11 replies to this topic

[AKQJs_2o]

DANG IT!I just back back from playing 6.5 hours of $2-$4 LHE at Oak's Card Club in Emeryville, CA (S.F. Bay Area, just North of Oakland). This is the first time I've played in a B&M club in several years, but TV poker has me wanting to play some real cards.After 5 hours I was $196 ahead, there is an Asian kid who is a student from the University of California at Berkeley sitting next to me and he asks me if I am a professional poker player ("Nooo" ... ). I'm thinking "Hmm ... $39 an hour is pretty good, I could quit my day job and do this for a living."I've been getting really good reads on people, I'm not getting great cards but I'm ahead so I'm betting aggressively when I'm in a hand. I notice a lot of these people are staying in on junk hands and I'm thinking to myself "The talent pool here must be really diluted from the Poker Boom." At this point I'm also thinking if I just play solid I can beat these people because they stay in on hole cards like :hearts5: :hearts3: all the way until the end.I've established some table presence by this point, when I push from late position people are dropping out so I'm even bluffing successfully, which is something I don't do very much. I get a :heartsa: :heartsk: in late position and push, the flop comes X :diamondsk: X:diamond:, I keep pushing because noone is showing any strength. the turn is X:diamond:, everyone checks to me, I bet $4, the river is :diamonds10: (four running diamonds!), it checks around to me and I check, the Button then bets $4, everyone folds to me, I'm 49.9% certain he's got the flush but it's a BIG pot by now (largely because I've been pushing from late position) so I think just MAYBE he doesn't have any diamonds in the hole and he's bluffing, I call, my read is GOOD and my :heartsk: :diamondsk: takes it!Everything is going great for me and I'm feeling good!Do you think I'd be smart enough to cash-in and quit?NO!THEN in the next 1.5 hours I drop $175. I actually got some pretty good hands, probably as good or better than when I was on my way up. I finally get AA in the hole, another A comes on the flop and I'm in late position so I make it expensive for everyone and I lose on the river to a club flush. The AAA is the best hand I'd seen in quite some time.I guess I let my concentration lapse because we started getting social at my end of the table, talking when we weren't in hands (which was often because the Berkeley Kid and I were folding our junk for the most part and we had another poker friend joining in our conversation, too). We also had a change in table personnel because people were busting out of the game, it actually got to the point where we had two empty chairs they couldn't fill.I never felt like I got tired, I never went on tilt, the cards just stopped going my way. So instead of leaving at 3a.m. ahead by $196 I end up leaving at about 4:30a.m. up by $20.Then on the drive home I'm trying to figure out WTF went wrong and I drive two freeway exits past my turnoff - so mental fatigue probably WAS a factor even though I never felt tired. Heck, I'm up typing this and it's 6:45a.m. and I just barely feel tired.SO HOW IN THE HECK DO KNOW WHEN IT'S TIME FOR YOU TO QUIT, EVEN IF YOU DON'T FEEL TIRED AND YOU'RE AHEAD IN THE GAME?If I could kick myself in the a$$ right now I'd do it. (I did have a fun time, but it would've been a lot funner if I'd have quit earlier.)

[21gambit]

youve had a good run though

[FilthyOtis]

You could have left $196 ahead...... but why in the world would you do that? you were at a good game, and you were doing well, why leave? you can't kick yourself because "if i left an hour ago i'd still be way up!". the only real reason to leave a good situation is if you do really feel like your getting tired or if some other stressfull thing that happened recently starts invading your thoughts and lowering your attention on the game. or if you just have to leave..... of course. your fine, you were still up.

[JETMECMAN]

I've done the same thing on several occasions but the swings were bigger.what ive started doing is taking a thirty min. break every 4 hrs.This allows me to do a few things like, evaluate my play up to that point, asses weather or not I'm tired, and watch the table while not having a vested intrest in the pot. Just check with the boss to make sure this is aproved. You would be amazed how much you can pick up on if youre just watching the players and their hands while not having to think about the one in front of you. I at one time while playing in Louisiana folded for an hour and a halve straight while watching the other players, paying the blinds the whole way of course. While the other players marked me as inexperienced I picked up tells galore. When I started playing I took 6 pots with good cards and no conflicts. That night was the start of how I play now and to date playing only 2/4 pl holdem over an 18 month period I'm up $31,153. Of course this is in cunjunction with reading every thing i can get my hands on. Always remember poker is about three things Money, Poeple, and Money.

[AKQJs_2o]

FilthyOtis said:

You could have left $196 ahead...... but why in the world would you do that? you were at a good game, and you were doing well, why leave?

In retrospect the game changed in the final two hours because we busted out several players. In fact by the time I left I was the only one playing from the original group that I'd first sat down (not surprising in 6.5 hours of playing time). I never really felt worried because even the newer players were having to make re-buys and going all-in on hands for lack of chips. (At least until they took down one of the big pots that I played in and lost. I was pretty good at building large pots throughout the game, I just couldn't win them at the end.)I think maybe I became overconfident because of some of my earlier successful plays (like the :heartsk: :diamondsk: taking a big pot vs. the four diamond runner flop/turn/river) and my run as the table bully (which was fun and led to successful bluffs, not normally a part of my $2-$4 LHE repertoire). I was giving lots of action (on decent hole cards for the most part) because - "Wtf, it's other people's money I'm playing with."

FilthyOtis said:

...  the only real reason to leave a good situation is if you do really feel like your getting tired or if some other stressfull thing that happened recently starts invading your thoughts and lowering your attention on the game  ...

Ahh ... therein lies the key -I never felt tired or fatigued in the least, I certainly wasn't stressed (heck, I was the one causing the stress at the table for a good part of the time), BUT I guess I started to have a good time and talk with my neighbors too much. In the beginning I got ahead, I was concentrating well, making good reads, and keeping my mouth shut. Then the Berkeley Kid sat down (it was his first time playing at a card club ever, but he said they played a lot at his frat house), things got social, and I started losing. I liked the BKid, we seemed to have a similar perspective on the game, and he needed a little help because he was a new card club player. By that time I was over my initial jitters, I had a big stack, and I was happy to help him out with questions about table etiquette, the club rules, and so forth. Maybe if I'd stayed serious, like I was in the beginning, instead of starting to enjoy myself I'd have quit earlier. I was in a real comfort zone after awhile. I have to say that the cards that I was losing on later seemed to be better hands than those I'd won on earlier, they were just 2nd best. Also I'd been able to dominate for a period of time so I was in "push/aggressive/let's have action mode". I must've stopped reading my opponents and just tried to muscle them with what I felt were good hands, especially when compared to my earlier fare. Early in the game I made money on PP 3's and 9's when they made sets, later in the game my PP A's and K's were big losers when they made sets, and I was pushing those pots to eliminate drawing hands after good flops ... oh I was giving action alright. I had PP 10's about four times and they only cost me money. I never saw PP Q's or J's. I had :spadesa: :spadesk:, pushed with it and lost after I paired Aces on the flop but with no flush draw.I guess the moral of my story is "If you want to make money then treat the game like a job, and when it starts to get fun then it's time to clock-out and go home." All the confidence I'd built up is gone, I'm wondering how I'll play if I return and get in the hole -$60 or -$80 right away (playing the way I was at the end of my previous session). I can't wait to go back and try it again, but I feel like I need to study a good poker book and reset myself somehow. I also need to become more self-aware. The rush was good while it lasted, I hope I can find the crest of the wave and ride it again.Any book recommendations?I have Doyle's "SS1" and "SS2". I lost Caro's book of tells and Slansky's "Hold'Em Poker" when I moved. I think I'll rebuy Sklansky's "HEP". http://www.amazon.co...g=UTF8&v=glanceI'm tempted to get -"Small Stakes Hold 'em: Winning Big With Expert Play" by Ed Miller, David Sklansky, Mason Malmuth since I don't think I'm nearly ready for the $30/$60 table yet.http://www.amazon.co...=glance&s=booksI thought Dan Harrington had two books out, but Amazon only lists "Harrington on Hold 'em: Expert Strategy for No Limit Tournaments" - probably not a great tome for a projected $2/$4 and $3/$6 LHE player.Any help or tips will be appreciated.TIA

[NormanHaupt]

I never quit while I'm ahead, and this says a lot about who I am. I don't stop when I think I can stop making profit. I'm not in the game to stop with the most money, I'm in the game to learn.When I feel I am making stupid mistakes and I'm not learning, I take a break. I don't quit, but I'll leave the table. IM a couple people, relax.The whole idea to poker isn't winning a big pot and running. You will NEVER learn anything playing that way. If anything, you will learn AK will pay off big and when it does you need to quit. Soon, you'll be waiting for AK to strike, because you guess it'll pay off. So, to reliterate what I'm saying... Play for an amount of time, don't play for an amount of money.

[wrto4556]

AKQJs_2o,I don't read any of your posts because of the font. I feel like it's burning a hole in my retina.

[AKQJs_2o]

wrto4556 said:

AKQJs_2o,I don't read any of your posts because of the font. I feel like it's burning a hole in my retina.

Wow, are they that bad?I use Firefox for my browser and all of the fonts look the same, they're all about a 12 point type, and not very bold either. I don't think this website is 100% Mozilla/Firefox compliant.I'll try to stop going big if it's bothersome.

[wrto4556]

I'm not trying to be rude or say that it's bothersome.I'm saying that I would like to read what you have to say, but can't. :-)

[Smasharoo]

I've been getting really good reads on peopleConfusing this for being really lucky is how many people lose a *lot* of money.Don't be those people.

[Markmadness]

Set an amount of time you will play and live by it.

[JFarrell20]

Never quit. If you are a winning player it makes it +EV to sit at a table no matter what the session outcome is.