17 replies to this topic

[MarionSauce]

For some of you crazy good b*tches, (like SMASH obviously) please enlighten a newcomer like me on how and when to appropriately slowplay. Relevant information(Table of 10, 3 people in each pot, .25/.50 blinds, New Snoop Dogg in the background) Eg. 8c8d in the hole, Flop: Qh-Jh-8s, I would seriously raise a lot to make a b*tch pay like she wait, to draw for the flush or straightBut a more complex example:Eg. K9 in the holeFlop: K-10-9Turn: 9Would you just CALL if your opponents came out firing about 4xBB, or raise like a motherfugga. Some dude tried to slowplay this hand against me, but I just caught a higher full house on the river and busted his ass out.One time ChuckSty was watching me play and I had AA, but I didn't raise enough preflop, only like 3xBB, slowplayed the whole way with two pair, and some dude had 66 and caught his set and I couldn't drop my aces like it's hot. But obviously sometimes if you raise TOO much preflop no one will call, especially if everyone folded to you and you are on the button. So thus the question of interest is, (obviously conditionally on each hand), if it is wise to slowplay to win more money ultimately at the end of a hand but to risk the change of nuts, pending mathematical statistics.

[wrto4556]

1) You must have a very strong hand. (obviously)2) The free card or cheap card you are allowing other payers to get must have good posibilites of making them a second-best hand.3) That same free card must have little chance of making someone a better hand han yours or even giving that person a draw to a better hand than yours on the next round with sufficient odds to justify a call.4) You must be sure you will drive other players out by showing aggression, but you have a good chance of wining a big pot if you don't.5) The pot must not yet be very large.So, if you flop 8 9 J with 8 8 You should not slowplay according to rule 3.Or if you flop K 8 3 with K K you should only slowplay if the pot is small(rule 5).Or if you flop A 3 T With A T you should not slowplay accordingto rule 1, 2, 3, and 4...maybe 5, too.Basically, you just slowplay the nuts.

[Vade]

I think if there's any sort of straight or flush draw out there, you shouldn't slowplay.Especially never slowplay something like Top pair, or bottom set.

[akishore]

wrto4556 said:

1) You must have a very strong hand. (obviously)2) The free card or cheap card you are allowing other payers to get must have good posibilites of making them a second-best hand.3) That same free card must have little chance of making someone a better hand han yours or even giving that person a draw to a better hand than yours on the next round with sufficient odds to justify a call.4) You  must be sure you will drive other players out by showing aggression, but you have a good chance of wining a big pot if you don't.5) The pot must not yet be very large.So, if you flop 8 9 J  with 8 8  You should not slowplay according to rule 3.Or if you flop K 8 3  with K K  you should only slowplay if the pot is small(rule 5).Or if you flop A 3 T  With A T  you should not slowplay accordingto rule 1, 2, 3, and 4...maybe 5, too.Basically, you just slowplay the nuts.

to the OP, read this 5 times in a row. it's absolutely correct.aseem

[UglyJimStudly]

MarionSauce said:

Relevant information(Table of 10, 3 people in each pot, .25/.50 blinds, New Snoop Dogg in the background)

In addition to the other good advice you've received: never slowplay at microlimits, there's tons of bad players who will happily call two or three bets to try and hit a 3-outer on the river, so make sure they pay for the privilege. Slowplaying is only effective against good players, and if you happen to be stuck at a microlimit table full of good players, just change tables. No need to work hard for a $6 pot, go find the fish.

[Comatose_Soul]

wrto4556 said:

1) You must have a very strong hand. (obviously)2) The free card or cheap card you are allowing other payers to get must have good posibilites of making them a second-best hand.3) That same free card must have little chance of making someone a better hand han yours or even giving that person a draw to a better hand than yours on the next round with sufficient odds to justify a call.4) You  must be sure you will drive other players out by showing aggression, but you have a good chance of wining a big pot if you don't.5) The pot must not yet be very large.So, if you flop 8 9 J  with 8 8  You should not slowplay according to rule 3.Or if you flop K 8 3  with K K  you should only slowplay if the pot is small(rule 5).Or if you flop A 3 T  With A T  you should not slowplay accordingto rule 1, 2, 3, and 4...maybe 5, too.Basically, you just slowplay the nuts.

100% Agree -- I'll sometimes simplify it to a single question post-flop: Will anything other than a 2 outer beat my hand?Pre-flop is another monster all together, and I personally would recommend against it online. If you do decide to do it, you'll have to be extremely disciplined and avoid chasing when you get a bad flop.

[wrto4556]

#4 is funny. In micro limits, aggression does not scare anyone out of the pot. So, basically, according to rule 4, you should never slowplay in micr0-limits.

[JimmyWellington]

I would add another thing to wrto's excellent post."You shouldn't slowplay against someone that will call a good size bet". What I mean by that is say you have a great hand (going back to the other rules). If your opponent is really loose and will call a pot size bet to an inside straight draw, you'll make more money by betting than checking. If they miss their hand on the turn or river, they'll likely fold to a bet. If you had checked before, you would make no extra money. If you had bet before, then you would get the money when they call, and then they would have extra incentive to call the bet (more of their money in the pot).

[Vade]

JimmyWellington said:

I would add another thing to wrto's excellent post."You shouldn't slowplay against someone that will call a good size bet".  What I mean by that is say you have a great hand (going back to the other rules).  If your opponent is really loose and will call a pot size bet to an inside straight draw, you'll make more money by betting than checking.  If they miss their hand on the turn or river, they'll likely fold to a bet.  If you had checked before, you would make no extra money.  If you had bet before, then you would get the money when they call, and then they would have extra incentive to call the bet (more of their money in the pot).

Very true. Unless you have an absolute monster, you should bet all the way.Extracting maximum money is nice, but not if you give someone a 1 out draw to the best hand.Say I have AA and my opponent has 99Ridiculously the flop comes A-9-2I'm betting this. I don't want the 4% chance that he'll pick up that last card, when I could have charged him for it. Granted, he could catch it after all the chips are in, but them's the breaks.

[Emptyeye]

wrto4556 said:

#4 is funny. In micro limits, aggression does not scare anyone out of the pot. So, basically, according to rule 4, you should never slowplay in micr0-limits.

Yeah, makes sense to me.

[shamhawks]

was playing on this table a little bit ago...granted the guy who won this should not have stayed in, but that is the risk when you slow play post flop.#Game No : 1736037711 ***** Hand History for Game 1736037711 *****$25 NL Hold'em - Monday, March 14, 18:43:01 EDT 2005Table Table 36872 (Real Money)Seat 2 is the buttonTotal number of players : 9 Seat 1: Soccer13Dad ( $18.05 )Seat 3: SledDawgs ( $39.28 )Seat 4: Turkatron ( $32.3 )Seat 5: tonyswc ( $34.25 )Seat 7: sancarloskid ( $29.6 )Seat 8: chak88 ( $22.15 )Seat 9: garryp ( $31.52 )Seat 2: MyHuskies ( $26 )Seat 10: soreass ( $26.05 )SledDawgs posts small blind [$0.1].Turkatron posts big blind [$0.25].** Dealing down cards **Dealt to MyHuskies [ 8c Qh ]tonyswc calls [$0.25].sancarloskid calls [$0.25].chak88 calls [$0.25].garryp calls [$0.25].soreass calls [$0.25].Soccer13Dad folds.MyHuskies folds.SledDawgs raises [$1.9].Turkatron folds.tonyswc calls [$1.75].sancarloskid folds.chak88 folds.garryp folds.soreass calls [$1.75].** Dealing Flop ** [ Kc, Ah, 7s ]SledDawgs checks.tonyswc checks.soreass bets [$3].SledDawgs calls [$3].tonyswc calls [$3].** Dealing Turn ** [ 9s ]SledDawgs checks.tonyswc bets [$3].soreass calls [$3].SledDawgs calls [$3].** Dealing River ** [ Td ]SledDawgs checks.tonyswc bets [$10].soreass folds.SledDawgs raises [$20].racereeves has joined the table.tonyswc is all-In [$16.25]sancarloskid: AKSledDawgs calls [$6.25].SledDawgs shows [ Kh, Ks ] three of a kind, kings.tonyswc shows [ Jd, Qd ] a straight, ten to ace.tonyswc wins $74.5 from the main pot with a straight, ten to ace.Game #1736048986 starts.to me, this seemed very clear he was setting a trap and got caught in it... come on raise 8xbb pre-flop ace and king come on the flop and you check...oh my you must just have jacks or q's..

[Absolute]

MarionSauce?hmm what does that go good with?is that you in the picture?i need poker lessons.

[MarionSauce]

Yeah that's me with a blonde wig, I have my natural black hair now though. I used to dye it and peroxide it like I was white trash and I'M clearly the one that needs poker lessons

[JaysonWeber]

Well being active on this site is lessons enough Just need to have thick-skin you get the people who are a lot braver on forums than they are in real life.. and a bit more rude as well ;)I would have added something to this, but WRTO's post is good. He's right on with slowplaying.

[MarionSauce]

JaysonWeber said:

Well being active on this site is lessons enough Just need to have thick-skin you get the people who are a lot braver on forums than they are in real life.. and a bit more rude as well ;)I would have added something to this, but WRTO's post is good. He's right on with slowplaying.

Yeah I have absorbed WRTO's teachings and am now mastering it. Thanks dude. And hopefully they won't pull a "Everyone Vs. Smash" against me, I'm just a fragile, little girl.

[Absolute]

actually everything wrto said is wrongthere, see?i DO need lessons.help me marion?

[wrto4556]

JaysonWeber said:

I would have added something to this, but WRTO's post is good. He's right on with slowplaying.

I'm right on with everything.

[Absolute]

I would have added something to that post, but wrto is right on with everything.