myself for being too loose and passive :club: (translated, lost a chunk of my roll on FT, so I'm going back to basics.One little pearl of wisdom related to the TT hand at the beginning of this thread. After the hand, remember to click on the "last hand feature" so you can see what Jerry mucked, ie...did he have a K ? If he called a bet for showdown, it will show his hand there even though he mucked. It helps for making notes on what he will play and bet/call down with. Like a lot of poor players, I tend to call down too much thinking my opponents might be bluffing or overly aggressive with middle pair or a draw (like in your TT hand....kudos on the fold, because too often I hang in there). A related tip on that is playing with other FCP'ers. I had Actuary at my table a few times at PS and Cinci and Laceration Saint (brain cramp on his FCP name) at Fulltilt. I find the fear of making a total fool of myself in front of an FCP'er makes me focus more on trying to make the right decisions.

#43 finztotheleft

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 10:08 PM

Oops....1 more thing.....Remember to check back on the main table screen periodically to see if the table is still as good as when you picked it out to begin with. At PS for .25/.5 you should be able to find a table with 40% to flop and $4 average pot. Good tables get harder to find the more you move up in limits, but it sure helps with positive cash flow for those of us still learning.

#44 11 to 1

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 10:10 PM

View PostMoneyball16, on Friday, February 16th, 2007, 2:44 PM, said:

Whenever someone raises in front of you you should put them on a range of hands based on their postiton and style and reraise them if you believe you have an edge on them based on your hand, posititon, and your ability to outplay them after the flop. One program that helped me find proper preflop standards is pokerstove. I would recommend this to anyone. You can find it at pokerstove.com if you want it.Back to the TT hands against a co open with TT on the button it becomes an eays 3-bet just because it will win too often against the kinds of hands he could be raising preflop. for this same reason TT may be a fold against someone UTG who would only raise JJ+ and AK.
I jusat downloaded pokerstove, thanks for the site - looks like another great tool.
When truth is nothing but the truth, its unnatural, it's an abstraction that resembles nothing in the real world. - Aldous Huxley

#45 11 to 1

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 10:17 PM

View Postfinztotheleft, on Saturday, February 17th, 2007, 1:03 AM, said:

Hi 11 to 1,I'm a micro limit player too. I've made it up as far as 2/4, but just demoted myself for being too loose and passive :club: (translated, lost a chunk of my roll on FT, so I'm going back to basics.One little pearl of wisdom related to the TT hand at the beginning of this thread. After the hand, remember to click on the "last hand feature" so you can see what Jerry mucked, ie...did he have a K ? If he called a bet for showdown, it will show his hand there even though he mucked. It helps for making notes on what he will play and bet/call down with. Like a lot of poor players, I tend to call down too much thinking my opponents might be bluffing or overly aggressive with middle pair or a draw (like in your TT hand....kudos on the fold, because too often I hang in there). A related tip on that is playing with other FCP'ers. I had Actuary at my table a few times at PS and Cinci and Laceration Saint (brain cramp on his FCP name) at Fulltilt. I find the fear of making a total fool of myself in front of an FCP'er makes me focus more on trying to make the right decisions.
They have this "last hand feature" on Poker Stars? I wanted to play on FT but the whole money thing got screwed up before I got more money. I hope to be in there soon. As for making a fool of myself - too old to care, done it too many times, watched others, it's the human condition, yanno? I watch a lot of poker, I've seen the most astounding bonehead plays from pretty much every pro. They make me feel better, I think the difference is: they just do it less. I love making mistakes, it's the only way to learn. I think, and maybe this happened to you, I think the micro got too easy and when I moved up I just never got a lot of the skills, I could have anticipated but I just won and got comfortable. Comfortable is boring.
When truth is nothing but the truth, its unnatural, it's an abstraction that resembles nothing in the real world. - Aldous Huxley

#46 11 to 1

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 10:19 PM

View Postfinztotheleft, on Saturday, February 17th, 2007, 1:08 AM, said:

Oops....1 more thing.....Remember to check back on the main table screen periodically to see if the table is still as good as when you picked it out to begin with. At PS for .25/.5 you should be able to find a table with 40% to flop and $4 average pot. Good tables get harder to find the more you move up in limits, but it sure helps with positive cash flow for those of us still learning.
Is this your SN on PS? I'll look for ya. I'm MurderofCrows there.
When truth is nothing but the truth, its unnatural, it's an abstraction that resembles nothing in the real world. - Aldous Huxley

#47 Zach6668

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Posted 17 February 2007 - 08:12 AM

View Post11 to 1, on Saturday, February 17th, 2007, 1:02 AM, said:

Oh yes. About the fewer mistakes: I really dig that poker tracker. I just played back all my recent big losing hands, over and over to see at every stage, where I made the wrong, or less optimal at any rate, decisions. It was great. You know, when you have AK and raise and some guy plays back at you with K4os and the board comes KK84T, well, not that much you can do and you just take a big loss, I guess. But I found a whole slew of things I wasn't looking at at all, and I did, indeed, take notes. I have them pinned all around my screen on stickys so I don't forget. Including Zach's suggestions for good blind-stealing hands to raise with.I am also reading all the posts over and over, comparing what everyone says and studying Zach's generouis explanation of EV for Dummies. BTW, Zach, I checked all my AA and I have always raised with them since I moved up from the PStars micro boards. I also decided I disagree with you, and that for me, my "delayed raise" strategy with AA and a few other big hands is not stupid at all. It worked like a charm at .5/.10 and .10/.25. The reason it worked is the same as the reason I won that KK hand I posted that looked like I played rather badly, because I understood the players. Thing is, now I don't. These new players are a mystery to me and now, I think, I must evolve into more of an odds/EV/position and so forth player. At least online, and this has all been great. I may go back and just read a lot of the old threads where you all have commented for a while. Meanwhile, I am playing back the hands of the other players, especially the winning ones and the ones I run into a lot. An amazing tool.
You can disagree all you like, but it doesn't change the fact that I'm right.Your sample is more than likely too small to use as a basis for deciding if your way is right.Nonetheless, you will win money with AA no matter what you do. You'd have to be a braindead monkey to lose money in the long run with AA. However, if you raise when you have an equity edge, you'll win more. That's the key.Also, don't look at one hand and say that even though it looks like you played it bad, it's ok because you won it. That's not the right way to look at things. So you happened to win that KK hand. The way that hand was played, unless you KNEW that he was a maniac, you're almost NEVER ahead there. You're lucky you made a bad call down after the turn raise and won. You have to think about poker in the long run.- Zach
QUOTE (serge @ Tuesday, May 12th, 2009, 7:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
LETS GO PITTSBURGH
QUOTE (Acid_Knight @ Monday, March 10th, 2008, 4:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Zach is right about pretty much everything.

#48 Actuary

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Posted 17 February 2007 - 09:40 AM

11-1I'm in love with your passion to learn and your attitudeYou could end up a very very very good player, dwarfing anything I've done.seriously.

#49 11 to 1

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Posted 18 February 2007 - 06:47 PM

View PostZach6668, on Saturday, February 17th, 2007, 11:12 AM, said:

Also, don't look at one hand and say that even though it looks like you played it bad, it's ok because you won it. That's not the right way to look at things. So you happened to win that KK hand. The way that hand was played, unless you KNEW that he was a maniac, you're almost NEVER ahead there. You're lucky you made a bad call down after the turn raise and won. You have to think about poker in the long run.- Zach
I don't think I played it badly, I think it just looked like I did. I think I played it correctly, even if I had lost, for this hand against these players. . I think if I had been against players I didn't know this way of playing would be pretty bad. But in this very specific case, I did know these two players, and so that made it worth the risk. I also agree that making decisions in terms of the odds, or the long run, makes the most sense. At the same time, I think we also have to play the table we are at, the game going on and the players in that hand. That's why it so HARD for me, like I said, like going from an automatic to a five speed stick, all of a sudden you gotta use all your arms and legs just to get out of the driveway!
When truth is nothing but the truth, its unnatural, it's an abstraction that resembles nothing in the real world. - Aldous Huxley

#50 11 to 1

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Posted 18 February 2007 - 06:53 PM

View PostActuary, on Saturday, February 17th, 2007, 12:40 PM, said:

11-1I'm in love with your passion to learn and your attitudeYou could end up a very very very good player, dwarfing anything I've done.seriously.
Well, thanks, that's kind and encouraging. It also won't happen. Maybe if I started at twenty-five, maybe. But at 57, having had a series of concusssions in my old job and real trouble with short-term memory, this is like therapy and play and maybe I could get to where could supplement my income, which, being so small, wouldn't take much to be significant. The good thing about not being 25 is that a lot of stuff doesn't bother me too much, I don't feel like I have anything to prove and I'm having a much better time than I was thirty years ago.Youth is so frickin' serious, yanno?
When truth is nothing but the truth, its unnatural, it's an abstraction that resembles nothing in the real world. - Aldous Huxley

#51 Zach6668

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Posted 18 February 2007 - 06:58 PM

I think Actuary is like 65, so you guys should get along well.
QUOTE (serge @ Tuesday, May 12th, 2009, 7:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
LETS GO PITTSBURGH
QUOTE (Acid_Knight @ Monday, March 10th, 2008, 4:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Zach is right about pretty much everything.

#52 Actuary

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Posted 20 February 2007 - 01:40 AM

View PostZach6668, on Sunday, February 18th, 2007, 6:58 PM, said:

I think Actuary is like 65, so you guys should get along well.
lol.kids these days.




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