7 replies to this topic

[akishore]

this is a terribly terribly played hand, and i knew it while i was playing it. but really, the results just cracked me up. i'm not really looking for criticism, i was super-bored and the table was super-passive and it was going to be my last hand.PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Omaha/8 (9 handed) converterPreflop: Hero is MP3 with [J :diamond: ], [T :diamond: ], [6 :club: ], [A :club: ]. MP2 posts a blind of $0.25. CO posts a blind of $0.35. 1 fold, MP2 (poster) checks, Hero calls, CO (poster) checks, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.a very loose call. looks pretty, but i'm really only drawing to the nut flush or nut straight. i have no real low draw, and my hand only works in maybe two ways at best. weak. my thoughts? "i should fold, but oh well."Flop: (7.40 SB) [7 :club: ], [3 :heart: ], [K :spade: ] (7 players)SB checks, BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds.hey, i have a terrible low draw along with backdoor nut straight and backdoor nut flush draws! the pot's small, so easy fold, but call call call! maybe i'll pick up a draw on the turn!Turn: (5.70 BB) [2 :club: ] (4 players)BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 folds, Hero calls.oh baby! i have a terrible low, but i've picked up a nut flush draw! i'm only drawing to half the pot, really, so i should fold, but call anyway!River: (8.70 BB) [J :spade: ] (3 players)BB bets, UTG+1 calls, Hero calls.oh too bad, i didn't hit my nut flush. but i did hit a pair of jacks! of course, one pair wins the high end in a multiway pot maybe 0.2% of the time, and there's an overcard to my pair. but hey, i have a low, right? it's not bad, it's only the... fourth-nut low... but hey, it's only one more bet. i might even scoop the pot with my jacks and 6-low!Final Pot: 11.70 BBResults below:UTG+1 has 4 2 T 2 (High: three of a kind, twos). Hero has J T 6 A (Low: 7, 6, 3, 2, A | High: one pair, jacks). BB has K 5 9 3 (High: two pair, kings and threes). Outcome: Hero wins 5.85 BB. UTG+1 wins 5.85 BB.hero wins half the pot with a 6-low, while BB was betting all the way with top+bottom pair and UTG+1 called him down with a third-nut low draw and bottom set. ah, i love o8. this is how you know you get paid off big time with the nuts + nut redraw in a six-way pot.aseem

[Emptyeye]

Ooh, you mean when I move up to .25/.50 people still play incredibly stupid?*Is already licking chops despite not being close to adequately BRed for such a game*Seriously, I'm far from a competent O8 player, and I crush nickel-dime there.

[akishore]

keep in mind that you need half the bankroll for O8 as you do for texas HE at a particular limit. that is, you only need around 100-150 BB's.so for .25/.50, you can play once you hit $50-75. lean towards $75-100 if you're not crushing the game, but if you are, hit it up somewhere between $50-75.aseem

[Emptyeye]

Well, I think I'll be leaning toward the upper end of that spectrum. I understand basic Omaha/O8 concepts, but understanding and application are two different things. Granting that my sample size is rather tiny at this point, but one thing I know needs work is my pre-flop hand selection--I'm currently taking something like 30-40% of flops, which I know needs to come down before I can truly say I'm a winning Omaha player.Question for you as it relates to O8: Let's say we have one of those family-type pots and you're in second position post-flop holding A2xx. Flop comes down something like 3-5-7--you've picked up the nut low and a (non-nut) gutshot straight draw, but not a whole lot else. The person in first position post-flop bets into you. What do you do?I've just been calling in this position (Which contributes to Poker Tracker Omaha giving me a little telephone icon next to my name ), my theory being that I want as much money from as many people as possible in the pot. As I see it, I'm only playing for half the pot at best, and if I raise, I may scare all those people behind me out of the pot as they now have to call two cold, whereas they'll probably stay in for one bet. Yeah, I run the risk of being counterfeited and even losing my half of the pot this way (If I'm not already being quartered), but any made non-nut low probably calls anyway, and this way I can keep people who may be drawing to other lows and/or highs in the pot at a price that helps both them and me.

[Absolute]

A drawing hand like this is valuable in a large multiway pot. I think the PF call is fine at a table with lots of players to most flops.I don't much like your call on the flop. O8 is a game about getting out before you fall more behind. With three behind you to act on the flop, its usually likely that you will be committed to another bet here.I think you have to lay down a drawing hand like this on the flop when it doesn't it.

[akishore]

Emptyeye said:

I'm currently taking something like 30-40% of flops, which I know needs to come down before I can truly say I'm a winning Omaha player.

including blinds, you should only be seeing about 20%. excluding blinds, i see something like 10% or less. just as general advice, find reasons to fold hands pre-flop. really, unlike HE, there's no real harm in folding too many hands since you win so much on the hands you play. a hand like AJ53 ace-suited might look pretty, but i usually fold it. just try to stick to super-premium hands for a while. same with pairs, e.g KK95 is terrible. also in general, one reason to help you fold hands is to only play hands that have several ways to win the pot. you're probably playing too many low-only hands like A268, stuff like that.

Emptyeye said:

Question for you as it relates to O8: Let's say we have one of those family-type pots and you're in second position post-flop holding A2xx. Flop comes down something like 3-5-7--you've picked up the nut low and a (non-nut) gutshot straight draw, but not a whole lot else. The person in first position post-flop bets into you. What do you do?

you nailed it on the head. easy call. a raise is terrible because you only have one end of the pot right now. whenever you only have one end, you want as many people in the pot as possible... equity is hugely important in this game. at the same time, you want to build the pot as much as you can, so raise for value when you're in late (relative to the bet) position.

Absolute said:

A drawing hand like this is valuable in a large multiway pot. I think the PF call is fine at a table with lots of players to most flops. I don't much like your call on the flop. O8 is a game about getting out before you fall more behind. With three behind you to act on the flop, its usually likely that you will be committed to another bet here. I think you have to lay down a drawing hand like this on the flop when it doesn't it.

ha, i know it was a terribly played hand. i mentioned that in the post, not really looking for the obvious criticism :-) . i'm surprised you consider the PF call okay. it'll almost never win the low, and it's not strong enough to play for only high (since the 6 dangles). if the 6 was a K/Q/9 of clubs, i might play it, or if the J or T was a 2, i would play it.aseem

[monoatomic]

I guess I have a different approach to the game of O8B.I play any 3 cards to a wheel, unsuited, suited really doesn't matter. So a hand of A35J I am playing. 23410, A458, any three to the wheel and I am in preflop for one bet sometimes two depending on how many are in the hand and if I have position. I pick up more pots playing 3 to a wheel then any other starting hand I am dealt. A2 or A3 suited with junk with it I am playing for one bet preflop. As well as A2 A3 unsuited but with the A being suited with another card in my hand such as a J or 7.I usually will play just about any 4 to a straight with two suited. So 8910J with two cards of the same suit. One of my favorite hands is the 4567. This takes the high end of the pot more often then not when there are low straight cards one the board. A board like 623J4. I love holding the high end of the straight and usually milk out a ton of money against people playing the lower straight for the high.High cards I usually only play 4 to a straight, or KKAx. I am not a fan of high pocket pairs in my hand. QQxx KKxx(no ace) JJxx, I really don't like to play. A pocket pair though with Ax(with x being a low) I will play again in position or in a pot without many people.AAxx with no low I will play preflop in the blinds, and sometimes in position to one bet. With 5 or 6 to a flop PP in hand aren't in my opinion as good as a good drawing hand.This has netted me rather good results in O8B, but I also play pot limit so results may vary if you are playing limit.

[Naismith]

I admire all of you for having the constitution to play Omaha 8. My friends love that game and it's been the main game we've played for years and I just can't handle it anymore. I'm positive it's all on me and my inability to play, but I can't take consistently flopping the nuts only to have someone chasing the low catch a crazy high on the river. :)I know, I know. That's how you get paid off in the long run. God bless the game with two cards! ;)Peace,Jay