Bubble Play

[mkeller3086 0]

Party $10 sng4 handedCO (1100)Button (4,400)Hero (3,500)BB (11,000)Blinds 200/400Hero dealt QcQs in SBCO folds, Button folds, Hero pushesCommon bubble scenario. If I just wait I can probably sneak into 3rd. But I think my hand is too strong to not put my chips in in this spot. If I want to make the money and feel good about myself I probably raise this and fold to an all in. But if I'm playing to make the most money in the long term its worth the push, right?

[....Ian.... 0]

edit, push or r 1200 and push ANY flop

[Actuary 3]

hard for me not to have poster-lost bias here..but I will say from experience... Read on BB ?I'm having trouble with the 600 really mattering to us.With CO at 1100 and in the blinds next.I could limp or min raise this, and play a flop.I want value for my risk..not just 600.I could easily fold to a substantial BB re-raise preflop. (unless he is lagging up)

[mkeller3086 0]

hard for me not to have poster-lost bias here..but I will say from experience... Read on BB ?

lol tough to post without making it seem that way....i don't ever have any reads, maybe its my weakness.i play 8 at a time now....i find that getting so many more in is more profitable than having a read which that might be helpful once or twice.sng play seems so mechanical and such a preflop game that i feel like i can get away with playing that many without losing too much because once the blinds are up i can evaluate the situation, either fold or put all my chips in, click to another table, rinse, repeat

[ontheriver 0]

Party $10 sng4 handedCO (1100)Button (4,400)Hero (3,500)BB (11,000)Blinds 200/400Hero dealt QcQs in SBCO folds, Button folds, Hero pushesCommon bubble scenario. If I just wait I can probably sneak into 3rd. But I think my hand is too strong to not put my chips in in this spot. If I want to make the money and feel good about myself I probably raise this and fold to an all in. But if I'm playing to make the most money in the long term its worth the push, right?

How exactly are you making money by raising then folding on an all in? You're never going to get out of the bottom unless you're willing to lose your chips. If pocket queens dont make you feel good about going all in, what the hell will? You'll be waiting forever for pocket K's or A's. That's what the big stacks are going to do is just keeping putting you all in.

[mkeller3086 0]

How exactly are you making money by raising then folding on an all in? You're never going to get out of the bottom unless you're willing to lose your chips. If pocket queens dont make you feel good about going all in, what the hell will? You'll be waiting forever for pocket K's or A's. That's what the big stacks are going to do is just keeping putting you all in.

if i want to be more certain to cash i coudl fold to the all in raise. if i wanna make more money in the long run maybe a push is best.this situation is a little different than just saying "Holy ****ing ****!!! I have QQ!! All in! All in!

[ontheriver 0]

if i want to be more certain to cash i coudl fold to the all in raise. if i wanna make more money in the long run maybe a push is best.this situation is a little different than just saying "Holy ****ing ****!!! I have QQ!! All in! All in!

Man, a $10 sit and go. What do you get $20 for third place. Are you really worried about $10?? Its not like you're about get lose making the money and it will cost you hundreds of dollars. No one said to freak out that you have QQ. But you're questioning and all in move when there only 2 hands that beat you 4 handed!! You'll never make any real money waiting for pocket K's or A's.. lol Let us know how you make out?! lol

[mikeysong 0]

I don't know how you could fold this to an all-in.

[mkeller3086 0]

Man, a $10 sit and go. What do you get $20 for third place. Are you really worried about $10?? Its not like you're about get lose making the money and it will cost you hundreds of dollars. No one said to freak out that you have QQ. But you're questioning and all in move when there only 2 hands that beat you 4 handed!! You'll never make any real money waiting for pocket K's or A's.. lol Let us know how you make out?! lol

ur a ****ing idiot its not about $10...just like you said it doesn't really matterits about making plays that have the most expectation over the long run whether you are playing for a few dollars or thousands of dollars.

[Actuary 3]

I don't know how you could fold this to an all-in.

because the Bubbles are significant in SnG's.I could fold, depending on BB

[mkeller3086 0]

because the Bubbles are significant in SnG's.I could fold, depending on BB

well BB is a donkey....didn't know that until after he made the call tho :)he had 44.

[Actuary 3]

well BB is a donkey....didn't know that until after he made the call tho :)he had 44.

well, if you know he's that bad, then yep..push.But, I fail to se where the risk to get 600 is worth it.Since BB's range to call would be pretty tight, normally.Unless you have pushed a bit already and can mask the hand that way..then..pushing is good, too.I may be too passive when it's near bubble and i'm a middle stackEdit: I don't think i'm making much sense..maybe in morning it will

[XXEddie 0]

ur a ****ing idiot its not about $10...just like you said it doesn't really matterits about making plays that have the most expectation over the long run whether you are playing for a few dollars or thousands of dollars.

youre the one considering folding QQ in the SB 4 handed with an M or less than 6 just so you can win $9Youre the people I laugh at when I have huge chip leads on the bubble

[reedmcneal 0]

Preflop you CANNOT fold. It just isn't the right play. Ever.Now I agree with actuary that a min-raise or just a call might be a good move here, just to try and extract more money. This is image dependant though. If you've been pushing a lot (which I doubt based on your thoughts) I think a push could be correct. I would probably even slow play post flop with all unders.

[Actuary 3]

when I compare this to a post Smash had wher the big stack was SB and we were 2nd stack in BB... with QQ...I argued to call the push. Our lead over the other 2 was not enough to pass up the edge.Here, CO is about to be in BB with just 1100.It would suck to miss the money.I'm sure I don't fold in real life.Poster bias, meh.

[mkeller3086 0]

youre the one considering folding QQ in the SB 4 handed with an M or less than 6 just so you can win $9Youre the people I laugh at when I have huge chip leads on the bubble

i play incredibly aggressively on the bubble because everyone has a fear of busting in fourth. If I don't have that fear its a great opportunity to accumulate chips. There is usually 600-900 in the pot preflop that nobody wants to fight for.I pushed, so don't laugh at me. I'm just never satisfied with my play to I try to learn more. So I post this hand to see if folding would ever be a consideration.

[fckthis 0]

I think I push as well. But its because I dont play with an SNG strat, more of a "poker" strat.

[mkeller3086 0]

I think I push as well. But its because I dont play with an SNG strat, more of a "poker" strat.

do you see why you could consider not open pushing here though?

[mjd 0]

Well, if you're the aggressive type on the bubble, I think the correct option is to make the same sized raise you would on any of your open-raises. Given your M, that's probably a push at this stage.Plus a push negates your positional disadvantage here.

[mkeller3086 0]

Well, if you're the aggressive type on the bubble, I think the correct option is to make the same sized raise you would on any of your open-raises. Given your M, that's probably a push at this stage.Plus a push negates your positional disadvantage here.

i think once the blinds are 200/400 i rarely make a "standard raise"pushing all in seems to be the best way to go because effective Ms are usually in the 2-6 range since its a short handed table.

[ontheriver 0]

ur a ****ing idiot its not about $10...just like you said it doesn't really matterits about making plays that have the most expectation over the long run whether you are playing for a few dollars or thousands of dollars.

Its about making plays!? You're clearly at risk of being the bubble cause of lousy plays like this! I never said go all in as soon as you're able to. You stated you'd fold QQ if someone put you all in pre flop. Clearly showing the FISH you truly are if you even consider not calling. If its not about the money, then why do you even care whether or not you get past the bubble? Clearly you want to maximize your gain and it seems you can't get any better then doubling up which is what pocket QQ would clearly allow you to do! UNBELIEVABLE! Don't hit the glass!!

[Actuary 3]

Don't hit the glass!!

hi, I'm the dumby who could fold to a push preflop.Or at least, last night I posted as such. I'm all about cashing and then worrying about 1st.I'm a bit on fence here.I'd probably min raise and push a non A/K flopIf pushed preflop I could fold.....ahhh not sure..nah..I'd call..boy that woudl suck to get 4th here

[mjd 0]

I'm all about cashing and then worrying about 1st.

I see this all the time in 30+3 SnGs. And when I do, I just sit there and press the 'win' (raise) button.Personally, I play to gets heads-up and consider 3rd a consolation prize.-M

[mkeller3086 0]

I see this all the time in 30+3 SnGs. And when I do, I just sit there and press the 'win' (raise) button.Personally, I play to gets heads-up and consider 3rd a consolation prize.-M

I agree. I often attack weak tight players on the bubble and win pot after pot without contest. Sometimes I have a disappointing bubble finish, so be it. In the past two weeks I have....1st- 152nd- 143rd- 11I find that pushing harder on the bubble has made me cash fewer times but I think my overall expectation is higher because I get 1st and 2nd more often.

[delasoul 0]

i think once the blinds are 200/400 i rarely make a "standard raise"pushing all in seems to be the best way to go because effective Ms are usually in the 2-6 range since its a short handed table.

I push...You play to win the tournament you don't play to make the money. It will cost you in the long run if you are concerned with limping into the money.