exactly

[SLEEPYCHIEF 0]

I won't go into to much details, but here it is.I call a raise with QQ preflop, just me and villan to a flop of 7c 4c 2d. Being first to act villan bets the pot which is about 37% of his stack. If I double the raise I would only have a few chips left so I move all in. He calls with AK no club. Of couse the K hits the river. I say my usual bad beat whine line, "I wish one time I could play that dumb and get it rewarded." The guy's respones was, "Shut up, I had to call, I committed myself to the pot." LOL EXACTLY

[NoSup4U 0]

I personally try not to teach my opponents to play better like you did here. I would have said something like: Nice hand, you really had to call there with 2 overs like that, you were pretty much committed.But thats just me.Mark

[erac22 0]

Hmmm... Is calling with AK really a mistake there? He's got 6 outs twice, so he needs 3 to 1, which I'm pretty sure he's getting. I'd say his mistake is a pot sized raise on the flop, after coming up dry. By raising that much, instead of half the pot, he bascically creates an excuse to call for all his chips on the flop, or creating his own pot odds. But you got your money in way ahead, don't sweat it. He makes you money.

[Scott3705 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

[SLEEPYCHIEF 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

The point was he committed himself to the pot with the much inferior hand, and acted like he didn't make a bad play. I try my hardest in every game to not make this error. That was the point

[Scott3705 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

The point was he committed himself to the pot with the much inferior hand, and acted like he didn't make a bad play. I try my hardest in every game to not make this error. That was the point

Really his mistake here is playing too shortstacked in a cash game. I mean he only potted the flop in a heads up hand.so basically he's sitting at the beginning of this hand w/ 20 BB's or so. Or in tangible terms $40 at a 1/2 nl table. That sir is retarded.

[krup24 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

I concur he's shortstacked and the play isn't horid. I would like to see the pf action though. How much did he raise?And stop w/ the bad beat whine lines

[SLEEPYCHIEF 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

I concur he's shortstacked and the play isn't horid. I would like to see the pf action though. How much did he raise?And stop w/ the bad beat whine lines

We were playing in a tourney, his stack size was 1200 mine was 1500Blinds were 30/60 Preflop he raised to 150, UTG, me and another guy called. On the flop he bet around 500.

[RhinestoneCowboy 2]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

I concur he's shortstacked and the play isn't horid. I would like to see the pf action though. How much did he raise?And stop w/ the bad beat whine lines

We were playing in a tourney, his stack size was 1200 mine was 1500Blinds were 30/60 Preflop he raised to 150, UTG, me and another guy called. On the flop he bet around 500.

A. Reraise with QQ, He doesnt put you on a big PP when you call the raise preflop.B. Bad Beat forum is too your left.

[Scott3705 0]

We were playing in a tourney, his stack size was 1200 mine was 1500Blinds were 30/60 Preflop he raised to 150, UTG, me and another guy called. On the flop he bet around 500.

so here you would prefer to check/ fold in his situation on a fairly safe flop?

[jimmybaker04 0]

I won't go into to much details, but here it is.I call a raise with QQ preflop, just me and villan to a flop of 7c 4c 2d. Being first to act villan bets the pot which is about 37% of his stack. If I double the raise I would only have a few chips left so I move all in. He calls with AK no club. Of couse the K hits the river. I say my usual bad beat whine line, "I wish one time I could play that dumb and get it rewarded." The guy's respones was, "Shut up, I had to call, I committed myself to the pot." LOL EXACTLY

When you called his raise pre-flop, your(anyone's) most likely holdings are two big unpaired cards. Therefor, he can reason that the flop missed both of you, and he still has the best of it. It was an unfortunate hand for you, but I wouldn't say that given the situation that his play was that donkish.He is really a 3-1 dog against your hand, but if he considers your possible holdings, which would certainly include a big club draw, I think he is justified in calling, and sitting in your shoes, you should want him to call there. It just didn't work out this time.

[jimmybaker04 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

I concur he's shortstacked and the play isn't horid. I would like to see the pf action though. How much did he raise?And stop w/ the bad beat whine lines

We were playing in a tourney, his stack size was 1200 mine was 1500Blinds were 30/60 Preflop he raised to 150, UTG, me and another guy called. On the flop he bet around 500.

A. Reraise with QQ, He doesnt put you on a big PP when you call the raise preflop.B. Bad Beat forum is too your left.

Re-raising pre-flop is likely not going to help you from getting sucked out on. He will commit himself more to the pot, and may even re-raise all-in pre-flop. I much prefer to call rather than re-raise here with QQ since we have position.

[jimmybaker04 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

I concur he's shortstacked and the play isn't horid. I would like to see the pf action though. How much did he raise?And stop w/ the bad beat whine lines

We were playing in a tourney, his stack size was 1200 mine was 1500Blinds were 30/60 Preflop he raised to 150, UTG, me and another guy called. On the flop he bet around 500.

A. Reraise with QQ, He doesnt put you on a big PP when you call the raise preflop.B. Bad Beat forum is too your left.

Re-raising pre-flop is likely not going to help you from getting sucked out on. He will commit himself more to the pot, and may even re-raise all-in pre-flop. I much prefer to call rather than re-raise here with QQ since we have position.

Scratch that...I thought we were HU. You saw a flop in a four way pot with QQ and did not take the lead pre-flop?! HUGE mistake.

[SLEEPYCHIEF 0]

did you post this to make a point? 37% is pretty damn specific for not getting into details. Regardless, this is pretty close. What is he supposed to when he's playing that short stacked?

I concur he's shortstacked and the play isn't horid. I would like to see the pf action though. How much did he raise?And stop w/ the bad beat whine lines

We were playing in a tourney, his stack size was 1200 mine was 1500Blinds were 30/60 Preflop he raised to 150, UTG, me and another guy called. On the flop he bet around 500.

A. Reraise with QQ, He doesnt put you on a big PP when you call the raise preflop.B. Bad Beat forum is too your left.

Re-raising pre-flop is likely not going to help you from getting sucked out on. He will commit himself more to the pot, and may even re-raise all-in pre-flop. I much prefer to call rather than re-raise here with QQ since we have position.

Scratch that...I thought we were HU. You saw a flop in a four way pot with QQ and did not take the lead pre-flop?! HUGE mistake.

He raised I called, and another guy called. I don't mine taking flops as I like to see alot of them, plus if I reraise preflop, he's proabaly moving in, and I hate racing for large amounts unless I have too

[Scott3705 0]

Alright, i've finally decided (at the risk of sounding like a donk because you clearly thought he was) that this is not a bad play on his part. A case can be made for checking this flop as it is four ways and he's likely to be beaten, but raising is not bad here and he does commit himself (especially when you consider tournament equity). And like i said before, he's only got 20 bets. I really believe you have to be very aggressive in tournaments with stacks this short.I would like to know what exactly about this is so donkish to you. If it's not optimal, it's definately not completely on the other side of the fence IMO.

[jimmybaker04 0]

Alright, i've finally decided (at the risk of sounding like a donk because you clearly thought he was) that this is not a bad play on his part. A case can be made for checking this flop as it is four ways and he's likely to be beaten, but raising is not bad here and he does commit himself (especially when you consider tournament equity). And like i said before, he's only got 20 bets. I really believe you have to be very aggressive in tournaments with stacks this short.I would like to know what exactly about this is so donkish to you. If it's not optimal, it's definately not completely on the other side of the fence IMO.

Bad on who's part? The villain or hero? IMO there are two plays that are poor in this hand:1) Hero just calling to see a four way flop with QQ2) Villain making a pot sized continuation bet/bluff into a flop seen by four players.My main problem with the hero's play is that he has taken a top 3 hand and turned it into a hand where he has to hope for trips or a trash flop.

[Merby 3]

I read the onriginal post... got confused and reread the post.Just to be sure, I read it a third time as well as a selection of some of the OP's responses to comments.Since you have posted this in NLHE strat section, I will give you advice:Your choosing to not reraise pre-flop made things more complicated. I would have reraised, myself, but I understand the motivation behind setting the trap. Just don't complain when the trap catches you and not your opponent.You did, however make one big mistake in this hand: you mis-posted this in the NLHE strat section and not the Bad Beat forum.

[Scott3705 0]

Bad on who's part? The villain or hero? IMO there are two plays that are poor in this hand:1) Hero just calling to see a four way flop with QQ2) Villain making a pot sized continuation bet/bluff into a flop seen by four players.My main problem with the hero's play is that he has taken a top 3 hand and turned it into a hand where he has to hope for trips or a trash flop.

Hero. i was just commented on how the OP thought that his play was awful. the continuation bet can go either way here. He's got 2 people left to act. None of them have shown strength and the flop likely hit no one. I lean toward feeling that it's a mistake, but if it is, it's not a huge one.

[SLEEPYCHIEF 0]

Bad on who's part? The villain or hero? IMO there are two plays that are poor in this hand:1) Hero just calling to see a four way flop with QQ2) Villain making a pot sized continuation bet/bluff into a flop seen by four players.My main problem with the hero's play is that he has taken a top 3 hand and turned it into a hand where he has to hope for trips or a trash flop.

Hero. i was just commented on how the OP thought that his play was awful. the continuation bet can go either way here. He's got 2 people left to act. None of them have shown strength and the flop likely hit no one. I lean toward feeling that it's a mistake, but if it is, it's not a huge one.

Here's the point. The guy said it wasn't a bad play cuz he committed himself to the pot. By committing yourself to a pot with only 2 overs for all ur money when it is not necessary, is a horrible play. Why I don't reraise with QQ here, is cuz people expect it. I pride myself on being an excellent post flop player, so I don't like sticking in alot of money preflop with a marginal hand like QQ. Yes Marginal, QQ is only somewhat better then JJ, and we all know how well JJ plays right

[Scott3705 0]

 Here's the point.  The guy said it wasn't a bad play cuz he committed himself to the pot.  By committing yourself to a pot with only 2 overs for all ur money when it is not necessary, is a horrible play.  Why I don't reraise with QQ here, is cuz people expect it.  I pride myself on being an excellent post flop player, so I don't like sticking in alot of money preflop with a marginal hand like QQ.  Yes Marginal, QQ is only somewhat better then JJ, and we all know how well JJ plays right

I'd really like other people's opinion here. I know that this is the NL section and not the tournament section and short stacked poker is usually not what we discuss. However, sitting with 20BB's in a tournament like this, are continuation bets completely out of the question on a ragged board? Going through what i think my thought process would be, 1. That flop really didn't hit anyone a bet will probably take this down. maybe even a medium pair will fold believing me for a big pair.2. There's only 2 people left behind me to act. They had position on me and decided not to reraise. I can probablyremove any Big PP. JJ-AA. maybe 10-10 99 will call me.3. The only real hands I'm worried about 10 10, 99, 77, 44, 22.4. Whoops.... there are three people seeing this flop. I'm probably going to get a call.I likely check here for point 4. But I really do not think betting is horrible. that pot is pretty big.