17 replies to this topic

[Rhegium]

I figure I am a donk for this so flame on.I have Ace Queen UTG and I just call the small blind of 100. 9 People in a live STG I play in every week and we start with 2500. I figure someone will raise but it turns out to be 7 callers. Flop comes A 9 9 . SB and BB check and I bet 250 to see where I am at. Next guy, short stack at 625 goes all in. Next guy goes all in for 2125 total. Next guy goes all in for 1625 Total. Now I am in a dilema. If someone has ace 9, I am screwed. I figure the short stack has a flush draw. The 2125 total guy I think an ace and the last guy a nine. I debate for two min trying to figure pot odds in my head. Worse case is the ace-9 for the 2125 guy, but I think he then would have only called the short stack to get more in. I figure him for a low-ace although he is a tight player but agressive when in. The 1625 guy I figure either for the nine or the flush draw. In the end I figure I called because I would still have 1400 left if I was totally wrong and if I was right, I should get 1000 back because I should have the high ace against the 2125 guy. Turns out I was right and wrong. The short stack was on the flush draw. The 2125 guy had Ace-King and the last guy the K-9. I ended up losing everything. But was this such a bad play?I figure I am getting 1000 back and it is only costing me then 825 to catch the miracle ace. Also there was no raise pre-flop so I may actually be ahead against the flush draws and low aces. Was my thinking wrong? Would you have put in the extra 1800? IF I did not put the extra 1800 chips in, I was still guaranteed to be second place at the time but early in the tournament. Very interesting hand I think and everyone has been calling me a donk. But I think there was some logic in the hand.

[Royal_Tour]

I only read the 1st partits an insta foldand what does STG means?? single table game?if its a SNG it could also be cinsidered a STT for single table tournament

[Rhegium]

Single-Table-Game

[fleung22]

Rhegium, on Monday, April 24th, 2006, 6:21 PM, said:

I figure I am a donk for this so flame on.I have Ace Queen UTG and I just call the small blind of 100. 9 People in a live STG I play in every week and we start with 2500. I figure someone will raise but it turns out to be 7 callers. Flop comes A 9 9 . SB and BB check and I bet 250 to see where I am at. Next guy, short stack at 625 goes all in. Next guy goes all in for 2125 total. Next guy goes all in for 1625 Total. Now I am in a dilema. If someone has ace 9, I am screwed. I figure the short stack has a flush draw. The 2125 total guy I think an ace and the last guy a nine. I debate for two min trying to figure pot odds in my head. Worse case is the ace-9 for the 2125 guy, but I think he then would have only called the short stack to get more in. I figure him for a low-ace although he is a tight player but agressive when in. The 1625 guy I figure either for the nine or the flush draw. In the end I figure I called because I would still have 1400 left if I was totally wrong and if I was right, I should get 1000 back because I should have the high ace against the 2125 guy. Turns out I was right and wrong. The short stack was on the flush draw. The 2125 guy had Ace-King and the last guy the K-9. I ended up losing everything. But was this such a bad play?I figure I am getting 1000 back and it is only costing me then 825 to catch the miracle ace. Also there was no raise pre-flop so I may actually be ahead against the flush draws and low aces. Was my thinking wrong? Would you have put in the extra 1800? IF I did not put the extra 1800 chips in, I was still guaranteed to be second place at the time but early in the tournament. Very interesting hand I think and everyone has been calling me a donk. But I think there was some logic in the hand.

Preflop I'll assume you meant you limped 'cause how could you just call the small blind UTG? I don't like the limping vs. raising.My question would be on your flop play.If you bet 250 to "find out where you are" then what did you find out from what was happening around you?Betting to check out where you stand is fine but it's useless if you're just going to call anyways. If you know you can't fold top pair then you're better off just betting out big and making your opponents make a tough decision.

[da_beartrap]

fleung22, on Monday, April 24th, 2006, 6:48 PM, said:

Preflop I'll assume you meant you limped 'cause how could you just call the small blind UTG? I don't like the limping vs. raising.My question would be on your flop play.If you bet 250 to "find out where you are" then what did you find out from what was happening around you?Betting to check out where you stand is fine but it's useless if you're just going to call anyways. If you know you can't fold top pair then you're better off just betting out big and making your opponents make a tough decision.

that sums it up right there.... if you bet to see where you were at, than found out you were beat, you called hoping for a 1 outer to chop(2 outer to possibly wni if no one has an ace), and losing to almost anything else if the flush draws dont improve... , and losing to a 9 which someone probably has. as far as odds, sometimes odds dont even matter if you know your beat... i mean 3 all ins on a shakey board.

[Garn]

horrible play. how do you even think about making that play?

[Dratj]

Fold. you found out where you are at. In a bad place. How could you possibly beat everyone? Someone has a nine for sure.

[BeaverStyle]

I don't get it, you put out a bet to see where you were, and then you see 3 people go all in, and you think your AQ is good here?The bet got you the information you needed, easy fold.

[HtotheNootch]

That early, I fold A-Q preflop.

[DarkHorse55]

You said you bet 250 to find out where you were and you did. You found that after a shortstack all-in, two others moved all-in.This means you are severely behind at least one of the people and the other players may be stealing your redraw outs.Fold the flop.

[benhoug]

boy, your reasoning is very flawed. That is a HORRIBLE call.

[profxavier9]

Terrible Call its really funny when you think about it what could all those people be putting their money in with?

[owise1]

fleung22, on Monday, April 24th, 2006, 6:48 PM, said:

Preflop I'll assume you meant you limped 'cause how could you just call the small blind UTG? I don't like the limping vs. raising.My question would be on your flop play.If you bet 250 to "find out where you are" then what did you find out from what was happening around you?Betting to check out where you stand is fine but it's useless if you're just going to call anyways. If you know you can't fold top pair then you're better off just betting out big and making your opponents make a tough decision.

Exactly. As well, don't you think that one of the three have a nine? If so, you are very far behind. Easy fold. owise1

[Actuary]

YOU PLAY BAD.REALLY BAD." and it is only costing me then 825 to catch the miracle ace "amazingly bad.

[blakheart]

HtotheNootch, on Monday, April 24th, 2006, 9:35 PM, said:

That early, I fold A-Q preflop.

Limping preflop is the last choice, in my opinion. Depending on the game and your style, you can either raise or fold utg with AQ unsuited. I think either is ok.Your play on the flop is fine, until you call. You led out 1/3 the pot as a probe bet, and get pushed back at real hard. You found out what you need to know, that your hand was beat. You should have folded when it came back to you.

[Actuary]

oh, and don't post results, geesh.

[budfox427]

even though your play after the flop made me throw up in my mouth, you biggest mistake was made pre-flop. it was either a raise, or a fold. a raise thins the field and makes your decisions much easier after the flop. A fold avoids disaster from UTG.

[shpaget]

Fold preflop....if not raise...limping/reraising with AQ from UTG is not a profitable play long-term....it will cost you your kids' college fund.Then, after you bet to "see where you're at"....PAY ATTENTION to where you're at.You got the exact action required to give you all the information you need.The only way this can possibly be a good call is if your stack and the other guy's stack is big enough to make a significant side pot (one that is larger than the main pot), thereby giving you the appropriate odds on your call - meaning you are conceding the main pot and you KNOW you're ahead of the other big stack(s) making the play, to take the sidepot.You do not have the information required to make this call - all the information you have received (3 all-ins to a paired board) tells you to fold.What you did is call 1800 in the hopes of getting back 1000 of it...maybe math changed since I was in high school but that just doesn't seem profitable.Just think about it...knowing you have to pay 1800 to get 1000 means you save 800 just by folding. Tell you what...let's meet some place...You can give me $2000, I'll give you $1200, and we'll call it even.Or did you somehow justify in your mind that you were getting the right price for a one-outer (and possibly a zero-outer).When you make probe bets, listen to the feedback.You don't send a probe to Jupiter and then ignore it and cast it into the sun, do you?