RISEorFall 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 FCP, dont remember readsRISE is BB with A :icon_suit_spade: 5 :icon_suit_heart: PF: UTG calls, UTG1 calls, 6 folds, SB calls, RISE checksFlop: (4 SB)A :icon_suit_heart: J :icon_suit_club: K :icon_suit_diamond: SB checks, RISE bets, UTG calls, UTG 1 folds, SB foldsTurn: (3 BB) 7 :icon_suit_heart: RISE bets, UTG callsRiver: (5 BB) 2 :icon_suit_spade: RISE checks with the intention of calling a bet...good? Link to post Share on other sites
psujohn 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 It's what I do. Though that still leaves open the question of if it's good or not.Anyone observing me close would note that whenever I lead from the BB like this it means TPWK or worse. TPGK or better and I look for a check/raise. It's probably too predictable but no one observes close enought/plays enough hands with me for it to matter. Link to post Share on other sites
doubleatrain 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 I'm okay with the way that was played. The c/c on the river is probably the safest option without solid reads, I think. A case could be made for a bet/fold, but I don't know if that's what I'd do...though you probably still get called by a decent king or jack enough of the time depending on the opponent. But without a read, I c/c. Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 this river is the clearest b/f I have seen posted since 1983.Please add this to your game.Not too much, just like Hot Sauce, or maybe nutmeg. Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 more on this please.anyone wanna fight? Link to post Share on other sites
Pancake407 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 I definately bet, I dont want a K or a J checking behind here. I wouldnt say that the 2 is a scare card. Link to post Share on other sites
doubleatrain 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 more on this please.anyone wanna fight?I wanna fight...but I can't...because you're right. You always do this! Link to post Share on other sites
thecamelot 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 this river is the clearest b/f I have seen posted since 1983.Please add this to your game.Not too much, just like Hot Sauce, or maybe nutmeg.This situation comes up for me so often that it's frustrating.What makes it such a good play on the river? (I tend to agree with you but I'm not sure why). Link to post Share on other sites
psujohn 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 more on this please.anyone wanna fight?Maybe not fight but talk it out ...Any K or J that's come this far will likely call and probably not bet. So b/f wins us more when we're ahead. A3, A4 the same.A6, A8, A9, AT likely don't bet so b/f costs us 1 when we're behind (to this very limited range).AQ will likely bet if we check but not raise if it's been played like this so far.A2 may/may not raise this if we bet. I'd guess 50/50 at best.A naked Q or T likely folds costing/gaining us nothing.I seriously doubt that anything that beats us is folding and that anything we beat is raising - plus villain has shown a willingness to call this down. That's pretty much the definition of a good b/f situation isn't it.So yeah I tend to check/call this hoping that it'll check through and I'll save a bit against A6 but lose value against KT, JT which are probably the most likely and may very well call this. Link to post Share on other sites
TJ_Eckleburg 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 A pity you don't remember your reads.I like check/calling against aggressive or neutral opponents. I want there to be 1 bet on the river, not 2, and I don't want to be folding. I think after betting flop/turn and checking... it'll smell weak and someone calling down with a K or something will bet.B/F against passive types though. Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 When we check, we allow villan to select which hands to betWhen we bet, he calls with some hands he would check behindThat is to say, we are more of a favorite when we bet than when we c/c.Try to drill that home.. I still am worknig on thatWe are usually ahead, given no preflop raise or aggression laterPot is small and a river raise means we are beat a lot, so it's an easy foldI don't see villan folding the river (although they do all the time) because he did not have pot odds to call regardless of what he had, on the turn. So, he'll call river bet, normally.******I owe this to Screech. Link to post Share on other sites
AlphaOmega 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 A pity you don't remember your reads.I like check/calling against aggressive or neutral opponents. B/F against passive types though.I think this sums it up the best.I may be six-maxified, but kings will usually bet here, and a bet has virtually no value versus a missed draw but a check does since it allows them to bluff.Game. set. match. Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 with no reads, its an EASY BET/FOLD.what draws?I considered that too.I'll take you down Omega.I'll take you down to Chinatown. Link to post Share on other sites
RISEorFall 0 Posted March 2, 2006 Author Share Posted March 2, 2006 I wish i had more reads too. I'm getting PT when i have some extra cash (i have about 25 bucks to last me 2 weeks unless i take out the rest of my poker bank)I have trouble with these Ax hands from the blinds when i just hit TP. I dont really know why, as I get called down by lots of worse hands all the time. As far as checking the river, I wanted to induce a bet from a missed draw or a K. a lone K I think will bet this river about 1/2 the time if I check (this may just be my tables I play, though), a J probably doesn't bet, but a missed draw will sometimes bet. If I bet, I get called by a K and sometimes a J. I only get raised by hands that beat me. with check/call I lose some value, but I see a SD. I also get a chance to pick off bluffs.with bet/fold I gain value from worse hands that would call, but I sometimes don't see a SD.I don't see how it's as clear as Act says, but like I said, im not good with these kinda hands. Link to post Share on other sites
psujohn 0 Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 If we bet we have to fold.If we check we have to call.I think it all comes down to - more hands call a bet than bet if checked to. Think of it this way - if villain never bluff raises the river getting to showdown via check/call does us no good. Those times he would have raised if we took the bet/fold line we lose the same.As for draws - KQ, QJ, KT and JT nearly have odds to call the turn if they think all their outs are clean. Plus they add a little bit for the BB FOS factor thinking there's a chance they're ahead. Though that BB FOS factor is what'll get them to call one more on the river.Oh and as for PT - you can get it free from PSO. Everyone complains about UB being tight but I like the software and with a 100% deposit bonus I got PT for free and nearly tripled my deposit at the same time - mostly playing .5/1. And the .5/1 Kill tables are pretty juicy. Link to post Share on other sites
devilsslide 0 Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 Without Reading Replies:I think I play it the same, hating that I'm investing so much into a small pot.I just read through: Okay, I think I have to go with b/f. P.S. quick edit rocks Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 Rise,Please go to http://pokersourceonline.com, sign up for a bonus and select PokerTracker. Take like $300 from your BR and move it to the selected site. Play the required amount of raked hands. Clear the PSO bonus, get the free PT, and clear some of the site's deposit bonus. Take your money and put it back into FCP, and crush your tables even more. Trust me. It took me two days to clear PT on Full Tilt at 1/2 (when I should have been playing .5/1), and it is worth it. Trust me.There is no excuse for not having PT. You can get it for free for crying out loud!I'm just trying to help.- Zach Link to post Share on other sites
RISEorFall 0 Posted March 3, 2006 Author Share Posted March 3, 2006 Rise,Please go to http://pokersourceonline.com, sign up for a bonus and select PokerTracker. Take like $300 from your BR and move it to the selected site. Play the required amount of raked hands. Clear the PSO bonus, get the free PT, and clear some of the site's deposit bonus. Take your money and put it back into FCP, and crush your tables even more. Trust me. It took me two days to clear PT on Full Tilt at 1/2 (when I should have been playing .5/1), and it is worth it. Trust me.There is no excuse for not having PT. You can get it for free for crying out loud!I'm just trying to help.- Zachi did not know this until you and psujohn told me. thanks. Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 i did not know this until you and psujohn told me. thanks.Anytime B) Link to post Share on other sites
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