Wingmaster05 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 we need more hands...anyone even play today? this is from last session. nothing big, just want opinions.Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cxPreflop: Hero is CO with [8s], [7s]. 1 fold, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Hero calls.Flop: (10 SB) [9h], [Tc], [2s] (5 players)SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 bets, SB calls, BB folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.Turn: (9 BB) [3c] (4 players)SB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, Hero checks.River: (9 BB) [Jh] (4 players)SB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero calls.Tempted to cap but no stats on villain (appeared loose over like twenty hands) Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Zach6668 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I cap the river.I may also consider betting the turn, if checked to, as the pot is already quite large, and still 4 handed. I think there is some value in a bet.- Zach Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I don't raise flop.I cap river (well, I'm a wuss, but KQ only reaosnable better hand)Zach,our straight is <18% to hit on river, I don't think betting turn is for value Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Zach6668 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I don't raise flop.I cap river (well, I'm a wuss, but KQ only reaosnable better hand)Zach,our straight is <18% to hit on river, I don't think betting turn is for valueI was unsure on this. Does the fact that the pot is already 9 BB make any difference in this calculation, compared to if it were say 4 BB?- Zach Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 eing bigger makes a semi bluff more worthy as we only need to succeed about 1/9 times, folding everyone. Thus it's a clear Bet if HU, but to me, not 4 handed. As far as equity goes, the current pot size is not relavant as we have to put in 1/n of the bets and have less than 1/n chances of winning. A stretch could be made we migt clean up pair outs, but with this board, our pairs are not outs.I'm not 100% sure on flop.With at last one over, I like a raise, with our hand, I want more players. Getting bet into on a 6 trun with a caler in between would be sweet. That would offset not getting the free card. Link to post Share on other sites
screech 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I like everything. Link to post Share on other sites
Sluggo 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I disagree with flop raise.It's not for value.Is it for fold equity? Could we win with a busted draw enough to profit?Is it to clean up outs? (And to a lesser degree, metagaming?) Are we folding KQ here? Link to post Share on other sites
Wingmaster05 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Author Share Posted February 21, 2006 Yes sluggo, i was folding higher straight cards from the others, unless they had a chunk of the flop. I don't want ragged high cards calling, as a turn paint against lots of players hurts my hand, plus folding the SB gives me the lead, which almost always means a free river unless I hit. Lots of gutshots call for one, fold for two.It's not that far from a value raise, is it?.No I don't expect to win this nearly enough with a flop raise. Link to post Share on other sites
Briguy 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I disagree with flop raise.It's not for value.Is it for fold equity? Could we win with a busted draw enough to profit?Is it to clean up outs? (And to a lesser degree, metagaming?) Are we folding KQ here?Basic free card play, with a smidgen of value (if all four call). It could even slow SB down if he was planning a check-raise with an overpair. Link to post Share on other sites
Canada 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I disagree with flop raise.It's not for value.Is it for fold equity? Could we win with a busted draw enough to profit?Is it to clean up outs? (And to a lesser degree, metagaming?) Are we folding KQ here?On a rainbow flop with 5 players, 2 already in for 1 bet, its easily for value.Add the freecard potential and its the perfect play I don't raise flop.I cap river (well, I'm a wuss, but KQ only reaosnable better hand)Zach,our straight is <18% to hit on river, I don't think betting turn is for valueI was unsure on this. Does the fact that the pot is already 9 BB make any difference in this calculation, compared to if it were say 4 BB?- ZachNo. There is no value in a turn bet, and against 3 other players your net FE is close to 0 especially with the second club arriving.Taking the free card is definately most beneficial. Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 ok, I was on the fence with flop raise, leaning against it.I've been converted.Also, misread action and did not notice a new player woke up on riverI still think we can cap here. Link to post Share on other sites
Wingmaster05 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Author Share Posted February 21, 2006 ok, I was on the fence with flop raise, leaning against it.I've been converted.Also, misread action and did not notice a new player woke up on riverI still think we can cap here.i agree, this is easily a set that waited for the turn and got foiled by the my check, not to mention countless two pair hands. I like the cap although it didnt seem obvious during play. Don't get passive in large pots! Link to post Share on other sites
screech 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 ok, I was on the fence with flop raise, leaning against it.I've been converted.Also, misread action and did not notice a new player woke up on riverI still think we can cap here.The river cap is really close.That J seemed to have helped his hand. His hand range is:J9TT/99/22KQQ887KQ/TT/99 should be discounted slightly. 22 should be discounted somewhat too. Given that the card puts 3 to a straight on the board, it is more likely that he 3-bets with a straight. Against an unknown, I think it's a call. Link to post Share on other sites
Sysvr4 0 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Nh. This is the perfect spot for you on the river... you're putting in the 2nd bet and he puts in the 3rd. Since you can now call for 3 bets total I think that's exactly the right way to play it.If your positions are reversed, it's a little harder because if you 3-bet it you only get capped when you're beat.Jeff Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 KQ and Q8 is all that beats us right?easy cap at 2/4. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Guest Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 KQ and Q8 is all that beats us right?easy cap at 2/4.Yup.Also, I think the action in the OP is all screwed up since the switchover...- Zach-----------WHY CAN'T I LOG IN!!!? Link to post Share on other sites
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