26 replies to this topic

[Jordan]

I have $650 or so, big stack has me well covered.

Read on bigstack is that he is running good and playing quite aggressive. However, I've seen some really weird hands from him.

A few examples. He raises preflop, flop is HU and he is OOP, he checks the flop and opponent checks, turn he bets the pot, opponent moves in and he insta folds. He did this a few times, including once when he was in position and checked the flop, on the turn he bet when checked to for the pot and was c/r all in for 18 more which he folded to. I laughed at that one.

The rest of the time he leads and bets pots. i had KQs on btn once and he raised utg to 21. I called. Flop K87 with 2 clubs (i have ) and he bets $51 (which was pot) I raise to $200 and he pushes. I have to call 450 more all in and fold. He later claims to of had a set...ok...to the hand.

I am in BB ($630-650 stack) w AKo, he raises at BTN to $21, I re-raise to $63, he calls.

FLOP K 9 6r

Hero checks, villian bets $85, hero raises to $250, villian calls.

TURN Q

Hero ...


--

- Jordan

[Dratj]

why not bet out the flop for about 85? If villian smooth calls, you bet out 200 on the turn and if villian pushes you can safely fold, or villian may just fold right there. It would cost you about the same as the way you played it but you get more info.
I'd be scared that villian flopped a set by smooth calling your check raise on the turn. It's tough to play TPTK OOP so that's why I like to lead at the pots.

[nomad_monad]

tough situation.

i don't see a whole lot that you're ahead of here that calls your flop check-raise. maybe KJ or JJ if he's loose or thinks he can take the pot away from you in position. plus, any turn lead commits you, so you should push if you're going to bet, but the only hand that calls you here one that beats you. so i think the initial action here is a check. i don't think you need to really worry about giving a free card if the villain is behind since based on your description of him, he's likely to take a shot at you here if you check.

now, whether or not that turns into a check-push/check-call (if he pushes you in) or a check-fold, i dunno. i think it depends on just how aggressive villain is and how likely it is for him to have flat called your c/r with something marginal just in the hopes of taking the pot away from you on the turn.

but i play far lower stakes than you and am usually reading your advice, so take it for what it's worth.

[Naismith]

I think you're in a rough spot here unless you've picked up a read on him while watching as the turn came down. It sounds like he would've pushed with a made hand from your earlier hands.

I would like to bet out here and fold to a big all in, but any bet commits you to this pot. I guess you just have to decide whether he has KQ or not. If you're willing to play it for your entire stack, I say bet half the pot and give him a chance to come over the top since you're going to get it all in there anyway.

If you picked up a tell of strength after the turn came down, check/fold. You have to be extremely confident in that, though.

[Jordan]

EDIT - WARNING RESULTS ARE POSTED IN THIS RESPONSE, IGNORE IF YOU DONT WANT TO READ BEFORE POSTING (results in white, bout mid way)

All good responses. And I do usually lead here Dratj (although for more than just $85) I'd bet around $115 to pot.

This was just one of those times where in my head a hit a really good flop and was about 80% sure I'd be getting in a check/raise well ahead.

When he called, I don't know...in the speed of the hand I'll admit I personally got caught up and think I acted to fast on the turn. Cobalt was actually playing at the table as well, but he was multi-tabling so his read on duder may have been different i dunno...

all i know is this hand was from 2 days ago now and is still bugging me.

it was a tough session to say the least, and this was one of the later hands for me so I'm not sure if my judgement was off or not. I had dodged a few bullets already (although I was stuck $800 or so at this point), I felt I was playing optimally.

I'm not sure though on this hand If I did or not and don't want to be deciding that based on results.

I think with how I bloated this pot on the flop the only way I get off the hand is what naismith said...i have a strong read that i'm behind and can check/fold the turn. If I bet anything I'm committing myself, so the only way is to just check and fold.

I did indeed decide to push the turn (about $330) without giving much extended thought to it (except I have TPTK which is so incredibly amateur I dont need to go on much more about that).

Results:
he showed me 999 and I was drawing dead.


This is the only hand from the session that really bugs me. I felt I played optimally the entire time, but this hand is just in the back of my head, like I need to get it out there in the open.

I'm not sure how else this goes...I could have lead for say $115 - $130 on the flop which would be my standard bet here with TPTK (based on PF action and pot size), and then if raised by him I "can" fold for what essentially would be my entire stack ($425 - 50 more) and this is very similar to the KQ hand. However with my check/raise...i just feel like I committed myself to this hand (sparing an amazing check/fold on the turn).

Although to be honest, I don't think a check/fold here on the turn would be that amazing of a play. The more I look at this hand the more I think I screwed it up.

You tell me...cause I really can't say if I'm feeling this way based on I got showed a set, or the fact that I bloated a pot OOP and basically screwed myself.

- Jordan

[fckthis]

You reraised AK preflop OOP? Am I the only one who hates this play?

[Jordan]

You reraised AK preflop OOP? Am I the only one who hates this play?

lol.

yes. just calling a standard raise from a very agg player who is raising your blind is the only thing you can even think of with AK OOP. never raise. your hand is never better than his raising standards from the button.

gl

- Jordan

[fckthis]

lol.

yes. just calling a standard raise from a very agg player who is raising your blind is the only thing you can even think of with AK OOP. never raise. your hand is never better than his raising standards from the button.

gl

- Jordan

Meh, you're probably right, but I hate raising anything but a made hand from OOP.

[Jordan]

Meh, you're probably right, but I hate raising anything but a made hand from OOP.

meh. i'm not advocating this a lot, but i'll re-raise with much more than just AK outta the blinds from a guy I think who is "stealing" (yes stealing in a cash game) from one of the later positions playing 6 max.

I guess it's my personal philosophy to keep applying pressure to opponents...it is a more fluctuating style though at times..but it has worked for me for a while now.

i do know what you mean with just calling with AK, but IMO you are going to allow yourself to get outplayed a lot but aggressive players who play position with rags much better than you play AK OOP HU Unimproved postflop and are bet into by your LP raiser.

- Jordan

[CobaltBlue]

You reraised AK preflop OOP? Am I the only one who hates this play?

You're re-raising to try to take the pot pre-flop because you have a good hand and don't want to have to play the hand out of position. This is especially true against an opponent with low open-raising requirements in late position at a short-handed table. If you get called...so be it. You should generally be more inclined to flat call with AK in position...though it's good to raise it sometimes too.

[Scott3705]

At first reading, I thought, villian will be willing to look you up with a PP or weak king in a 6 max game since your play here appears to be a blatant, "I'm going to outplay you" sort of move. Going over your prior hands a little more, it looks like he tries to stay out of trouble and not play big pots w/o big hands. (Case or no?). With no draw on the board, you are running really bad against kq k9 k6 (not so much) and drawing dead against 99 and 66. But then again, C/F is just so weak here. We can't seriously C/F w/ TPTK here on the turn in a 6 max game, and the pot seems to gotten out of control because it was reraised preflop. So there's no way to really control the pot here. This also seems to be my answer for everything, but I'd probably be willing to get 'em all in here since I'm fairly sure villian will do it for me. I'd almost be inclined to go for another C/R. Maybe he'll check. But if he bets, we'll have the best hand more times getting them all in this way then if we just push the turn.

[DonkSlayer]

I don't hate that you got your money in with TPTK against an aggro player in this situation.

I do lead on this flop though, and maybe it's a reraise/fold if he does raise you. You may possibly, possibly gotten away from this hand if you had led, but you had no chance when you went for the checkraise.

Maybe a little too confident in your reads? I find myself wanting to get my money in during too marginal situations when I think I have a great read on the guy, even though having a great read doesn't equal always having the best hand.

[NoSup4U]

You should generally be more inclined to flat call with AK in position...though it's good to raise it sometimes too.

I disagree with this as a general rule. I'm more inclined to let my better position dictate when I apply more pressure preflop. I also find that more than a few blind stealer types will call your reraise pf with most hands. This is course has its good and bad, but for both you're out of position. I tend to not even raise with a big ace from the blinds if the pot already has sufficiently few players in it.

Mark

[Jordan]

I disagree with this as a general rule. I'm more inclined to let my better position dictate when I apply more pressure preflop. I also find that more than a few blind stealer types will call your reraise pf with most hands. This is course has its good and bad, but for both you're out of position. I tend to not even raise with a big ace from the blinds if the pot already has sufficiently few players in it.

Mark

hehe...if the tables right i'm raising probably way too many hands outta the blinds. ;/

my recent sessions at $600 nl have realized how much more aggressive i can be at this limit...although not at every table..but it is fun...except when you run bad

or are just a donk..which i am.

thx for some of the replies guys...i dunno. i sholdn't be looking to lead so i can fold with TPTK as my reasoning, and I think most of the time my c/r on this flop takes it down against his holding...this was just one of those sessions i guess where nothing went my way and this hand kinda been looming over me like "did i play it too aggressive"...

anyways, i'm kinda glad to see i'm not the only person who can't get off this hand on the turn (atleast not this time), although I still think I acted out of haste on the turn...meh.

- Jordan

[krup24]

I am an uber donk

- Jordan

FYP

[Jordan]

i am uber tired. been up all night.

get this. i try and stay up all night and read a book and write a paper. due at 8.30 am. come along 7am and im just starting my papare and havn't finished the book.

im so tired i can[t put togetehr coherent sentenecs

im like f me. duder takes off one letter grade each calss day it's late..so that means if i write a perfect paper i get a B, and i doubt i'll crack a C with the trash im bout to write. so i trash it and go to class...DEAD TIRED cuz if i miss one more class my OVERALL Grade drops a letter grade.

so first 1.5 hours of class i'm falling alseep and trpying to write notes...which isn't working...i dont remmeber this, but i was taking notes somehow in between consciousness and sleeping..and what i wrote makes no sesnse at all. but it's awesome and i hate my life now and i'm gonna sleep.

WHOS THE DONK NOW

- Jordan

[krup24]

i am uber tired. been up all night.

get this. i try and stay up all night and read a book and write a paper. due at 8.30 am. come along 7am and im just starting my papare and havn't finished the book.

im so tired i can[t put togetehr coherent sentenecs

im like f me. duder takes off one letter grade each calss day it's late..so that means if i write a perfect paper i get a B, and i doubt i'll crack a C with the trash im bout to write. so i trash it and go to class...DEAD TIRED cuz if i miss one more class my OVERALL Grade drops a letter grade.

so first 1.5 hours of class i'm falling alseep and trpying to write notes...which isn't working...i dont remmeber this, but i was taking notes somehow in between consciousness and sleeping..and what i wrote makes no sesnse at all. but it's awesome and i hate my life now and i'm gonna sleep.

WHOS THE DONK NOW

- Jordan

Is this college?

[Dratj]

i am uber tired. been up all night.

get this. i try and stay up all night and read a book and write a paper. due at 8.30 am. come along 7am and im just starting my papare and havn't finished the book.

im so tired i can[t put togetehr coherent sentenecs

im like f me. duder takes off one letter grade each calss day it's late..so that means if i write a perfect paper i get a B, and i doubt i'll crack a C with the trash im bout to write. so i trash it and go to class...DEAD TIRED cuz if i miss one more class my OVERALL Grade drops a letter grade.

so first 1.5 hours of class i'm falling alseep and trpying to write notes...which isn't working...i dont remmeber this, but i was taking notes somehow in between consciousness and sleeping..and what i wrote makes no sesnse at all. but it's awesome and i hate my life now and i'm gonna sleep.

WHOS THE DONK NOW

- Jordan

Focus on school now. You will regret it later. There is always time to play poker later. So, I guess I was right to fear the set. It's just a feeling when someone smooth calls your raise. It's usually a monster of a hand. You were probably just too tired. Get some sleep.

[Jordan]

Is this college?

lol, somehow yes.

--

dratj i am trying to focus on school for these last few weeks for sure...i've actually had a somewhat of a breakthru this last week or so and actually think I know what i may lke to do now post school, which is really encouraging to me cause I've been struggling with this for the last 2 years or so of my life...

anyways...

NH

- Jordan

[Dratj]

lol, somehow yes.

--

dratj i am trying to focus on school for these last few weeks for sure...i've actually had a somewhat of a breakthru this last week or so and actually think I know what i may lke to do now post school, which is really encouraging to me cause I've been struggling with this for the last 2 years or so of my life...

anyways...

NH

- Jordan

Good to hear. At the limits are you playing in poker right now, I'm sure if you do well, you can support yourself but it's good to have something to fall back on.
What career are you thinking of getting into?