9 replies to this topic

[Gallo]

I hate being out of position with this hand and for the most part and somewhat at odds as to how to play this hand. Although at times I do consider the player and chip stacks. But here is one instance where I was unsure as to how to play it.

This was at FTP and I don't have the hand history at the moment. The blinds were at 60/120, I was in the BB. There are 6 players left it was an SNG. One player limps in, he had around 2500 or so. Since it was just going to be me and him I contemplated 2 things:
1. Just pushing all in
2. Raising 3-4x.
I really didn't think about checking here, which is what I tend to do quite a bit because it really disguises my hand if I hit an Ace or K.

The thing with raising is that I knew he would call, plus I would only be left with 1000 chips after the raise, which I didn't really like. And it would suck if I missed the flop.

So what should be my play?

------
Sorry, I had a little under 1500

[GABMAD]

What's your stack size?

[WhatArunAA]

I raise to 400 and adjust accordingly to the texture of the flop after the flop.

[copernicus]

I check preflop, check raise a hit on the flop, check fold if I miss. I dont like a standard raise here. He has a position call with any real values, and when you miss the flop most of the time you dont know what to do. why invest any more when you know that 2/3 of the time you are going to have trouble playing the hand post flop.

I also dont hate a push preflop. There is 300 in the pot, a meaningful addition to your 1300 or so.

I hate any sort of a raise other than a push.

[Flack_attack]

I check preflop, check raise a hit on the flop, check fold if I miss. I dont like a standard raise here. He has a position call with any real values, and when you miss the flop most of the time you dont know what to do. why invest any more when you know that 2/3 of the time you are going to have trouble playing the hand post flop.

I also dont hate a push preflop. There is 300 in the pot, a meaningful addition to your 1300 or so.

I hate any sort of a raise other than a push.

Interesting approach. I think I'll try this more often.

What about later in the SNG when blinds go up though? Do you raise to take blinds and/or put the limper to a decision?

[copernicus]

Interesting approach. I think I'll try this more often.

What about later in the SNG when blinds go up though? Do you raise to take blinds and/or put the limper to a decision?

With the same number of players and the same stacks, just higher blinds? Then pushing becomes the only option. M would be down below 5 and theres no room at all to raise.

[Gallo]

I check preflop, check raise a hit on the flop, check fold if I miss. I dont like a standard raise here. He has a position call with any real values, and when you miss the flop most of the time you dont know what to do. why invest any more when you know that 2/3 of the time you are going to have trouble playing the hand post flop.

I also dont hate a push preflop. There is 300 in the pot, a meaningful addition to your 1300 or so.

I hate any sort of a raise other than a push.

That's how I normally play my big hands when I'm in the blinds, except when the blinds start to get high.

Anyway, I decided to raise it since this guy had been limping in quite a bit and I thought that maybe I'd be able to push him out. He called, I got in trouble when I pushed on the flop that I thought was "safe". He called, he had 22 and hit a set on the flop.

My gut kept telling me to just push all in here. I don't know if he would've called. But I would've rather have pushed preflop than raise.

[fckthis]

I check preflop, check raise a hit on the flop, check fold if I miss. I dont like a standard raise here. He has a position call with any real values, and when you miss the flop most of the time you dont know what to do. why invest any more when you know that 2/3 of the time you are going to have trouble playing the hand post flop.

I also dont hate a push preflop. There is 300 in the pot, a meaningful addition to your 1300 or so.

I hate any sort of a raise other than a push.

[Ice_W0lf]

this is coming from a tourney donk, but i'm trying to improve my play through posting here.. so i'm just throwing this out there.. but is our hand too good for a stop and go? depending on the quality of the player, couldnt this work twofold? he's probably not gonna call the push unless he hits his monster (isnt that the danger of the stop and go anyway).. and if we do hit our ace or king, could the villian just think we are representing the ace or king and call with a smaller pair (1010+), or perhaps with a weaker ace or king?

again, just a tourney donk spouting off....


edit: replied without reading results

[copernicus]

this is coming from a tourney donk, but i'm trying to improve my play through posting here.. so i'm just throwing this out there.. but is our hand too good for a stop and go? depending on the quality of the player, couldnt this work twofold? he's probably not gonna call the push unless he hits his monster (isnt that the danger of the stop and go anyway).. and if we do hit our ace or king, could the villian just think we are representing the ace or king and call with a smaller pair (1010+), or perhaps with a weaker ace or king?

again, just a tourney donk spouting off....
edit: replied without reading results

Stop and goes work far better with middle pairs than they do with AK. The purpose of a stop and go is to have more fold equity on the flop than you did PF. From the pair side of things, preflop there is very little fold equity against AK and higher pairs. When the flop shows an A or K you pickup fold equity against higher pairs and when an A or K dont flop you pick up fold equity against AK.

If you have AK against a middle pair, where is the increase in fold equity? When you hit the A or K..but its not really fold equity any longer, youre way ahead, so you havent gained anything over a preflop push. When small cards flop the pairs dont suddenly get scared and fold unless they were playing for set value, but hands that are playing for set value cant stand a raise preflop, so again, AK plays better without the stop and go.

To put it in the Sklansky way...AK wants to see all 5 cards more than middle pairs do, so if youre committing all of your chips, commit them in the way that benefits your opponent less. Thats a preflop push with AK (because the opponent cant get away from it if he sees an A or K on the flop or misses his set), and a stop and go for middle pairs, because it can take down pots it couldnt have preflop.