13 replies to this topic

[akishore]

PokerStars 0.02/0.04 Omaha/8 (9 handed) converterPreflop: Hero is UTG with [2 :heart: ], [7 :club: ], [J :diamond: ], [A :diamond: ]. Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, BB calls, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls, CO calls, Button calls.was this call too loose? i wasn't a big fan of having the 7 in there, but i was given advice to play any A2 if the ace was suited, as it was in this hand. i normally would fold this hand because of the 7 and lack of counterfeit protection. is that too tight?Flop: (14 SB) [3 :diamond: ], [Q :diamond: ], [4 :spade: ] (7 players)SB bets, UTG+1 calls, CO calls, SB calls, BB calls.nut low draw, nut flush draw, wheel draw and backdoor broadway draw on the flop. since i'm almost to the immediate left of the bettor, should i be smooth-calling? i thought about that thread about protecting your hand with a strong draw, so i figured a raise was good. plus, i figured i would get a lot of calls anyway since the board had two lows and was suited... plus, this is O8... how many fish actually lay down top pair? i was excited to see the bettor three-bet it, and i put him either on another A2 (in which case i was freerolling him) or some QQ. at the worst case, he had A2QQ, which left me behind, but this was too good a draw in a five-way pot to not cap (even if i'm quartered, i show a profit).Turn: (17 BB) [8 :club: ] (5 players)SB bets, UTG+1 calls, CO calls, SB calls, BB calls.hit my nut low on the turn. i'm still not too excited about my lack of counterfeit protection, but i felt that this was still a capping hand in a five-way pot, especially if i'm in danger of getting quartered by QQA2 or such. i was hoping i was still freerolling the bettor with A2 and the nut flush draw. i gave myself 7 outs for the nut flush (without the board pairing against QQ) and an extra 3 outs for the wheel (again to beat QQ), so with 10 outs (should i have counted the wheel outs as partial outs since A267 would three-quarter me sometimes?) and a made nut low (though vulnerable), i felt that i still had the equity edge to be capping this hand (even if i hit neither the flush or my wheel, my low was still probably good enough to show a profit if i was quartered). was i wrong?River: (37 BB) [7 :diamond: ] (5 players)SB bets, UTG+1 calls, SB calls.great card. nut high that can't be quartered, and nut low. i'm really surprised i'm still getting bet and raised into, but i'm not complaining.Final Pot: 50 BBi'll post what the other key hands were later. just wondering if i played the hand right, especially pre-flop and on the turn. should i have taken into account the possibility of being against not only QQ but also 76/65/64/63/62 (in which case a non-diamond 5 would not leave me with the best high)? did i have the equity edge on every street to be betting and raising like that?thanks,aseem

[KDawgCometh]

well the key to the PF call is was the table loose. If it was then it is a marginally profitable call. I like how you played the flop as you want to clean up any other low draws so that if a 2 falls you at least have the emergency low. Turn, it looks like you low is gonna get quartered, but I like your pumping the pot as your high flush draw can at least take that end of it. River, well is there any other way you could play this as there isn't any boat possibilities so more than likely I think your taking 3/4 of the pot.

[akishore]

well, i had the nut high and low, so i three-quartered or scooped the pot of course, so i'm not concerned about my river play. i'm wondering if my logic through the hand was right. did i read the key hands correctly? did i give myself too many outs? did i have the equity to be capping on the flop and turn?and yeah, the table was extremely loose. almost any low limit omaha8 table is extremely loose. i have yet to find one where less than 6 people see the flop on average.as for the flop play, i don't think the raise was to clean up any outs. if a 2 or ace landed, there was no way my emergency low would hold up. a 7 low will rarely win half the pot in a five-way hand, so i wasn't really raising to clean up outs.however, i like your logic, because i DO clean up my wheel outs (i.e. if i can make a 76/65/64/63/62 fold, it helps me out immensely) and maybe even some backdoor broadway outs (e.g. making another AJ fold, or maybe making KK/TT fold so that a card that gives me a straight draw on the turn doesn't give them a boat draw).mainly though, i raised for value since i thought i had equity. but was i right considering i was most likely against A2 (with a possible 6-straight draw) and/or QQ? was i right to raise if the bettor held something like A256 (a 16-out wraparound 6-straight draw with an insured nut low)? how about if he had A2QQ? how about QQ45 for the nut straight and top boat draw?i think this hand looks easy and overly tempting to cap on every street, but i'm wondering if i was wrong in doing that.thanks,aseem

[Absolute]

First point.I have played thousands and thousands of O8 limit hands and I will confidently say..You should be calling A2xx with a suited ace to one raise every time. KDawg's comment about "marginal profit" is a bit understated I think. O8 is a game about scooping, and if you aren't playing A2xx with the ace suited, you should find a different game.Calling three-cold with this hand however, would be an entirely differently argument, and the mood of the table and the raisers would become more of a factor.The flop is a wonderful (and extreme) example of why you play this hand PF. (Honestly, I would raise this hand in a micro O8 limit game PF)Capping here is absolutely correct. Anything else would be chimp-ish.Capping the turn is correct also.By the way, quartering in a 5 way pot isn't a *bad* thing. I am sure you are aware of this though. Even if you quarter and miss your high, you are in the +. That being said, why don't you cap here with an already profitable hand that is probably the exclusive low, as well as outs to the nuts (the flush or the wheel)Yay for the river.You win.This is why micro limit O8 is easy.Honestly, I don't see much room for debate on how you played this. You maximized your value with a great scooping hand and hit it. One of these pots is why you fold for hours in this game.

[KDawgCometh]

I'd like to say that O 8 isn't really my game. I'm competant in it and can hang, but I will never claim to be any authority on it. PLO and Stud on the other hand. Stud is probably my best game, so any time you have a stud question I'll always answer

[akishore]

thanks for the replies. here are the results:Hero has 2 7 J A (Low: 7, 4, 3, 2, A | High: flush, ace high). UTG+1 has 7 Q 8 8 (High: three of a kind, eights). SB has 6 A 2 5 (Low: 7, 4, 3, 2, A | High: flush, queen high). Outcome: Hero wins 37.50 BB. SB wins 12.50 BB.the bettor was the SB, and he was jamming it with the nut low and a solid nut high draw (for a 6-high or 7-high straight) as well as a weak flush draw. since i had more outs against just the straight, i was on a nice little freeroll, but i misread the high part of his hand. however, since he had three diamonds in his hand, i was actually on a weak draw that i didn't know, so he might have been freerolling me.end result: i got a little lucky in three-quartering the pot, but i think my play was nevertheless correct.the other player had only top pair on the flop then middle set on the turn. man, i love fish.aseem

[Absolute]

see, aseem, whatd i tell you?i really should only plau O8 from now on

[KDawgCometh]

Absolute said:

see, aseem, whatd i tell you?i really should only plau O8 from now on

yeah, cause your too weak tight for holdem

[Absolute]

probably truealthough holdem for advanced players might unlearn me a little bit.

[KDawgCometh]

you know I just funning you today, short bus

[Absolute]

do we have to go through this again?i told you it was regular sized.

[KDawgCometh]

Absolute said:

do we have to go through this again?i told you it was regular sized.

that's what your mom told you to make you feel better. ITs always a mother's job to to make her son feel better when he doesn't add up to the norms :-)

[TheSheriff]

hmmm

[akishore]

TheSheriff said:

hmmm

haha, thanks for the insightful reply. aseem