the best hand i've played all year?

[econ_tim 0]

PokerStars 2/4 Hold'em (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cxPreflop: econ_tim is SB with Q:diamond:, K:diamond:. 1 fold, econ_tim calls.Flop: (9 SB) A:club:, 7:spade:, 8:club: (2 players)econ_tim checks, MP bets, MP calls.Turn: (6.50 BB) 5:heart: (2 players)econ_tim bets, MP folds.Final Pot: 7.50 BBvillain is TAG

[TJ_Eckleburg 0]

Sexy.I always like the multi-stage bluff. The trick is not liking it too much so that it's still effective.

[screech 0]

I think it's a spew. You're risking 4 to win 11 in the hopes he folds a hand like TT. I just don't see it happening often enough.Another thing to consider is that when he calls the flop raise, he often intends to call the turn too. Do you fire again on the river too? Or is the turn the last bet you put in the pot?

[econ_tim 0]

I think it's a spew. You're risking 4 to win 11 in the hopes he folds a hand like TT. I just don't see it happening often enough.

I'm not always risking 4 to 11. I'll fold the flop if he three bets me, which I think will happen often enough given the board texture.

Another thing to consider is that when he calls the flop raise, he often intends to call the turn too. Do you fire again on the river too? Or is the turn the last bet you put in the pot?

The river decision is tough. I didn't have this move in mind preflop and I was just going to c/f the flop, but then I saw how big the pot. I also could put villain on a pretty tight range of hands (AA-TT AKs-AJs AK-AQ) and he might not even cap preflop with the weaker aces. A lot of his hands hate an A flopping (especially if he's considering the I 3-bet from the SB).

[screech 0]

I'm not always risking 4 to 11. I'll fold the flop if he three bets me, which I think will happen often enough given the board texture.

Do you think he ever folds straight away to your flop raise? If not, you always risk at least 4 to win 11. Sometimes you risk 2 to win 0.I just don't see KK/QQ folding here. Especially at 6-max. You might fold a hand like JJ-99, but even those hands will occassionally look you up.If you get called on the turn, you're almost always getting called on the river. I don't think you should bluff the river.

[econ_tim 0]

Do you think he ever folds straight away to your flop raise?

I don't expect that to happen very often at all, but it is probably better than the line he took. His play might make sense for some medium pair that has one club.

I just don't see KK/QQ folding here.

If you are the Villain holding KK or QQ, what is your play? I guess call down. But a lot of people trying to be TAG will fold here too often.

If you get called on the turn, you're almost always getting called on the river. I don't think you should bluff the river.

I agree.As a final thought on the river, I probably have outs if he calls the turn, so I can c/c (bad idea?) when a K or Q hits on the river.

[screech 0]

If you are the Villain holding KK or QQ, what is your play? I guess call down. But a lot of people trying to be TAG will fold here too often.

That's true. A lot of people with TAGish stats play way too weak. I would want to know that this guy is a weak TAG before making this play. If he hasn't shown the ability to pride himself on tough laydowns, I think it becomes costly in the long run.

As a final thought on the river, I probably have outs if he calls the turn, so I can c/c (bad idea?) when a K or Q hits on the river.

Yeah. This seems like the best line to me.

[mrdannyg 274]

firstly , i think check/calling a K or Q river is fine. he definitely 3-bets the flop or raises the turn with an ace, so on the river his range is TT-KK. check/calling a K or Q is good, although a bet/fold might work better i don't like this hand particularly for a few reasons, mainly you have basically no draws, it was capped preflop and it's at 6-max.but i do like this type of play on an ace-high board.akishore inspired me to insert this play into my repertoire in very specific situations. i'll usually do it when i've raised preflop, but after the flop it is multi-way and out of position. when i miss the flop completely with my overcards, i'll check and essentially give up on the hand. but if it gets checked around to the person last to act (occasionally the second last if he's a spewer) and he is not super-passive, i will often CR.the play works alright since a lot of players, especially bad TAGs will play the hand the same way if they have an overpair, so even though we wouldn't do that, our opponents don't know that.but i think in the right circumstances, it is a good play. often the CR wins the pot outright, and a turn bet often takes it. i check/fold the river UI.

[Actuary 3]

TAG's are often just TA or TAP's that fold too much.Some TAG's are TAG's because they bet/raise all the timeGood to know which one you're dealing with.Wouldn't an Ace lead the flop?

[mrdannyg 274]

TAG's are often just TA or TAP's that fold too much.Some TAG's are TAG's because they bet/raise all the timeGood to know which one you're dealing with.Wouldn't an Ace lead the flop?

that is probably the best description of my play i've ever heard. (the TA, no TAP)