could someone give me a good no limit strat online?

[NickTheKid 0]

What's a good NO-LIMIT Strategy for ONLINE? Bluffing and reads are kind of important, lacking that I need to stick more to my numbers game... does someone have some experience with online no-limit?Pre-emptive thanks

[MilesZS 0]

Depends on what limits you play, really. If you're going to be playing low or micro limits, your play will have to be a bit more straightforward. Bad players don't understand 'cute' plays. They are going to call a lot of the time. The only types of bluffs you MIGHT be able to pull off are when you raise preflop and you don't think the flop hit anyone. Bet the pot. Bet it on the turn too, even if it didn't hit anyone. But you have to play pretty straight up at low limits (obviously I have no advice for you at higher limits). Never be afraid to bet the pot, never be afraid to raise and reraise. Keep control of the hands you are in. If you can keep the table aware of you, and show you aren't afraid to get involved and bet big, you'll get a good amount of action. That's all I got, right now. I keep getting my focus stolen by the tables.

[Dlink 0]

First the disclaimer:Just like in B&M games your strategy is 100% dependant on the table and their skill levels. This can only be ascertained through observation (and copious note taking). Also how many players? And I presume you are referring to Hold 'Em?Okay in lower limit NL games you'll come across all sorts of players and abstract strategies. The key here is exactly the same as ina ny poker game, when the odds favour you get money in the pot. If the game is really loose (this is good) suited connectors go up in value and high pairs go down. Now here is the secret... with this you will blow away 90% of the loose NL games online, in fact I can't believe I am letting it out!RAISE>>>But only fish raise bad cards...why raise with only a mediocre handwhy raise when i can limp in with my suited connectors and save a bet? If you raise anything but premiums starting hands early you can't get a read on your opponents.I can actually hear you whining about all the reasons not to.So lets do a little experiment.... presume you are in a low limit (say 0.25/0.50 NL HE game with a maximum $50 buy in). Most of the people in the room but in at between $5 and $40. So you are the BB, out of 10players 5 have called plus the small blind. You have 7-8 suited. There is currently $3.00 in the pot. This is where you usually check.... STOP. RAISE. Put in an extra 50 cents. Out of 6 you will usually have atleast 3 to 4 at a loose table call. Okay you now have $5.50 in the pot and the flop comes. The flop comes. 1st person bets, you are in the worst possible position to play a drawing hand.... if the flop was good to you, make a bet.... you have 11 to 1 odds before anyone calls... that means you are ahead for flush draws, open ended straights, gut shots, (if you have A-K overcards), just about everything. Not only that but you are so far over the odds that even if there is a big raise and you fold, you could fold in this scenario 5 out of 6 times and still have the overall odds in your favour the 6th time! Conservative solid play may get you a small profit, but if you want to decimate them, build big pots.Also there is an added advantage to this, you'll get players who think they know what they are doing insulting you.... egg them on, people with bad manners deserve to lose their money. They will start tilting, they will decide to get you and they will keep trying to call you even when you switch to being conservative.one of the best lines for these idiots is "You lost and you're giving me advice"and my other favourite in response to"I can'y play with idiots/fish/whatever""No, no, you just can'tplay."The only other piece of advice I can give you is to this for a couple of rounds, if you lose rebuy, the go ultratight... change gears suddenly, switch back and forth every little while, but most importantly, see who will call when there is a flush and straight draw andheavy raising with their paired queens -- he will pay you off big time if you are patient.

What's a good NO-LIMIT Strategy for ONLINE? Bluffing and reads are kind of important, lacking that I need to stick more to my numbers game... does someone have some experience with online no-limit?Pre-emptive thanks

[Smasharoo 0]

It's stunning how much bnad strategy is generated when games are full of bad players and nearly anyone can beat them.I mean amazing.

[Dlink 0]

Come on Smash, this is a strategy aimed at a table where every second person is a calling station, which is a suprising number of the lower limit tables. Wait till you hit a nut or have the odds to hit it and take it, what is so fundementally wrong with that?It wouldn't work in real life or even at a half decent table where people considered their starting hands, or looked at the flop. But against passive callers it works, the key offcourse then becomes game selection.

It's stunning how much bnad strategy is generated when games are full of bad players and nearly anyone can beat them.I mean amazing.

[Smasharoo 0]

It wouldn't work in real life or even at a half decent table where people considered their starting hands, or looked at the flop. But against passive callers it works, the key offcourse then becomes game selection. You know those plastic birds with the red liquid in them that bob up and down if you put water in front of them?Putting a mouse in front of one of them instead of water would work against many online games.Here's a strategy:Play only Ax suited and PP.Move al in with AA and KK pre-flop regardless of position or anything else.Limp with everything else.Fold if you don't flop a set or a flush draw.When you flop a set or complete a nut flush draw, bet a lot.Count your money.Done.Doing that will make you more money than 90% of people who beat NL online because the game's so stunningly bad and somehow come to the conclusion that it's because they're raising 78s multiway pre-flop./shrug

[MilesZS 0]

Just to clarify, I know I'm not a great player. I'm just trying to build a bankroll here. If my advice was bad, please point it out, man. I can only get better from here, really.Yeah, your method obviously will work. Mine seems to work so far. Maybe it's not genius, I've got a lot to learn. Feel free to show me the holes.

[HtotheNootch 0]

Smash's strat WORKS. However if you're going to play it, either have a good book handy or keep the FCP forums open because it gets boring after a while.

[Smasharoo 0]

Just to clarify, I know I'm not a great player. I'm just trying to build a bankroll here. If my advice was bad, please point it out, man. I can only get better from here, really.Yeah, your method obviously will work. Mine seems to work so far. Maybe it's not genius, I've got a lot to learn.Feel free to show me the holes.Holes in what, a strategy? You didn't post one. You posted "Don't bluff, and bet when you have something" basically.

[slappy110 0]

smash is wrong here. i like building the pot here because for an extra .50, you may win a TON more simply by the players being so bad wanting to win that big pot. Although its geared toward limit, sklansky writes in one of his books that in late position (or in the blinds for that matter as you are "late position" for that round of betting) it may be correct to raise with suited connectors to build a huge pot. However, one downside i can see here is another think sklansky addresses. And that is where you're profits come from. Your profits come from everytime you're opponents make mistakes. Right? well, if you keep the pot small, its easier to control who's getting what odds. Simply by virtue of your opponents being bad players, they most likely don't even know what they're getting in terms of odds. This said, it is much easier to make you opponents make mistakes when the pots are smaller. Again this is something that applies more the limit holdem than NL but i think the general concept is applicable to both. Either way though a raise with a suited connector is a good play i think, especially from the BB because you have a TON of equity. I'll go out and play around with this idea and see where it leads me....good luck at the tables. smash... kiss my ass

[Smasharoo 0]

Smash's strat WORKS. However if you're going to play it, either have a good book handy or keep the FCP forums open because it gets boring after a while.That's for sure.All NL gets boring to me after a while though, it's allways about pushing big edges and trying not to fall asleep while you fold most of your hands.Limit's a lot more intresting, complex, and requires massively more subtelty. It's the diffrence between sculpting marble and building something out of Duplos.

[Dlink 0]

I am quite sure it is my method he is critisizing. And he is right -- solid poker works against most people most of the time. It also has a much lower variance. But as with anything I believe a strategy must meet ones goals. I have been making a comfortable living for 4 months using my method and that is enough for me. I also go through some real heart churning sessions. However with so much in the pot, good notes and good post-flop play (even if it is only - Do I have the nut, what are the odds of me drawing the nut, do I need a nut to beat x) you can work this quit successfully. I know because I have been playing it 25 to 40 hours a week for 2 1/2 months. It is obviously modified to fit various situations, but in essence find me a loose low limit table where I can build big pots cheaply, and then once I have a real advantage jam them, and I am a happy camper.

Just to clarify, I know I'm not a great player.  I'm just trying to build a bankroll here.  If my advice was bad, please point it out, man.  I can only get better from here, really.Yeah, your method obviously will work.  Mine seems to work so far.  Maybe it's not genius, I've got a lot to learn.  Feel free to show me the holes.

[MilesZS 0]

True. I didn't know if you were implying I was an idiot or not, and if so I was hoping I could find out why I am an idiot so I can fix it. hahaJust trying to learn. Unfortunately I'm proud of my progress so far, so my pride my get in the way once in a while on here.

[NickTheKid 0]

It wouldn't work in real life or even at a half decent table where people considered their starting hands, or looked at the flop. But against passive callers it works, the key offcourse then becomes game selection.  You know those plastic birds with the red liquid in them that bob up and down if you put water in front of them?Putting a mouse in front of one of them instead of water would work against many online games.Here's a strategy:Play only Ax suited and PP.Move al in with AA and KK pre-flop regardless of position or anything else.Limp with everything else.Fold if you don't flop a set or a flush draw.When you flop a set or complete a nut flush draw, bet a lot.Count your money.That sounds like a good plan, but throwing a whole bankroll on K-K and flushes just feel like timebombs waiting to explode, don't get me wrong it's a great system... but the way people hit stuff sometimes, it would suck to get drawn out against Q-Q or something with K-K, or even be up against A-A for that matter. The only MOD I'd make to that strat is not going all in with K-K Pre, but raising it a lot. But great strat none-the-less.Done.Doing that will make you more money than 90% of people who beat NL online because the game's so stunningly bad and somehow come to the conclusion that it's because they're raising 78s multiway pre-flop./shrug

[Smasharoo 0]

smash is wrong here. i like building the pot here because for an extra .50, you may win a TON more simply by the players being so bad wanting to win that big pot. Although its geared toward limit, sklansky writes in one of his books that in late position (or in the blinds for that matter as you are "late position" for that round of betting) it may be correct to raise with suited connectors to build a huge pot. However, one downside i can see here is another think sklansky addresses. And that is where you're profits come from. Your profits come from everytime you're opponents make mistakes. Right? well, if you keep the pot small, its easier to control who's getting what odds. Simply by virtue of your opponents being bad players, they most likely don't even know what they're getting in terms of odds. This said, it is much easier to make you opponents make mistakes when the pots are smaller. Again this is something that applies more the limit holdem than NL but i think the general concept is applicable to both. Either way though a raise with a suited connector is a good play i think, especially from the BB because you have a TON of equity. I'll go out and play around with this idea and see where it leads me....good luck at the tables.smash... kiss my assReading Sklansky doesn't help if you don't understand it.You completely missed his point here, and also are trying to apply advice from the wrong GAME. Limit and NL strategy are vastly vastly diffrent.

[NickTheKid 0]

wtf happened too my post? Uh okay, anyway.Good Strat, REALLY good idea, but I'd change one thing.Pushing with K-K regardless of Position is scary on a big table. It would suck to get some callers with A-A, or any pocket pair for that matter and getting drawn out and losing like 200 bucks like that.Other than that, sure it would work great

[Smasharoo 0]

But as with anything I believe a strategy must meet ones goals. I have been making a comfortable living for 4 months using my method and that is enough for me.In spite of it, I'd say.The sooner you realise that the sooner you'll have amuch better win rate.Lots of people find ego more importnat than improving though./shrug.

[SapphireTiger 0]

It wouldn't work in real life or even at a half decent table where people considered their starting hands, or looked at the flop. But against passive callers it works, the key offcourse then becomes game selection.  You know those plastic birds with the red liquid in them that bob up and down if you put water in front of them?Putting a mouse in front of one of them instead of water would work against many online games.Here's a strategy:Play only Ax suited and PP.Move al in with AA and KK pre-flop regardless of position or anything else.Limp with everything else.Fold if you don't flop a set or a flush draw.When you flop a set or complete a nut flush draw, bet a lot.Count your money.Done.Doing that will make you more money than 90% of people who beat NL online because the game's so stunningly bad and somehow come to the conclusion that it's because they're raising 78s multiway pre-flop./shrug

Just to clarify...play indicates a limp right?And calling raises?

[Smasharoo 0]

Pushing with K-K regardless of Position is scary on a big table. Nah it's great to get called by anything but AA. sure, you'll get calle by AA too, but you're going to end up losing the money in that hand no matter how you play it.

[NickTheKid 0]

But in No limit, pushing just out of the blue like that makes it crazy, you could be up like 200 bucks for the day and drop it on one hand.

[Smasharoo 0]

Just to clarify...play indicates a limp right?And calling raises?I'm not programming a bot. Call a smallish raise if there are implied odds from the raiser if you hit the set or flush or whatnot, if not, don't. If you have 22 and someone with $4 rasies $3, fold.

[Smasharoo 0]

But in No limit, pushing just out of the blue like that makes it crazy, you could be up like 200 bucks for the day and drop it on one hand.I'd be worried about that if I only had one day to play NL for the rest of my life, I guess.I'm fairly sure that isn't the case for most people.90% or the time (much more actually) you're way ahead with KK.

[Dlink 0]

But unlike in limit a single loss here can do a lot more damage. This is offset by the fact that it is easier to make it up, but if you are concerned in making money for next weeks rent, you have to think twice before doing something that would be great if you were risk neutral.2 + 2 had an article recently on how people willingness to take risk varies depending on amount, odds and potential pay off. Just because a bet gives me an advantage I will not always take it.Also I go all in with K-K to be called with A-A. I lose a large sum. I go all in with K-K and everyone but the "I bought the minimum so I could go all in" crowd (who are prolific online) folds. Great so I I win less when I go all in with them and lose more. I know there are a lot of calling stations online but would the return really match the cost and the potential risk?This is meant as an inquiry, not an argument.

Pushing with K-K regardless of Position is scary on a big table. Nah it's great to get called by anything but AA.  sure, you'll get calle by AA too, but you're going to end up losing the money in that hand no matter how you play it.

[Smasharoo 0]

I know there are a lot of calling stations online but would the return really match the cost and the potential risk? No, it vastly exceeds it.Here's a little excersize. Let's say you win the blinds EVERY time someone doesn't have AA. how deep would your stack have to be relative to blind size to make this push -EV in that circumstance?

[Batch 0]

smashs idea should work pretty good