Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Watching the Ottawa - Minnesotta game and they just called a penalty shot against Ottawa because Fisher closed his hand on the puck in the crease. Only problem was he didn't close his hand on it. He pushed the puck in between his legs and never actually garbbed the puck. I guess when your told to be anal with the calls you get sume idiot refs prematurley blow their load and make stupid calls.The announcers think its a blown call as well FYI.Edit: OMG, Alfreddson hooked on breakaway and no call. Granted I don't think it should be a call but in the new NHL and the fact they called a penalty shot means they need to call that one too. I can't stand inconsistent reffing. Ruins the game. Link to post Share on other sites
mrdannyg 274 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 the refs do know the rules. unfortunately they are not computers, and cannot make the right call every time. and even if they were, we'd cry about unfairness to the home team.they didn't get a call wrong, they just missed it. Link to post Share on other sites
Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Share Posted November 21, 2006 the refs do know the rules. unfortunately they are not computers, and cannot make the right call every time. and even if they were, we'd cry about unfairness to the home team.they didn't get a call wrong, they just missed it.Your wrong, the problem lies within the 2 referee system. There not neccesarily missing calls. One ref at one end of the ice has a different view of what is and isn't a penalty so you get inconsistent refing because one ref would call a penalty for a certain play while another wouldn't.Sure, refs DO miss things but if you watched the plays I'm talking about they completly blew it and it was completly inconsistent. Link to post Share on other sites
mrdannyg 274 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Your wrong, the problem lies within the 2 referee system. There not neccesarily missing calls. One ref at one end of the ice has a different view of what is and isn't a penalty so you get inconsistent refing because one ref would call a penalty for a certain play while another wouldn't.Sure, refs DO miss things but if you watched the plays I'm talking about they completly blew it and it was completly inconsistent.you're making very little sense. Refs having different opinions is true whether there is one or two refs on the ice. If anything, having two refs is better, since its more likely the calls made will be a compromise between the two, and therefore less extreme than if there was just one.I'm not saying 2 refs is necessarily better, but it does allow the game to be (on average) called closer to the rules. Link to post Share on other sites
Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Share Posted November 21, 2006 you're making very little sense. Refs having different opinions is true whether there is one or two refs on the ice. If anything, having two refs is better, since its more likely the calls made will be a compromise between the two, and therefore less extreme than if there was just one.I'm not saying 2 refs is necessarily better, but it does allow the game to be (on average) called closer to the rules.and i'm not making sence? If there is a ref who generally lets a lot more go compared to another ref your certainly going to have quite a discrepency in the refing during the game. The refs will generally let the one who is closer to the play make the calls around them since they are closer to the play and have better judgement. Depending on what ref is closest to the play/ or infraction then at times your going to have 1 play called a penalty while a similar play not. Link to post Share on other sites
nell789 0 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I haven't read the arguements fully, but I back up my boy DannyG. Also, the OP doesn't know how to spell the word "sense".And he smells. Link to post Share on other sites
mrdannyg 274 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I haven't read the arguements fully, but I back up my boy DannyG. Also, the OP doesn't know how to spell the word "sense".And he smells.heh, nor "discrepancy," "their," "you're" and probably others.in the context of a single game, he is partially right. however if you look at the average for all games, a two-ref system gets it much closer to the rules than one would.also his title is a misnomer. he is not arguing the refs don't know the rules. Link to post Share on other sites
Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Share Posted November 21, 2006 Oh know, spelling mistakes. The sky is falling! All i'm asking for is some consistency in the refing. Either they need to learn the rules so they're not calling bogus penalty shots or if they make the wrong call against one team they need to make the same wrong call on the other so its atleast even. Link to post Share on other sites
mrdannyg 274 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Oh know, spelling mistakes. The sky is falling! All i'm asking for is some consistency in the refing. Either they need to learn the rules so they're not calling bogus penalty shots or if they make the wrong call against one team they need to make the same wrong call on the other so its atleast even.your team lost a game, get over it.you really aren't making sense. Link to post Share on other sites
SBriand 4 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Oh know, spelling mistakes.It's not spelling mistakes, it's "haven't gotten past 3rd grade grammar". Link to post Share on other sites
ajs510 122 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Oh know, spelling mistakes. The sky is falling! All i'm asking for is some consistency in the refing. Either they need to learn the rules so they're not calling bogus penalty shots or if they make the wrong call against one team they need to make the same wrong call on the other so its atleast even.A game that relies on human observance , experience, and split second determinations of fault is never going to be 100% perfect. It just isn't. The only way to be close to 100% would be to to have a ref watching a bank of video monitors with the ability to stop the game and assess penalties based on what he sees. I would imagine eventually (and I don't mean soon) that's the course of action the league will take, and just have linesmen on the ice to break up fights, drop the puck, and watch for icing, and offsides. The refs do a fantastic job, but nobody can get it 100% right all the time. At least your team didn't lose a Stanley Cup on a horrible no-call. Link to post Share on other sites
strategy 4 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 At least your team didn't lose a Stanley Cup on a horrible no-call. Yeah, I'd imagine adam will always win the ref complaint contests. LOL Link to post Share on other sites
Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Share Posted November 21, 2006 your team lost a game, get over it.you really aren't making sense.Man I'm not even going to argue anymore with an idiot. My team never lost because my team didn't play last night. I simply watched the Sens - Wild game and noticed some horrible officiating. Sure it happens from time to time but I just thought I'd point it out last night because of how horrible it was.I've made plenty of sense but you clearly have not, claiming 'my team lost.' Maybe what I said in my earlier posts would have made sense to you if you could master the simple ability of reading comprehension.I'm not asking for the refs to be perfect. All I want is some consistency. I've seen some games were the officiating was very good and others where its been brutal. It could very well boil down to the fact that some of the refs just aren't experienced or good enough.The 2 ref system is much better then 1 as the players are less likely to get away with an infraction but I think it has led to inexperienced refs being pushed into the NHL too soon and it shows. Link to post Share on other sites
ajs510 122 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 There are a grand total of 33 full-time NHL referees working in the league today, and not one of them has been a member of the NHL Officials Assosiation (which means, calling NHL games) for less than 3 years. Monday's game was refereed by Paul Devorski and Dave Jackson, two gentlemen who have over 30 years of combined experience referreeing at the NHL level (Devorski since 1989, Jackson since 1987). The argument that the refs are inexperienced and being pushed too far too fast doesn't hold a single bit of water in this case. If a call was blown, it's because that happens from time to time. Link to post Share on other sites
mrdannyg 274 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Man I'm not even going to argue anymore with an idiot. My team never lost because my team didn't play last night. I simply watched the Sens - Wild game and noticed some horrible officiating. Sure it happens from time to time but I just thought I'd point it out last night because of how horrible it was.I've made plenty of sense but you clearly have not, claiming 'my team lost.' Maybe what I said in my earlier posts would have made sense to you if you could master the simple ability of reading comprehension.I'm not asking for the refs to be perfect. All I want is some consistency. I've seen some games were the officiating was very good and others where its been brutal. It could very well boil down to the fact that some of the refs just aren't experienced or good enough.The 2 ref system is much better then 1 as the players are less likely to get away with an infraction but I think it has led to inexperienced refs being pushed into the NHL too soon and it shows.you suggested that if the refs make a mistake, then they should make a mistake the other way to make up for it.that implies two things:- they are aware they made a mistake, and still choose not to correct it- two wrongs make a rightamong other illogical statements, including the title.now you have admitted that two refs are better than one, that refs know the rules, and that they try their best. so what exactly is your point?Yes, the referees may have made a mistake last night. It happens, and it is no big deal. They try their hardest, its a tough job, and they're human.Your wrong, the problem lies within the 2 referee system. The 2 ref system is much better then 1 as the players are less likely to get away with an infraction but I think it has led to inexperienced refs being pushed into the NHL too soon and it shows. It could very well boil down to the fact that some of the refs just aren't experienced or good enough. Monday's game was refereed by Paul Devorski and Dave Jackson, two gentlemen who have over 30 years of combined experience referreeing at the NHL level (Devorski since 1989, Jackson since 1987).ugh, i feel dumb for wasting my time with this argument. thanks for the stats and backup Adam and Da Funkster. Link to post Share on other sites
Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Share Posted November 21, 2006 There are a grand total of 33 full-time NHL referees working in the league today, and not one of them has been a member of the NHL Officials Assosiation (which means, calling NHL games) for less than 3 years. Monday's game was refereed by Paul Devorski and Dave Jackson, two gentlemen who have over 30 years of combined experience referreeing at the NHL level (Devorski since 1989, Jackson since 1987). The argument that the refs are inexperienced and being pushed too far too fast doesn't hold a single bit of water in this case. If a call was blown, it's because that happens from time to time.Thats good to know. Now I know that the horrible officiating job last night was not due to inexperience. Hopefully it was an exception and not the norm for these 2 guys. Just because they have experience does not make them good refs but since I know nothing about these 2 refs I will give them the benifit of the doubt and assume it was just one of those nights.I watched the game last night as neither a Sens or Wild fan and hopefully that game was an exception to the way that most games have been refed this year. Edit: Lol. Just because I said the 2 ref system is better then the 1 ref system doesn't mean my initial statement that the problem lies within the 2 ref system is not correct. Taking quotes out of context is brilliant. Do you work for the tabloids? Link to post Share on other sites
fryer98 30 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 blah blah blahJust wondering, do you have any experience with reffing hockey games? (And I don't mean YMCA floor hockey.) Link to post Share on other sites
SBriand 4 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Just because they have experience does not make them good refs but since I know nothing about these 2 refs I will give them the benifit of the doubt and assume it was just one of those nights.How long have you been watching hockey to not know those two refs? You don't know who Paul Devorski is? He has reffed 967 games, 102 playoff games, and has been a ref in many internaltional games, even gold medal games. He is a top teir ref. Have you even been a ref? I doubt it but I will ask. It's not easy. I tried it a couple times in the beer league I used to play in. You miss calls. You don't do it maliciously, but you do miss them. Sometimes you know you made a mistake, sometimes you do not. I bet they didn't realize they did until after the game. Oh well. Instead of crying about it, feel free to use that big brain of yours and try and make a robot that will make the correct call 100% of the time. Feel free to be pissed but at least argue it intelligently and without so much contradiction and lack of knowledge on the subject.Edit: Lol. Just because I said the 2 ref system is better then the 1 ref system doesn't mean my initial statement that the problem lies within the 2 ref system is not correct. Taking quotes out of context is brilliant. Do you work for the tabloids?I don't see them taken out of context. Please prove him wrong instead of asking retarded questions. Link to post Share on other sites
mrdannyg 274 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Edit: Lol. Just because I said the 2 ref system is better then the 1 ref system doesn't mean my initial statement that the problem lies within the 2 ref system is not correct. Taking quotes out of context is brilliant. Do you work for the tabloids?This is true. However, when you say something is a problem, usually it implies an alternative is better, or you suggest a better alternative.If you're suggesting improvements, I haven't seen any. And if not, you're just whining for the sake of it, which is no big deal I guess, but let us know. Link to post Share on other sites
Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 22, 2006 Author Share Posted November 22, 2006 Okay, I'm wrong. No matter what I said before I was wrong. How dare I expect the officiating to be decent game in and game out. Who cares if a ref makes brutal calls or non calls that could change the outxome of the game. After all, they are human and mediocrity is expected. Excepting mediocrity infact seems to be out of line. I should expect bad officiating unless I can some how come up with that robot you guys mentioned. How dare I ever complain because after all these guys are human and we infact should expect brutal mistakes. I'll never mention it again because to expect half decent officiating would just be stupid whining on my part and I should just accept whatever the NHL wants to give me.Oh and I have reffed and I can tell you that although I might miss calls I'm consistent with my calls which is all I asked for in the first place. Link to post Share on other sites
serge 904 Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 A game that relies on human observance , experience, and split second determinations of fault is never going to be 100% perfect. It just isn't. The only way to be close to 100% would be to to have a ref watching a bank of video monitors with the ability to stop the game and assess penalties based on what he sees. I would imagine eventually (and I don't mean soon) that's the course of action the league will take, and just have linesmen on the ice to break up fights, drop the puck, and watch for icing, and offsides. The refs do a fantastic job, but nobody can get it 100% right all the time. At least your team didn't lose a Stanley Cup on a horrible no-call. Leafs fans can argue that we lost a Stanley Cup because of Kerry Fraser Link to post Share on other sites
gruven 530 Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 I think the Refs need fans who understand refereeing...... LOL Link to post Share on other sites
Fubar The Sperm 1 Posted November 22, 2006 Author Share Posted November 22, 2006 I think the Refs need fans who understand refereeing...... LOLQFT Link to post Share on other sites
nell789 0 Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 QFTwow, nice self-ownage. Link to post Share on other sites
gruven 530 Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 QFT Wow... Ummm..... I'm speechless...... Link to post Share on other sites
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