Short Handed Theory Question..

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Standard 6 max table. For our purposes, both players involved have 200 BB's. Straight forward TAG raises 3.5 x BB UTG. What is your calling range on the button?

[Jordan 1]

any sooted nector to 1 gapper.any pair.Axs- Jordanedit -- and if im not as deep as 200bb, i may tighten up a little bit (not call as frequent)...that being said...if i dip below 90bb at any one point i always rebuy...so im rebuying quite often until i hit a hand or two and get on a roll...once there no looking back

[FullMontyM1 0]

22-AAA2-A5 suitedA9-AK suitedAK/AQ/AJ/A10 offKQ, KJ, QJ, Q10, J10 offsuited connectorsmedium suited one-gappersI would be re-raising with some of these hands, calling with others.Monty

[krup24 0]

any sooted nector to 1 gapper.any pair.Axs- Jordanedit -- and if im not as deep as 200bb, i may tighten up a little bit (not call as frequent)...that being said...if i dip below 90bb at any one point i always rebuy...so im rebuying quite often until i hit a hand or two and get on a roll...once there no looking back

agree w/ jordan

[Scott3705 0]

xx? too loose?Calling range: kq, kj, j10, A10, A9 PP7-, suited one gappers. Depending on the tag, suited connectors, but short handed, I usually throw those into my reraising range against relatively tight player. But against a "straight forward" tag, I probably only call w/ them.Edit:Wanted to add that I usually take out Axs in SH games especially against a TAG. I'll play it against a more aggressive preflop player, but I have found it to be a leak in SH games against relatively tight preflop players.

[Chief 0]

yeah, agree w/ krup

[Jordan 1]

However..with what I added...I'm not calling his raises everytime.Sometimes I may re-raise with a hand I'd usually call with...or sometimes I'd muck a hand I'd usually call with.Most of my standard re-raising hands on the button I re-raise with, although I'd still probably just call with a hand like JJ-QQ. Rarely, if the TAG has a "read" on me that my calling range on the button is quite wide I might cold call his raise with AA/KK and gamble for a big pot postflop if he can't change his read to give me credit. But that's rare enough, especially online cause online it's not often you play with someone long enough during a session to really pull this off with 100% confidence.- Jordan

[tapeworm 0]

Wanted to add that I usually take out Axs in SH games especially against a TAG.

That sounds reasonable to me. I think this might be a leak in my game too and I often forget to adjust my calling range depending on the opponent.Really, I feel the answer to this question depends on how tricky the TAG plays post-flop and whether we think we can use our position to win enough pots with marginal holdings(ie. how strong our read is on villain). I agree with most people's lists, but I feel we need to be a little careful with the "big" trap hands like KJ, Q10, K10, etc. We might want to throw out one-gappers too since they don't hit as often. I would probably play them, but I think it is marginal if we cannot take enough pots away from villain.Question: What flop are we looking for with these hands(KJ, Q10)? I mean if we flop TP and the TAG fires 3/4 to the pot, I guess we probably stay in since it is short-handed. What if he fires a second barrel? Are we out of there? Seems like the whole hand was a leak. That is where a read would help to know if he was bluffing or has us dominated, but a true TAG will have our hand dominated more often than not. Thoughts?

[Jordan 1]

That sounds reasonable to me. I think this might be a leak in my game too and I often forget to adjust my calling range depending on the opponent.Really, I feel the answer to this question depends on how tricky the TAG plays post-flop and whether we think we can use our position to win enough pots with marginal holdings(ie. how strong our read is on villain). I agree with most people's lists, but I feel we need to be a little careful with the "big" trap hands like KJ, Q10, K10, etc. We might want to throw out one-gappers too since they don't hit as often. I would probably play them, but I think it is marginal if we cannot take enough pots away from villain.Question: What flop are we looking for with these hands(KJ, Q10)? I mean if we flop TP and the TAG fires 3/4 to the pot, I guess we probably stay in since it is short-handed. What if he fires a second barrel? Are we out of there? Seems like the whole hand was a leak. That is where a read would help to know if he was bluffing or has us dominated, but a true TAG will have our hand dominated more often than not. Thoughts?

i dont call UTG raises with QTs or QTo. Not regularly.I also don't call UTG raises often with KJs, and almost never with KJo.not that I don't, but I usually don't, but on the button you can call with a lot of "x" hands and pick up so many pots on the flop/turn it almost doesn't matter what you have.so if i call the button with KJo or 85o it doesn't matter what the flop is...i'm going to make a decision of trying to take the pot based upon the TAGs action, texture of the flop...etc...not how strong "my" hand is..how strong I think he is.i dont think anyone would actually say they are calling on the button with KJo cause it's a good hand to cold call with. It isn't.- Jordan

[throwemaway 0]

That sounds reasonable to me. I think this might be a leak in my game too and I often forget to adjust my calling range depending on the opponent.Really, I feel the answer to this question depends on how tricky the TAG plays post-flop and whether we think we can use our position to win enough pots with marginal holdings(ie. how strong our read is on villain). I agree with most people's lists, but I feel we need to be a little careful with the "big" trap hands like KJ, Q10, K10, etc. We might want to throw out one-gappers too since they don't hit as often. I would probably play them, but I think it is marginal if we cannot take enough pots away from villain.Question: What flop are we looking for with these hands(KJ, Q10)? I mean if we flop TP and the TAG fires 3/4 to the pot, I guess we probably stay in since it is short-handed. What if he fires a second barrel? Are we out of there? Seems like the whole hand was a leak. That is where a read would help to know if he was bluffing or has us dominated, but a true TAG will have our hand dominated more often than not. Thoughts?

I would have to agree..I really don't like playing those trouble hands such as KJ, K10, QJ, and Q 10 to a raise, even if I have position.. There are just too many spots where I have gotten myself into trouble with hands like that..I play a pretty TAG approach where I don't like to call a lot of raises at all.. If I do in fact, call raises, it's hands where I feel the implied odds are very good...9 10s, 10 jack s ( but be careful), and low pp, and occasionally throw in Axs..I feel these hands are much more profitable to be calling with in position than trouble hands like KJ or QJJordan..Thanks for clarifying a bit..I still don't like to particularly get involved w/ KJ, etc though because I'm at a bit of a loss when I do in fact hit..8 5s is a bit out of my range, but to each his own. I understand what your saying about evaluating the situation after the flop, but I still like to have a relatively decent hand to fall back on

[Scott3705 0]

That sounds reasonable to me. I think this might be a leak in my game too and I often forget to adjust my calling range depending on the opponent.Really, I feel the answer to this question depends on how tricky the TAG plays post-flop and whether we think we can use our position to win enough pots with marginal holdings(ie. how strong our read is on villain). I agree with most people's lists, but I feel we need to be a little careful with the "big" trap hands like KJ, Q10, K10, etc. We might want to throw out one-gappers too since they don't hit as often. I would probably play them, but I think it is marginal if we cannot take enough pots away from villain.Question: What flop are we looking for with these hands(KJ, Q10)? I mean if we flop TP and the TAG fires 3/4 to the pot, I guess we probably stay in since it is short-handed. What if he fires a second barrel? Are we out of there? Seems like the whole hand was a leak. That is where a read would help to know if he was bluffing or has us dominated, but a true TAG will have our hand dominated more often than not. Thoughts?

I consider Ax more of a trap hand than Kj, because a TAG, who will autobet most flops, are raising preflop with more ace hands that have an ace than hands that have a king. So post flop, we can never be really comfortable playing the ace where as some times our jack, queen, king will be good. (more times than a rag will be). Trap hands, are trap hands cause you have to be careful, but it's just seems kinda weak to completely shy away from them in a SH game.Especially in SH, I try to define my hand really quick against a TAG. One bet on the flop is usually going to save money on later streets.

[DrZebra 0]

Standard 6 max table. For our purposes, both players involved have 200 BB's. Straight forward TAG raises 3.5 x BB UTG. What is your calling range on the button?

so much missing information, it's not worthwhile to think about

[Jordan 1]

so much missing information, it's not worthwhile to think about

....it's a general question with general, but somewhat definable answers.of course in-game your range is always modofied differently..but playing a straight forward TAG with deep-stacks you should already have an idea of your range...- Jordan

[DrZebra 0]

....playing a straight forward TAG with deep-stacks you should already have an idea of your range...

errrr wrong, you should have no idea

[Scott3705 0]

errrr wrong, you should have no idea

have to comment that, the typical image of the TAG, ABC Poker Player should usually be everyone's starting point to where they begin to alter their hand selections based upon their opponent's deviation from that formula. Against an ABC Poker Player, you should have a very strong idea of your range.

[Jordan 1]

errrr wrong, you should have no idea

Your IQ must be quite low then. I can't flame well. Meh.But this post is really...poor.- Jordan

[DrZebra 0]

have to comment that, the typical image of the TAG, ABC Poker Player should usually be everyone's starting point to where they begin to alter their hand selections based upon their opponent's deviation from that formula. Against an ABC Poker Player, you should have a very strong idea of your range.

Sorry, I didn't realize playing bots was in fashion.

[Jordan 1]

Sorry, I didn't realize playing bots was in fashion.

Are you talking? Seriously.- Jordan

[Scott3705 0]

Sorry, I didn't realize playing bots was in fashion.

It's not??? The question was directed at that though???Edit: ha. I just remembered who you were. That weird tournament post from 5 months ago where you advocated donking off all your chips w/ nothing because some how it may have given you more tournament equity than just folding in the first place. ha.

[krup24 0]

so much missing information, it's not worthwhile to think about

your idiocracy is becoming tiresome.

[DrZebra 0]

your idiocracy is becoming tiresome.

come discuss some of the other hands that are actually interesting

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

come discuss some of the other hands that are actually interesting

Yes, nothing like discussing.."Should I have folded trip queens on a KQQ board? I should've because he showed KK, I'm an idiot."..it was a simple question. I'm a bit awed that your simple mind was unable to handle the simplicity. What information did I leave out? That the TAG likes to wear red shirts? And sometimes he coughs into his hands and then immediately handles his cards, which has put me a bit on tilt? Anyway..It seems like any pocket pair, suited connector, suited one gappers, and most any two broadway cards are the consensus? Agreed?..because I don't.

[David_Nicoson 1]

Standard 6 max table. For our purposes, both players involved have 200 BB's. Straight forward TAG raises 3.5 x BB UTG. What is your calling range on the button?

What's the range of the TAG here?I'm thinking ATo+, KJs+, 88+.

[Scott3705 0]

Yes, nothing like discussing.."Should I have folded trip queens on a KQQ board? I should've because he showed KK, I'm an idiot."..it was a simple question. I'm a bit awed that your simple mind was unable to handle the simplicity. What information did I leave out? That the TAG likes to wear red shirts? And sometimes he coughs into his hands and then immediately handles his cards, which has put me a bit on tilt? Anyway..It seems like any pocket pair, suited connector, suited one gappers, and most any two broadway cards are the consensus? Agreed?..because I don't.

What's your range?

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

What's the range of the TAG here?I'm thinking ATo+, KJs+, 88+.

Yes, that's pretty fair, I'd think. Scott, my *calling* range is pretty narrow. ATs-AQs, pocket pairs 22-99--only really for set value. Suited connectors/one gappers from 23s to T9s. Not really *calling* with any two broadway cards. I'm raising with TT-AA most times, AKo/s. For metagame purposes, JTs from time to time. Obviously, a lot of it's read dependent, but, just from watching quite a bit of 5/10 6 Max and playing a bit of 1/2 and .5/1, I really think that the average player only re-raises once every 20 hands. Maybe I'm just too aggro, but, that doesn't seem like near enough.