10 replies to this topic

[Snowman]

Hello!This is my first post at this forum. I recently played the following hand and I'd like some feedback.So, it's an online .25/.50 NL cash game. I'll call my main enemy OPP. I have only played like 10 hands at this table and don't really have any read on him. At this point I haven't seen him do anything worth noting. He may have limped in a time or two, but he hasn't really been involved in any pots.I'm in the big blind with 7h8h. I have about 24-25$ at this point, OPP has me covered by a few dollars, don't remember exactly what he had, but not a lot more than I.Pre-flop:UTG limpsOPP limpsButton limpsI checkeveryone else foldsFlop: Qh 5h QcI checkfirst limper checksOPP bets 0.25$Button callsI callthe other limper foldsTurn: 4hI checkOPP bets 1$button foldsI raise 4$OPP callsRiver: 9sI bet 5$OPP raises 20$, putting me all-inI callOPP turns over 44 and takes home the pot.What do you think of this play? After thinking about it afterwards I think I should have folded to the raise on the river. I have a hard time putting him on anything else than a full house or nut flush.At the time I was hoping he had a queen with good kicker, but then I don't think he would have limped in early position.I don't see him having a boat with queens over something else either of the same reason.Do you think I should have made a semi-bluff on the flop? I could very well have made him fold his fours at that point and taken home the pot, but I was afraid of a reraise from someone with queens that would have forced me to lay down my draw.Finally, what about the size of the bet on the river? I wanted a worse hand than my flush to pay me off (like queens), so I bet about half the size of the pot.Oh, one more thing to relate back to the title of the post. I feel this is a weakness of suited connectors when you hit a flush. You can't really be sure you're not up against a bigger flush or, if the board is paired, a boat. So, how cautious should you be when you hit that flush with a low suited connector?Any feedback will be appreciated!

[Wilderness]

Got to fold on the river.You will never be able to put him on pocket 4's, but what hands do you think he could have to call your turn bet and then raise like that on the river?Q5/Q4/Q9 - Of these three hands, Q5 is the most likely because if all he had was 3 of a kind I'd think he'd bet out more on the flop to try and chase away the flush draws (assuming he's a good player, which he could easily not be). If he's got Q5, he wouldn't fear the flush, so maybe he made that min bet to keep the draws in and maybe get someone to re-raise.55 - Another hand where he may have wanted to keep the draws in and maybe get a re-raise from someone with just trip Q's.Any 2 hearts - This seems more likely to me than the previous hands and its very likely that if he holds 2 hearts that one or both of them is higher than yours.Yeah, maybe the turn or river gave him two pair and he thought it was good for some reason, but you are beat by him way more often than not so you've got to fold to his river bet I think.

[Duff_Man]

Yeah without the nut flush and with a paired board I would have folded after the big re-raise. Even with the nut flush I usually end up folding to a big re-raise with a paired board. Might not be the best play but oh well. I'm not that great of a player either.Duff

[Wilderness]

XXEddie said:

Wilderness said:

Got to fold on the river.You will never be able to put him on pocket 4's, but what hands do you think he could have to call your turn bet and then raise like that on the river?Q5/Q4/Q9 - Of these three hands, Q5 is the most likely because if all he had was 3 of a kind I'd think he'd bet out more on the flop to try and chase away the flush draws (assuming he's a good player, which he could easily not be). If he's got Q5, he wouldn't fear the flush, so maybe he made that min bet to keep the draws in and maybe get someone to re-raise.55 - Another hand where he may have wanted to keep the draws in and maybe get a re-raise from someone with just trip Q's.Any 2 hearts - This seems more likely to me than the previous hands and its very likely that if he holds 2 hearts that one or both of them is higher than yours.Yeah, maybe the turn or river gave him two pair and he thought it was good for some reason, but you are beat by him way more often than not so you've got to fold to his river bet I think.

none of those are likely because the guy limped in, why would limp in with thati woulda folded on the turn probably, way to many boat possiblilities, so you flush could be, and was, - is it me or are these the best eggs you've ever had -

No, they aren't likely, certainly not as likely as just having 2 hearts, but if you don't think that bad players will limp in with something like that, especially if its suited, you are wrong.All I was saying was what he could have to bet like he did, and those hands were the least likely of what he could hold. No, I don't think the player would hold those hands, but it is possible.

[Wilderness]

I didn't say you were wrong ... only if you thought someone wouldn't limp with that would you be wrong; of course no good player would do so, but I think that assuming the opponent is a good player is a mistake because many players on that level are not good.So since the opponent *could* be a bad player, you have to consider that he may be playing one of those hands. I wouldn't play it, you wouldn't play it, and I doubt our original poster would play it; but you do have to take into account that the opponent could play it, however unlikely that is.Plus, something I didn't take into account when I made my original statement ... if the opponent is bad enough to play a hand like Q5, he's certainly not going to be good enough to try and trap on the flop when he hits his hand.Either way, our little tangent isn't very relevant to this thread because I think we both aggree that no matter what hand the opponent is actually holding, its very likely to be better than the small flush our guy is holding.

[Snowman]

XXEddie said:

none of those are likely because the guy limped in, why would limp in with thati woulda folded on the turn probably, way to many boat possiblilities, so you flush could be, and was, - is it me or are these the best eggs you've ever had -

Thanks for the input everyone.I agree with you all that the call on the river is bad. The reason for it was that I hadn't really hit anything at all for a long time and was excited to finally hit a fairly big hand, plus that I'm used to SnG tournaments with not so good players. So it was pretty much wishful thinking on my part that made me call.I have a question here though. I feel I have a hard time to lay down the flush on the turn. Am I too loose for thinking this?I'm pretty new to playing NL cash games. My background is in micro-level limit and NL SnG and I see people all the time play like this with worse than a full house.

[Wilderness]

Snowman said:

XXEddie said:

none of those are likely because the guy limped in, why would limp in with thati woulda folded on the turn probably, way to many boat possiblilities, so you flush could be, and was, - is it me or are these the best eggs you've ever had -

Thanks for the input everyone.I agree with you all that the call on the river is bad. The reason for it was that I hadn't really hit anything at all for a long time and was excited to finally hit a fairly big hand, plus that I'm used to SnG tournaments with not so good players. So it was pretty much wishful thinking on my part that made me call.I have a question here though. I feel I have a hard time to lay down the flush on the turn. Am I too loose for thinking this?I'm pretty new to playing NL cash games. My background is in micro-level limit and NL SnG and I see people all the time play like this with worse than a full house.

I don't think I would have folded the turn but I also wouldn't have checked like you did either. You've made your flush and so you need to find out where your hand is at. I think you should make a pot-sized bet. If he re-raises, you can probably fold at that point, and if he just calls, then you either check/call the river or bet out there too if the river is a blank and you still think you are good.By checking the turn you don't really get a good idea of what he has when he bets out because he could do so just thinking you are weak. When you hit pretty much any hand that is good but could be behind to a better hand (non-nut flushes, flush with a pair on the board, etc) you really need to try and figure out exactly where you stand so you can play accordingly.

[Snowman]

Wilderness said:

I don't think I would have folded the turn but I also wouldn't have checked like you did either. You've made your flush and so you need to find out where your hand is at. I think you should make a pot-sized bet. If he re-raises, you can probably fold at that point, and if he just calls, then you either check/call the river or bet out there too if the river is a blank and you still think you are good.By checking the turn you don't really get a good idea of what he has when he bets out because he could do so just thinking you are weak. When you hit pretty much any hand that is good but could be behind to a better hand (non-nut flushes, flush with a pair on the board, etc) you really need to try and figure out exactly where you stand so you can play accordingly.

Yeah, forgot to mention that check-raise in my original post. I wouldn't normally do that. I was tilting a bit here, because I had been running cold for a while.What about a semi-bluff on the flop? That would probably tell me something of where the other players are at. In this case it could also have won the pot right there.

[wrto4556]

This is an easy one. Raise the flop, bet the turn, fold to the all in river aggression.semi-bluff's work good, you may get him to fold 44 on the flop with a raise.The river is an easy fold with the non-nut flush on a paired board.