25 replies to this topic

[pokargrl]

Hero is dealt Q J (my favorite hand) on button. Game is a fairly typical 100$NL game. I bought in for 50, and have 55 in my stack. Preflop:-- All fold to CO, who limps. I raise 4xBB to 4$. SB calls (no read), BB calls (aggressive idiot), CO calls (solid player)Flop A 9 3 -- SB leads out 5$ (about 1/3 of pot), BB folds, CO folds. I think he's got a fairly weak ace, and is just testing the water. He might be weak leading a set, but I have to take that chance. I like my draws (2 backdoor straights, 2nd nut flush draw). I think about going all in straight up, but decide that looks to much like a bluff. I reraise to 20$, hoping to convince him I have AK and take the pot right now. Instead he reraises me all in. I'm getting 3:1 on a call, and I'm pot committed. Turn and river miss me, and he wins. Results to follow.

[wrto4556]

It's standard.

[looshle]

Turn and river miss me, and he wins. Results to follow.I'm confused.

[dtemp]

Assuming you thought he was capable of folding a weak ace, the move is fine.The call was easy and required no thinking unless he was playin the king high flush in which case he has guts or a great read. But for god sake's, man, play with a deeper stack. Your style of play neccesitates it.Edit: Come to think of it, that third of the pot bet looks like it could easily be a flush draw.

[pokargrl]

He showed A 8 ; a pretty weak ace. I was a 60/40 dog on the all in, but that's not bad at all. I think I made a good move, it just didn't work against someone who can't fold top pair with no kicker. Usually, I buy in for 1/2 then just let my stack build. But my style of play doesn't really need a deep stack. I usually only post the hands where I look like a LAG, but I'm generally very tight.

[pokargrl]

double posted on accident.

[looshle]

I like going all in with the flush draw. NH.

[dtemp]

pokargrl said:

Usually, I buy in for 1/2  then just let my stack build.  But my style of play doesn't really need a deep stack.   I usually only post the hands where I look like a LAG, but I'm generally very tight.

I understand what you're saying but if you are going to do anything beyond peddle the nuts (such a semi-bluff like you did here) a deeper stack will come in handy. When you raised 20 there, you just raised half your stack with two streets to come. This really doesn't leave you much room to maneuve.rEdit:Just reread your post and realized I completely missed your point. Never mind.

[rollito]

could have just called his small bet on the flop and tried to hit the flush or make a straight draw to go with the flush draw and reevaluate on the turn

[Vade]

I dunno, that's a very weak bet which does indicate an ace.Take one off the deck and fold if it's not a club

[Swift_Psycho]

I prefer just calling on the flop and seeing what develops on the turn.

[MasterLJ]

People so often confuse "semi-bluff," for betting a draw, they are totally different.A semi bluff is when you are holding, say 10 7, and the flop comes down A 7 2. You are going to bet like you have the Ace and your hand can improve.Betting a draw is betting with no hand whatsoever and is not a semi-bluff and is generally not wise.

[wrto4556]

MasterLJ said:

People so often confuse "semi-bluff," for betting a draw, they are totally different.A semi bluff is when you are holding, say 10 7, and the flop comes down A 7 2. You are going to bet like you have the Ace and your hand can improve.Betting a draw is betting with no hand whatsoever and is not a semi-bluff and is generally not wise.

You're wrong...and its funny because you think you're right.A semibluff is where you don't have the best hand at the moment but you can still win the pot in two different ways. One, by getting everyone to fold, two, by improving to the best hand by the river.Learn something new every day.

[pokargrl]

Looks like I had 3 basic options here;1) Call, and see the turn for cheap. Given my raise preflop, he still will probably have a hard time putting me on a flush with the Ac out there. If I brick the turn, I'll have to evaluate his bet, and proceed from there.2) Make a pretty significant raise (about 15-25$ like I did), and hope to get him out now. If he calls, take a free card on the turn if unimproved. If further unimproved, let him have the pot unless I really think a river bluff will knock him out. 3) All in straight up. I thought an all in would look a little too much like a bluff. It's possible I could have pushed him off his pair with such a significant raise though. It's much harder to call a 50$ all in with A8o than it is to raise with it. How many would have chosen #3 instead of #2? If I'm going to bet so aggressively on my draw, should I just go all in to do all I can to get him out?

[MasterLJ]

wrto4556 said:

MasterLJ said:

People so often confuse "semi-bluff," for betting a draw, they are totally different.A semi bluff is when you are holding, say 10 7, and the flop comes down A 7 2. You are going to bet like you have the Ace and your hand can improve.Betting a draw is betting with no hand whatsoever and is not a semi-bluff and is generally not wise.

You're wrong...and its funny because you think you're right.A semibluff is where you don't have the best hand at the moment but you can still win the pot in two different ways. One, by getting everyone to fold, two, by improving to the best hand by the river.Learn something new every day.

He's betting a draw, how more clear can it be?It's not a semi-bluff, it's betting a draw. He has no hand to speak of, and nothing to fall back on. At worst we have a difference in definition, no need to get nasty about it.

[Swift_Psycho]

MasterLJ said:

wrto4556 said:

MasterLJ said:

People so often confuse "semi-bluff," for betting a draw, they are totally different.A semi bluff is when you are holding, say 10 7, and the flop comes down A 7 2. You are going to bet like you have the Ace and your hand can improve.Betting a draw is betting with no hand whatsoever and is not a semi-bluff and is generally not wise.

You're wrong...and its funny because you think you're right.A semibluff is where you don't have the best hand at the moment but you can still win the pot in two different ways. One, by getting everyone to fold, two, by improving to the best hand by the river.Learn something new every day.

He's betting a draw, how more clear can it be?It's not a semi-bluff, it's betting a draw. He has no hand to speak of, and nothing to fall back on. At worst we have a difference in definition, no need to get nasty about it.

Like always, I'm not a big fan of being "nasty" (unless you ask for it, then my demeanor towards you may change). I don't think WRTO really meant to insult you though, and he's a pretty cool guy. But, he is correct on this one. I have "The Theory of Poker" right in front of me currently. Here is a quote: "A semi-bluff is a bet with a hand which, if called, does not figure to be the best hand at the moment but has a reasonable chance of outdrawing those hands that initially called it." Betting a flush draw would certainly fit into that definition of semi-bluffing. Heck, you even have 9 outs to the flush. In your definition of semi-bluffing with middle pair, you would only have 5 outs to outdraw top pair.Just to get back onto the topic of this thread, I dislike semi-bluffing with a flush draw unless I have overcards as well at low limit NL hold'em, especially with a short stack. That is why I preferred a flat call on the flop.

[MasterLJ]

Hmm, I was just reading that book and reading about the misconceptions of the term "semi-bluff.'" But if you have it right there and I'm wrong, then I'm wrong. I'm just sad that my e-p3nis just lost about an inch =.

[wrto4556]

I'm just a little rough around the edges.

[Suited_Up]

Also... He is a She.But to the OP... You might wanna change your favorite hand, lol. Just sayin. But I guess it could be for another reason besides it being a great hand. I do like 10-8s myself, so nevermind.

[wrto4556]

Suited_Up said:

Also... He is a She.But to the OP... You might wanna change your favorite hand, lol. Just sayin. But I guess it could be for another reason besides it being a great hand. I do like 10-8s myself, so nevermind.

You're going to get your e-ass kicked! :-)