kq off in mid position tight table. your move?

[Guest]

1 table sng. All 9 players left.My stack is approx. 2000(3rd in position)KQo in mid position.I limp knowing that I will most likely see a cheap flop.I do. 3 total people in the pot.Me. BB. and one other.Flop K52 rainbow.Pot is 150.Mr tight and conservative bets 300. I hit the timer. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Did he hit a set? Does he have AK? How do I lay this down figuring I am beat?Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. 45 seconds later I call.turn is a blank. He bets 600. Now I am 99% sure that I am beat but I foolishly call again hoping he came in with KJ. River blank. He bets a weak 400. I call.He has AK off and I am stuck in a ss position.I am doing things like this less and less now.Thoughts?I know I know...Great poker players make great lay downs.Any other thoughts?Any other scenarios that you learned from?

[Mr Monkey 0]

fold or raise preflop, and forsure fold on the turn. If u raise preflop he would have reraised and u would have folded

[Guest]

Actually, if I raised preflop he would have called me instead of re-raising. This is one of the reasons I limped. I knew that if he or two others at the table had anything they would limp with it.

[slappy110 0]

thats a very tough spot to be in. Typically, how i play KQ, if a tough tight opponent limps from early position, i wont even play KQ...if im in middle and its been folded to me...then i'll open raise for about 3xs bb...if others limped but i know them to be weak players, then i'll limp, take a flop and hope to extract the most from them later or outplay them. But if a conservative player especially limps early...you have to play very tightly behind him. In that spot...AQ becomes marginal.

[Mr Monkey 0]

i would have folded preflop then. and i would have most likey folded on the flop if u knew someone would limp with a big hand.

[Guest]

hmmmmmmmmmmgood points.He was behind me though.

[Dhall901 0]

You said yourself this guy is tight, I assume he limped in? Regardless 300 into a 150 pot is either an idiot, or protecting top pair. Small set was also likely. You gotta know the player, and if he's tight like you said..lay down. However, after the flop call, you got him thinking. For all he knew you flopped a small set.. I like a raise on the turn, maybe even all in, I think you could have gotten him to fold. Just flat calling all his bets was your biggest mistake, raise or fold.

[Guest]

That is another excellent point. I probably could have gotten him to lay it down. I did not think about that because it was still somewhat early. The odds of him laying down were 50/50 IMO.So, that is why I did not push all in. Besides, he was pot committed post turn.But, I know I played this wrong after the fact.Anyone have any other interesting scenarios that they learned something?

[RISINGSHARK 0]

You said yourself this guy is tight, I assume he limped in? Regardless 300 into a 150 pot is either an idiot, or protecting top pair. Small set was also likely. You gotta know the player, and if he's tight like you said..lay down. However, after the flop call, you got him thinking. For all he knew you flopped a small set.. I like a raise on the turn, maybe even all in, I think you could have gotten him to fold. Just flat calling all his bets was your biggest mistake, raise or fold.

Players at this level would never fold AK if they hit any part of it ! That is a fact in my opinion !

[KillerKop 0]

Not only is this online, but its a sit n go to boot. There is no way an all in is going to get anybody to lay AK down with this flop. If that's not enough, the 600 on the turn utterly commits him. If you had this guy completely pegged as a tight conservative player then this should've been an easy laydown on the flop. Even if you're wrong occasionally, you've only limped into the pot and have no good reason to stick around in the face of a big bet. Save your chips for a better situation and an easier decision.

[Dhall901 0]

You said yourself this guy is tight, I assume he limped in? Regardless 300 into a 150 pot is either an idiot, or protecting top pair. Small set was also likely. You gotta know the player, and if he's tight like you said..lay down. However, after the flop call, you got him thinking. For all he knew you flopped a small set.. I like a raise on the turn, maybe even all in, I think you could have gotten him to fold. Just flat calling all his bets was your biggest mistake, raise or fold.

Players at this level would never fold AK if they hit any part of it ! That is a fact in my opinion !

You're right. One of my biggest flaws is giving the players at micro limits too much credit. In any event, if I'm sitting with AK and get flat called on the flop after that bet, I'm wondering if he hit a set (in this particular case I mean a quick call, the extra thought he put into it would make me feel strong about AK). A strong raise on the turn, especially all in, gets me sweating, and I"d probably lay it down. Say good hand, and move on.

[Fire- 0]

You said yourself this guy is tight, I assume he limped in? Regardless 300 into a 150 pot is either an idiot, or protecting top pair. Small set was also likely. You gotta know the player, and if he's tight like you said..lay down. However, after the flop call, you got him thinking. For all he knew you flopped a small set.. I like a raise on the turn, maybe even all in, I think you could have gotten him to fold. Just flat calling all his bets was your biggest mistake, raise or fold.

Players at this level would never fold AK if they hit any part of it ! That is a fact in my opinion !

The second part of your statement made me giggle like a little girl just because of the sheer irony inherent in the words you chose.

[Devilkin 0]

Preflop raise is a must (if you are going to play this hand, which I wouldn't unless we were down to say four players) - you have to have an idea whether your opponent is holding strong cards (pocket pair, two high cards) or just limping with maybe K8o.He calls my raise, Im putting him on a strong hand. Flop comes as you described, and he bets before me, knowing he is tight, I fold it up. KQ will win you some hands, but lose you some big ones.Preflop raising is the best way to force head to head, or three way action. Yes, the raise does weed out the marginal hands, so you are only competing witht he strong ones, but you have a much stronger idea of what your opponent is holding before the flop hits. This allows your 'poker instincts' to take over - you know, that feeling that 'Im beat'. When you get that feeling, calling just to keep him honest is like handing him your chips. Fold it up, and put your chips in with a stronger hand.Id much rather fold a smaller pot and risk my chips when I have a better hand to compete with.So, stop limping - you get no visibility into what your opponent holds. In this case, your raise, being called by a tight player, is all the information you need to know he has a very strong hand.Dev

[Guest]

Good post Dev.I will usually raise or fold 99% of the time.In this case I figured why bother.These people are only calling the BB when they have a hand. Why waste the chips?I feel like the mistake I made was not folding post flop.This table was very tight at this point. That is why after 25 minutes the table was still full.

[Devilkin 0]

Agreed, once the post flop bet came out, a fold would have been a good idea. I see flops by limping once in awhile (such as the old 10Js in early position - can't seem to get away from doing that). But unless I hit the flop hard (two pair, high pair and a flush draw) Ill fold to any significant bet.Jamming the pot when you feel you have the strongest hand is always best. Calling bets hoping you have the best hand is charity. :DDev

[JaysonWeber 0]

I would have Raised Pre-FLop with no raisers infront of me... KQo from MP I raise... Its a live game so figure out what type of players are infront and behind you before doing this, But I'd do it 75% of the time if not more.

[Devilkin 0]

I would have Raised Pre-FLop with no raisers infront of me... KQo from MP I raise... Its a live game so figure out what type of players are infront and behind you before doing this, But I'd do it 75% of the time if not more.

Im interested to hear your thoughts about playing KQo MP with a raise Jayson. Yes, you hold two high cards, and a raise helps isolate you (usually, unless you have a very loose table). So, you know that if you are called you are up against a strong hand, if you are reraised, its probably a premium hand. Would you fold it to a reraise? (Im thinking you would).What would you have done with this flop, and having Mr Tight bet strongly on it?Dev

[slappy110 0]

you said the guy with AK was behind you? Well then the situation becomes much more clear if you think about it. First of all, what was your action on the flop then? did you check it? if so thats your first mistake...knowing their is tight players behind you waiting to act, its less likely one of them will bet at it in hopes of picking up the pot...if you led at it, then the "tight" player came way over the top on very dry flop as to suggest he hit it and is not a semibluff...then a fold here is also easier...