Facing The Double Check/raise (10/20)

[iggymcfly 0]

Typical donkish Bodog game. No real reads on the players involved though.Pre-flop: (8 players) Hero is CO with Q A UTG calls, 1 fold, MP raises, Hero 3-bets, Button calls, 2 folds, UTG calls, MP caps, 3 calls.Flop: A 8 K (17.5SB, 4 players)UTG checks, MP bets, Hero calls, Button calls, UTG raises, MP folds, Hero calls, Button calls.Turn: 3 (12.25BB, 3 players)UTG checks, Hero bets, Button calls, UTG raises, Hero ???

[Shimmering Wang 1]

How have you been playing?

[LuckyMcCatcher 0]

Typical donkish Bodog game. No real reads on the players involved though.Pre-flop: (8 players) Hero is CO with Q A UTG calls, 1 fold, MP raises, Hero 3-bets, Button calls, 2 folds, UTG calls, MP caps, 3 calls.Flop: A 8 K (17.5SB, 4 players)UTG checks, MP bets, Hero calls, Button calls, UTG raises, MP folds, Hero calls, Button calls.Turn: 3 (12.25BB, 3 players)UTG checks, Hero bets, Button calls, UTG raises, Hero ???

You are so beat but u have no reads so call down. P.S. check behind on turn. He never has Aj or Qjh here.

[iggymcfly 0]

I've been playing relatively TAG. Haven't been involved in a lot of pots. Also, villian let his timer run almost all the way down before raising the turn if that affects anyone's decision one way or the other.

[Shimmering Wang 1]

The fact that the UTG player is going off is weird. Which means I call. 88? KhXh? AT/AJo?I just call it down. UTG played the hand too weird for me to give him any respect. If he flopped a set, or a weirdo two-pair, oh well. I'll pay him off. And poop on myself.

[Head_Trauma 0]

Does anyone like raising this flop? I know it seems dumb, but I think it really clarifies our hand, here's why:1) We have the best possible one pair hand. Every hand that beats us will almost certainly 3 bet.2) If it comes back to us capped, we can easily toss our hand. Even if it is only 3 bet, we are probably drawing nearly dead and can throw it away, or get away fairly cheap by the turn.3) If for some reason a hand that beats us only calls our raise, we can still check behind on the turn, then call a river bet.4) I dunno, I don't love this play, I just find it better than, "I have no read on anyone, gotta call down."

[TheCinciKid 0]

I'll confess, I read replies on this one. The hand played out pretty weird, so like Wang I think I'm calling it down...esp without reads. At least, we can make a note and get some sort of decent read on UTG after the hand. I also kind of like Head_Trauma's flop raise idea. I tend to think that if we're gonna stay in this hand we should raise the flop to try to get some idea of where we are. We currently have the best one pair hand possible, if MP flopped a set or two pair with AK or something he's gonna 3-bet the flop and we get a good idea of where we're at. Btw, UTG played this hand like a monkey the whole way. I have absolutely no idea where he's at. The most likely scenario is probably a set based on his pre-flop and flop play, but who knows. I'm definitely calling down here for the info more than anything else.

[DonkSlayer 1]

Veeeeery interesting.I think you have to raise the flop. Easy dump if 3bet by UTG and capped by MP, easy dump on the turn otherwise.Major wtfness going on with UTG. I can't think of one situation where his play is optimal, regardless of his holdings OR your image. If you're playing really TAG and have folded to strong heat earlier, I see what UTG might be thinking here with a big draw, but other than that, I can't justify it. At this point, we're either WA/WB, and we DEFINITELY want to see what this guy has if we're going to be at the table for a while, so call down. Hahahaha so do we bet the river if UTG checks again and a heart didn't come ????

[iggymcfly 0]

Yeah, looking at all the action now, I agree it's a definite call-down. At the time, I didn't realize that UTG had limped PF, and just assumed that he had to be going for the double C/R with AK or maybe a set because it would be such a bad bluff into a multi-way pot. The hesitation just screamed of Hollywooding with him thinking how clever he was, and I was thinking from a game theory standpoint how I always think it's stupid how often people pay off the double C/R so I decided to let this one go.Anyway, UTG had KJ (WTF! GRR!) and Button's AJ won the pot.

[Shimmering Wang 1]

Yeah, looking at all the action now, I agree it's a definite call-down. At the time, I didn't realize that UTG had limped PF, and just assumed that he had to be going for the double C/R with AK or maybe a set because it would be such a bad bluff into a multi-way pot. The hesitation just screamed of Hollywooding with him thinking how clever he was, and I was thinking from a game theory standpoint how I always think it's stupid how often people pay off the double C/R so I decided to let this one go.Anyway, UTG had KJ (WTF! GRR!) and Button's AJ won the pot.

In a game like this, we can't afford not to call down, especially since the pot's bloated from the other player...The only hand this could be is 88

[LuckyMcCatcher 0]

And poop on myself.

standard

[CoranMoran 0]

and Button's AJ won the pot.

You got outdrawn by a J on the river?--cm

[Shimmering Wang 1]

You got outdrawn by a J on the river?--cm

I think he folded the turn when the action got back to him