74 replies to this topic

[DanielNegreanu]

You are playing Omaha H/L in the big game and are dealt Q-Q-10-9 doublesuited on the button. The first player in raises and gets three callers. You also call on the button. The big blind re-raises and all players call. The flop comes A K Q and you don't flop a front door or back door flush draw. The big blind bets out, the first limper raises, the second limper re-raises, and the player in the cut off seat re-raises. There is one bet left as you are playing with five bets per street. What would you do?

[bdc30]

I fold. Maybe even before the action gets to me."Open Farrell" was it called?? lolYou're dodging cards all over the place, and may alreadybe drawing to one out...It's not worth it.Is fold pre-flop not an option??

[Zeatrix]

Yeah agree, there is only a back door low draw available so there obviously is someone that allready has a straight. Someone else also probably has a flush draw. The flush and straight isn't really a problem since we still need to fill up to win the high. But someone probably has a set of kings or aces with the pot beeing three bet before the flop so we probably only have the last queen as an out.So I say we have one out: Fold

[Canada]

If anyone can find a call or a cap I'd love to know how

[Rocketwadster]

bdc30, on Wednesday, May 17th, 2006, 11:53 PM, said:

Is fold pre-flop not an option??

I think a re-raise is better than folding pre-flop...lol

[Waffles2003]

I think u fold here because many of your outs (to hit the boat) are probably in the other players hands. Plus there are many possibilties that other people may hit a bigger boat.

[Balloon guy]

I agree.fold*********Changed this answer****

[Swift_Psycho]

bdc30, on Thursday, May 18th, 2006, 3:53 AM, said:

Is fold pre-flop not an option??

This is a good call pre-flop with so many opponents (most likely with low-oriented hands). You hope for a high flop and plan to drop the hand if you don't get it.Post-flop, you got your high flop, but it's bottom set on a very coordinated board. With this much action, I toss it without much thought. If I called, I really would have no idea what card to root for to come on the turn short of the case Queen. Even if I made a straight I'd likely be splitting.

[gilbertology]

How can you not fold here? Obvious flush draw, probable made straight, and likely trip kings or aces means you're drawing to the case queen, if it's still in the deck. But if you're psychic and feel like that queen is coming, go ahead and cap it. Reasoning for capping being the second choice above calling is that calling shows weakness and basically gives away your hand as trip Qs, and it's going to be capped anyways on the way back so might as well do it yourself.

[shpaget]

Fold - you're drawing to one out.And on a really good day, you'll turn your queen and someone will river their fourth King.In fact, I have a hard time fathoming what hands these other four could have to go bet-raise-3bet-4bet...except perhaps straigth, flush draw, set, set.I can't see the fourth guy 4-betting with just TJ....although, it's quite possible that a straight here is a favourite because everyone has each other's outs...a straight needs to dodge a few spades (and he hopes he's against a couple flush draws), and hope the final two cards don't pair each other.Anyway...I've read somewhere that bottom set in Omaha is about as valuable as a snotburger.

[DrZebra]

Seems like an easy fold, but why is this hand posted then?We're getting at worst 7:1 (but for at most 4 outs and at worst zero!)Are we all missing something?Is it for some reason clear no one has AAxy (even if yes, what about KK?)Is this something in which we can safely represent the flush if it hits and get JTxy out?

[Rocketwadster]

DrZebra, on Thursday, May 18th, 2006, 9:43 AM, said:

Are we all missing something?

Everyone who says fold is NOT missing something. Even though it will take runner-runner, we could be playing for only half the pot. Highly unlikely against all those opponents that we have the best hand right now, meaning we are drawing to one out against a better set, or at best trying to pair the board so we make our UNDERFULL. This is a no-win situation, so get out while the gettin's good.

[greatwhite]

I don't know if you can call 1 bet here let alone 4. What are you looking to hit, a queen or 3 of jacks. That's 4 outs. If one of the jacks comes it's very probable that there will be a split pot or a 3 flush will be on the board by the river.

[checkymcfold]

Canada, on Thursday, May 18th, 2006, 5:35 AM, said:

If anyone can find a call or a cap I'd love to know how

i cap because i hate money?

[XXEddie]

Rocketwadster, on Thursday, May 18th, 2006, 9:48 AM, said:

Everyone who says fold is NOT missing something. Even though it will take runner-runner, we could be playing for only half the pot. Highly unlikely against all those opponents that we have the best hand right now, meaning we are drawing to one out against a better set, or at best trying to pair the board so we make our UNDERFULL. This is a no-win situation, so get out while the gettin's good.

very unlikely, itll take runner-runner for a low to become possible

[Rocketwadster]

XXEddie, on Thursday, May 18th, 2006, 10:46 AM, said:

very unlikely, itll take runner-runner for a low to become possible

exactly (didn't I say that???) - but you cant exclude that from happening. With all that action pre-flop, there must be some hands out there like A 2, A 3, etc. that MAY be calling here hoping to get a low draw on the next card (we won't go into why that is good or bad). Any 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, or 8 will provide a low draw, which is a fair number of cards...

[shpaget]

The only possible scenario I can consider, where you would call (or cap) would be if your opponents' hands looked like this:AKxx (two spades)AKxx (two spades)AKxx (two spades)2345 (two spades)The only possible saving grace here is with four willing betters is that you are possibly facing three separate aces, rather than a pair of them in one hand.And if you're lucky and facing a couple of AK hands...who knows?I just don't know how you warrant the risk on that hope.

[jayboogie]

But we have a set, how can we not cap? You guys are all weak tight fearing the monsters in the closet. I say cap it and look to spike a 1 outer.SW

[Jdr999]

Easy fold. Bottom set in Omaha is worthless, more so in O/8B.

[gregdon8]

punch david benyamine in the face because he is french, then fold. simultaneously saying that you learned how to fold under pressure by watching France on the history channel